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#1022396 - 02/16/20 07:12 PM WDFW Commission; The discussion
Bay wolf Offline
Repeat Spawner

Registered: 10/26/12
Posts: 1057
Loc: Graham, WA
I don't think there is any doubt that the WDFW Commission is missing the mark in some ways. So, perhaps it's time to re-look at just what we should expect from our Commissioner's.

What do we really know about the actual selection and appointment process that gives us the people who are supposed to represent us, and supervise the department?

I posted this in another thread, but thought it worth repeating here:

So, let me ask you all these questions.

1. How many of you actually know how many people applied for the last Commission positions?

2. How many of you actually saw the names of everyone who applied, saw their backgrounds and qualifications?

3. Who amongst us attended an open meeting where the candidates were introduced and where we got to ask them questions?

4. How many of you even know how the selection process works?

Are we supposed to blindly accept the Governors choice for the "best" person to represent us?

I'd really like to hear from everyone about this.

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#1022399 - 02/16/20 08:24 PM Re: WDFW Commission; The discussion [Re: Bay wolf]
bushbear Offline
River Nutrients

Registered: 08/26/02
Posts: 4667
Loc: Sequim
Copied my post from the Tangle Net post


Bay Wolf and Great Bender posed some questions that, from my perspective as a recent applicant for a Commission seat, need to be answered. If a vacancy occurs, the seat is supposed to be filled within 60 days.

1. I heard 13 to 14 names might have been on the list. I don’t know when they applied. I was told that some names are on pretty much a “standing list” for appointments to Commissions and Boards.

2. Applications were going to close around February 15 per Keith Swenson, Director of the Governor's Office of Boards and Commissions, and a decision was expected to be made "soon".

3. I only saw one application....mine, submitted on February 14 for the "at-large" position.

4. I had follow-up contacts with Mr. Swenson on March 21 and 29 when I was advised that no decisions would be made until after the legislative session was over. The 2019 Legislative session ended April 28. A subsequent contact with Mr. Swenson, on April 2, set up a meeting on April 11 to discuss my application.

5. On April 11, I had a meeting lasting a little over an hour Mr. Swenson at the Batdorf & Bronson Coffee Roasters in Olympia.

6. Subsequent email contacts, asking if decision had been made, with Mr. Swenson were done on May 10, June 7, June 21, July 19, and July 24.

7. On July 24, the Governor's office announced that Molly Linville and Jim Anderson had been selected as the new Commissioners. I never received a contact from Mr. Swenson as to the decision having been made.

If you want to get a sense of the process, here is a link to the Governor’s Boards and Commissions website:

https://www.governor.wa.gov/boards-commissions

I would encourage folks to read through RCW 77 – the Fish and Wildlife statutes.

https://apps.leg.wa.gov/RCW/default.aspx?cite=77

and, in particular, as to the statutes relating to Commission activities, look at:

https://app.leg.wa.gov/RCW/default.aspx?cite=77.04

and

https://app.leg.wa.gov/RCW/default.aspx?cite=77.12

The operative word in many of the statutory sections is "...shall..." not "...may...". They have the authority and need to, in my opinion, set down some operational mandates for the Director and for him to pass along to staff as required objectives to be done.

I've been working with the Commission protocols for 50 years. I've seen it work in other states and I've seen some promise in this Commission off and on over the past 20 years.

It is a political process, no doubt about it. Personally, I'd like to see some changes in the statutes as they relate to the Commission selection process. One major change is found in the Colorado statutes (CRS 33-9-101(c)) which reads:

" (c) Of the voting members appointed to the commission, there shall not be a difference of more than one person between those members affiliated with any major political party."

That would/could help remove some of the political pressure. Commissioners should be apolitical. Their first priority should be to the resource. They should not have to be concerned about potential removal should they buck the establishment on an issue.

There are four Commissioners whose terms are up this year. Carpenter on October 31, and Kehoe, Smith, and Graybill on December 31.

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#1022402 - 02/16/20 10:10 PM Re: WDFW Commission; The discussion [Re: Bay wolf]
Geoduck Offline
Returning Adult

Registered: 08/10/02
Posts: 434
The commissions unwillingness to correct incompetent leadership or worse the inability to even recognize obvious incompetence is disturbing.

After seeing the best WDFW has to offer on the Willapa bay policy, I have lost all faith in this agency. It cannot recognize even the most obvious mistakes. Also, it cannot communicate from the field to leadership in any meaningful way.

IMHO its unsalvagable. Time to start over from scratch. I think the discussion should be how do we build an agency that's scientifically responsible and at least marginally responsive to the public. WDFW is neither.
_________________________
Dig Deep!

