Nontraditional methods such as nymphing an egg patern with a couple split shot. Very affective but esentionally using a fly rod as a drift rod.

In my opinion its still fly fishing. Its just using a tool in a different manor to accomplish the same thing. Yes you loose the smoothness and finess.

I havent really fished successfully any other way for winter steelhead, accept using an indicator. Ive tried sink tips but havent given them a fare shot.

I plan on buying a Rio Versi tip this winter so I can become more versitile but I do enjoy fishing eggs with split shot. I do see that I am only limited to low water conditions using the indicator or split shot methods but I dont know If I would enjoy fly fishing in higher flows anyways.

I have been very successful using these methods, I caught more steelies on my fly rod last year than my gear rods.

Anyways what do ya think chuck and duckin or fly fishin?

Nothing like a little debate to get this sucker roleing.

Rich-
I do it all...and I really do not care how one fishes as long as they exhibit good ethics for the fish, the river and their fellow fishermen.

For me, it all depends on my mood and the water that I am fishing.

Some water just is not condusive to swinging a fly yet it holds fish...lots of fish so I will utilize probally the ultimate chuck 'n' duck method and yet other water is not effectively fished in that manner...which is most.

Plus, I usually have brought enough fish to hand by the middle of July employing chuck'n'duck methods that I spend the rest of the summer and fall chasing after fish with the floating line and traditional methods.

Catch rates may go down but I still do well enough to keep my urges in check...

Same idea in the winter as well...just whatever mood I am in and whatever method is most condusive to the water that I am fishing.

I don't really label anyone. I've fished most methods out there at one time or another. But I have a few thoughts though. When it comes to fly fishing, I add no extra scents except the natural that occur off materials used/my hands.

BUt when I fly fish, I either use a floating line or a sinking line. No split shot, no SI's. I either use dries on a floating, submerging/subsurface on a floating, or a wetfly swing on a sinktip. I won't use the SI's anymore (though I showed Sparkey the ones I used to use for fly fishing and the ones I still use for small jigs) nor will I use split shots. They're good training tools, but I like a bit more of a challenge. If I want to use an SI, I grab my jig rod and throw jigs. If I want split shots, I use my drift gear.

But to each their own. Some guys protest about guys using trebles (I used to love to use them but won't now thanks to regs). But, what do most guys in UK use (fly wise)? Alot use double/treble fly hooks. I know a few of the UK fly swaps I've hosted have sent me their "secret" flies since I'm rarely gonna fish their rivers, and all have been trebles.

To each their own though. What is one man's displeasure is another man's joy. I know I use weighted flies, but there are guys who totally get in disgust if people use them. So be it. It's all opinion. Take it for what it's worth.

By the way, got some nice kings, fair hooked and aggresively taken on the fly on my vacation in mid October. What a rush. Plus some silvers to boot.

Call me unethical, non-traditional, whatever...I'm going with whatever works (aka Chuckn'Duck). I'll carry three rods on a float just to cover whatever comes up. Most of the time I resort to the 12 foot 7 wt and the BOBBER!!!! Proud member of "Spark's Bobber Brigade". Used the s.i method and my 11'3'' 6wt on Utah's Green River for some of the lunker browns that rarely get fished due to the DEEP slots and structure they inhabit and had excellent success. Its whatever fits the bill for the occassion.

What I think it boils down to is evolution of technique. When the first sink tips came out the old timers would say things like "The trick is getting the fish to the fly not the fly to the fish" and were ticked by the sink tip guys. Now it is the sinktip guys calling Pooh-Pooh on the indicator/Nymph guys. I am like Sparkey I fish how I think I have the best chance of catching a fish, that fits inside the regulations. Or however I am having the most fun (chuck and duck makes the back of my head and my ears hurt after a while).

You've always been such a slow learner Vic!

Rich,

I finally realized I've no reason to debate the qualifications of fly fishing. As fly fishing tackle evolved over the last 20 - 30 years, I debated it a lot. Jokingly, I concluded that we are only really fly fishing when we use rods made of split cane, reels made in England, lines of silk, and leaders of gut. And of course, no weighted flies. That ain't gonna' win many fly fishing friends these days. Now days I figure anyone who is fishing within fly fishing only regulations or who thinks they are fly fishing, well, they must be fly fishing. Graphite rods, plastic lines embedded with powdered lead, tungsten, or cobalt. Flourocarbon leaders. Weighted flies are just about mandatory in many popular trout fisheries - nymphing the Madison, etc. Strike indicators, egads, there is no end to the sacrilege.

I still prefer swinging an unweighted fly on a now traditional plastic line (floating or sinking), mainly for the casting pleasure I derive. But I try some weighted flies and ultra-fast pieces of sink tips just to play around some times. And a friend gave me some jig hooks, and I've tried casting the 1/16 oz tied with a little marabou on my light two-handed rod. Not much different than a regular jig and bobber, I think. Heck, if it's fun and presents an interesting challenge, I've got no problem with it. As Sparkey mentioned, some water types, especially on small streams, just don't fish well to the traditional wet fly swing. So experimentation is an essential human attribute.

Sincerely,

Salmo g.