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#1015851 - 10/17/19 08:41 AM New Net Pens in PA
RUNnGUN Offline
Spawner

Registered: 12/06/07
Posts: 926
Tribes are involved now. Wonder what conflicts or competition will arise between them now?

https://www.knkx.org/post/cooke-aquacult...fish-salish-sea
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"After fishing for Steelhead for over 40 years, Steelheading as I know it is gone in Puget Sound!"
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#1015870 - 10/17/19 11:10 AM Re: New Net Pens in PA [Re: RUNnGUN]
OLD FB Offline
Juvenile at Sea

Registered: 09/05/14
Posts: 188
Loc: Stanwood WA
"The latest and GREATEST new equipment" Where have I heard this before....Please....

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#1015873 - 10/17/19 11:23 AM Re: New Net Pens in PA [Re: RUNnGUN]
Larry B Offline
River Nutrients

Registered: 10/22/09
Posts: 2743
Loc: University Place and Whidbey I...
Will those hatchery fish be fin clipped so that when they escape they will be harvestable by all fishers? (sarcasm intended)
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#1015874 - 10/17/19 11:30 AM Re: New Net Pens in PA [Re: RUNnGUN]
stonefish Offline
King of the Beach

Registered: 12/11/02
Posts: 4673
Loc: Carkeek Park
Native steelhead don't live in net pens......
SF
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#1015876 - 10/17/19 11:36 AM Re: New Net Pens in PA [Re: RUNnGUN]
FleaFlickr02 Offline
River Nutrients

Registered: 10/28/09
Posts: 2897
I don't get it. How does the Tribe benefit from net pen fish? Are they just entering into a business partnership with Cooke for a share of the profits from fish sales?

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#1015882 - 10/17/19 11:58 AM Re: New Net Pens in PA [Re: RUNnGUN]
RUNnGUN Offline
Spawner

Registered: 12/06/07
Posts: 926
I think the Steelhead must be similar to ones raised below Grand Coulee in Rufas Woods Res. Those are what we see in local stores. The Colville Tribe started that operation and then sold it to the current owners Pacific Seafoods, who upgraded all the pens. Caught many big fish there when the pens would break open, releasing 5-10#ers. It was a gas on a 5wt. They were fed with shrimp pellets and were so fat they were best smoked.
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"After fishing for Steelhead for over 40 years, Steelheading as I know it is gone in Puget Sound!"
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#1015904 - 10/17/19 02:11 PM Re: New Net Pens in PA [Re: FleaFlickr02]
Larry B Offline
River Nutrients

Registered: 10/22/09
Posts: 2743
Loc: University Place and Whidbey I...
Originally Posted By: FleaFlickr02
I don't get it. How does the Tribe benefit from net pen fish? Are they just entering into a business partnership with Cooke for a share of the profits from fish sales?


That would be a reasonable assumption especially given the tribal comment about not enough revenue from catching fish. And if tribes participate it is a way around the recent State ban on new permits.
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It's the person who has done nothing who is sure nothing can be done. (Ewing)

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#1015909 - 10/17/19 03:03 PM Re: New Net Pens in PA [Re: RUNnGUN]
OncyT Offline
Returning Adult

Registered: 02/06/08
Posts: 443
They didn't need any tribe to participate to get around a state ban on new permits. There is only a ban, effective in 2022, on producing nonnative finfish. Having a tribe as a partner though, does eliminate one possible entity that might object to the permit.

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#1015912 - 10/17/19 03:47 PM Re: New Net Pens in PA [Re: RUNnGUN]
bushbear Offline
River Nutrients

Registered: 08/26/02
Posts: 4616
Loc: Sequim
Last I heard was that they are considering steelhead and sablefish/ black cod

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#1015917 - 10/17/19 04:21 PM Re: New Net Pens in PA [Re: RUNnGUN]
spokey9 Offline
Juvenile at Sea

Registered: 05/30/02
Posts: 209
Loc: Ravenden, AR
If one tribe sees a profit or any benefit at all, then you'll see every other tribe claim "rights" to do the same too


Edited by spokey9 (10/17/19 04:24 PM)
Edit Reason: fat fingers
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#1015919 - 10/17/19 04:53 PM Re: New Net Pens in PA [Re: bushbear]
OncyT Offline
Returning Adult

Registered: 02/06/08
Posts: 443
Originally Posted By: bushbear
Last I heard was that they are considering steelhead and sablefish/ black cod

That's what the attached KNKX article seems to imply when they say "Now, Cooke is back with plans to farm two native species in its pens in Port Angeles Harbor." Their application is only for RBT/Steelhead though.

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#1015920 - 10/17/19 04:56 PM Re: New Net Pens in PA [Re: spokey9]
OncyT Offline
Returning Adult

Registered: 02/06/08
Posts: 443
Originally Posted By: spokey9
If one tribe sees a profit or any benefit at all, then you'll see every other tribe claim "rights" to do the same too

This is not a treaty rights issue. Several tribes have been involved with shellfish and finfish aquaculture for a long time without any others claiming what I suspect you are suggesting would be new rights.

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#1015942 - 10/17/19 09:52 PM Re: New Net Pens in PA [Re: OncyT]
Larry B Offline
River Nutrients

Registered: 10/22/09
Posts: 2743
Loc: University Place and Whidbey I...
Originally Posted By: OncyT
Originally Posted By: spokey9
If one tribe sees a profit or any benefit at all, then you'll see every other tribe claim "rights" to do the same too

This is not a treaty rights issue. Several tribes have been involved with shellfish and finfish aquaculture for a long time without any others claiming what I suspect you are suggesting would be new rights.



I am sure that there will be more as the story unfolds but right now I have to wonder why Cooke is involving a tribe if there is not some tribal/treaty right benefit to the prospective project.
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It's the person who has done nothing who is sure nothing can be done. (Ewing)

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#1015950 - 10/18/19 06:49 AM Re: New Net Pens in PA [Re: RUNnGUN]
Carcassman Offline
River Nutrients

Registered: 11/21/07
Posts: 5523
Loc: Olema,California,Planet Earth
Support rather than opposition. It was the local Tribes that were very involved in the "cleanup" of the Atlantic escape. Commercial net pen operations are a direct economic threat to their commercial fishing in addition to ecological issues.

Many Tribes have aquaculture programs of some sort. This would be a business decision. What major watersheds do the Jamestown's have to produce salmon? I believe that the only major one is the Dungeness, and it is not putting out much.

I know many here, and all around the WA, are not happy with Tribal involvement in resource management but in my experience they do tend to represent a ecologically-based, long-term view. Still in it for the money, but money over generations and not the next election, which is what now passes for long-range planning.

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#1015957 - 10/18/19 08:24 AM Re: New Net Pens in PA [Re: Carcassman]
Larry B Offline
River Nutrients

Registered: 10/22/09
Posts: 2743
Loc: University Place and Whidbey I...
Originally Posted By: Carcassman
Support rather than opposition.


Four simple words that no doubt go straight to the issue. One only needs to look at the permit debacle over the single lane ramp at Point No Point to realize the extent to which tribal influence has expanded.

It's been over five years that permit application has been on a desk at the USACE; even Judge Judy let's the process move forward in a timely manner.
_________________________
Remember to immediately record your catch or you may become the catch!

It's the person who has done nothing who is sure nothing can be done. (Ewing)

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#1015958 - 10/18/19 08:54 AM Re: New Net Pens in PA [Re: RUNnGUN]
darth baiter Offline
Parr

Registered: 04/04/10
Posts: 69
Loc: United States
Cooke knows that involving a tribal partnership in their operation hamstrings the state in having direct regulation authority and ease of saying no. Cooke's chances of getting a net pen approved by themselves is probably zip; either the state says no or another tribe says no. Involving a tribe addresses both of these.

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#1016019 - 10/18/19 06:22 PM Re: New Net Pens in PA [Re: Larry B]
RUNnGUN Offline
Spawner

Registered: 12/06/07
Posts: 926
Originally Posted By: Larry B
Originally Posted By: Carcassman
Support rather than opposition.


Four simple words that no doubt go straight to the issue. One only needs to look at the permit debacle over the single lane ramp at Point No Point to realize the extent to which tribal influence has expanded.

It's been over five years that permit application has been on a desk at the USACE; even Judge Judy let's the process move forward in a timely manner.


Side tracked...No doubt tribal influence is happening w/ in the state political arena more than ever. No wonder the WDFW is powerless when their bosses have been bought off by the tribes. The more $$ they get from the casino's, that are not taxed by the way, the more they can buy. At some point their will be a break even point when the citizens of this state have less say with their vote than the tribes have to say w/ their buck .I think I've been watching to much Yellowstone.
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"After fishing for Steelhead for over 40 years, Steelheading as I know it is gone in Puget Sound!"
ME

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#1016035 - 10/19/19 01:36 PM Re: New Net Pens in PA [Re: OncyT]
spokey9 Offline
Juvenile at Sea

Registered: 05/30/02
Posts: 209
Loc: Ravenden, AR
Originally Posted By: OncyT
Originally Posted By: spokey9
If one tribe sees a profit or any benefit at all, then you'll see every other tribe claim "rights" to do the same too

This is not a treaty rights issue. Several tribes have been involved with shellfish and finfish aquaculture for a long time without any others claiming what I suspect you are suggesting would be new rights.



He treaties don't really matter up there anymore...The tribes done bought the state government and the treaties just allow the feds to be essentially tribal legal counsel. Anything they get involved in becomes a "right" because frankly nobody tells them no and a precedent gets set.
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#1016036 - 10/19/19 01:38 PM Re: New Net Pens in PA [Re: RUNnGUN]
spokey9 Offline
Juvenile at Sea

Registered: 05/30/02
Posts: 209
Loc: Ravenden, AR
I don't recall forgone opportunity being a treaty right..but for all intensive purposes, that's exactly what it has become
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#1016037 - 10/19/19 04:40 PM Re: New Net Pens in PA [Re: RUNnGUN]
Carcassman Offline
River Nutrients

Registered: 11/21/07
Posts: 5523
Loc: Olema,California,Planet Earth
Foregone opportunity came out of the Boldt decision and was first used by the State against the Tribes in the early years when the tribal fleets were smaller and could not take 50%. The state started it, the Tribes just use it now.

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