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#1022405 - 02/17/20 09:33 AM Re: WDFW Commission; The discussion [Re: Bay wolf]
Great Bender Offline
Juvenile at Sea

Registered: 01/03/17
Posts: 155
Loc: Hood Canal
Its not at all complicated. The equation for moving forward is as follows:

Full Disclosure - Backroom Politics = Clear Transparency and Trust.

How much longer can WDFW downplay and ignore this simple concept?

The entire organization has allegedly and visibly put "transparency" at the forefront. Every communication or press release ends with their "canned' concluding paragraph extolling the virtues of open relations and cooperative intentions. The WDFW-funded production titled "Lifeblood" idolizes trust and stakeholder harmony, but to date and after several sincere attempts, has resulted in no correspondence beyond that.

Words cannot be a substitute for credible action. Our frustration and disapproval cannot be remedied with what's coming from the headquarters located in Olympia's Natural Resources Bldg.

Measure up, WDFW--and practice what you preach.

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#1022566 - 02/20/20 09:37 AM Re: WDFW Commission; The discussion [Re: Bay wolf]
Bay wolf Offline
Repeat Spawner

Registered: 10/26/12
Posts: 1057
Loc: Graham, WA
As we head into yet another North of Falcon, I'm amazed at how familiar we have all become with business as usual.

The same ol "public" meetings will be attended by the same ol people. The tired conversations and the smiles, back slapping and nodding.

Slide shows and presentations, and then the excuses and "we're" trying.

Then, again the dismal announcements that things are in the crapper and the Co-managers this, and agreements to that...

Eventually the tried and true mantra of WDFW will be sounded:" Any deal is better than no deal." (Everyone grumbles then rushes off to buy a license)

Into nauseam....

WE HAVE GOVERNOR APPOINTED PEOPLE ON THE COMMISSION, WHO'S LOYALTY GOES TO THE POWERS THAT CAN REMOVE THEM. THEY DO NOT CARE ABOUT, NOR DO THEY TRULY REPRESENT THE PEOPLE. THEY ARE PUT THERE TO PLAY NICE, GO ABOUT BUSINESS AS USUAL AND TO NOT ROCK THE BOAT.

To that end, our Commission gets high marks.

As long as we allow things to continue like they are, we are destined to be treated like we have been.


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#1022635 - 02/21/20 06:07 PM Re: WDFW Commission; The discussion [Re: Bay wolf]
Tug 3 Offline
Juvenile at Sea

Registered: 03/06/14
Posts: 136
Right on, my friend. Your last sentence says it all.

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#1022647 - 02/21/20 07:35 PM Re: WDFW Commission; The discussion [Re: Great Bender]
Rivrguy Offline
River Nutrients

Registered: 03/03/09
Posts: 3453
Loc: Somewhere on the planet,I hope
Quote:
Full Disclosure - Backroom Politics = Clear Transparency and Trust.

How much longer can WDFW downplay and ignore this simple concept?
Oh I got that one! It is because that quote defines clearly who they are.
_________________________
Dazed and confused.............the fog is closing in

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#1022797 - 02/24/20 03:59 PM Re: WDFW Commission; The discussion [Re: Bay wolf]
Bay wolf Offline
Repeat Spawner

Registered: 10/26/12
Posts: 1057
Loc: Graham, WA
An awful lot of the issues we see in our fisheries fall right in the laps of the Commission.

It's time we stop giving them a pass and chumming up to them like it's some god given privilege to be able to be in their presence.

Power un-checked can quickly breed corruption an arrogance.

The Commission is titled "A citizen Commission" for a reason. They are supposed to be OUR voice!

The recreational community is unorganized, often times unable to communicate in unity and for the most part dysfunctional as a unit. But we number in the hundreds of thousands and have the right to be represented by people who truly have our best interest at heart.

Todays Commissioners play politics, special interest and "good ol boy" cronyism rather than doing what's right by their constituents.

It's time we hold them accountable and start to take a real role in the appointment process rather than be passive by-standers who hope the Governor is appointing people with our interests at heart. We all know where the Governor's loyalty lay, so why would his appointed minions be any different?

Recent actions are proof positive they are NOT representing us, but rather providing cover for the Department and special interest groups.
_________________________
"Forgiveness is between them and God. My job is to arrange the meeting."

1Sgt U.S. Army (Ret)

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#1024754 - 03/11/20 07:21 PM Re: WDFW Commission; The discussion [Re: Bay wolf]
Bay wolf Offline
Repeat Spawner

Registered: 10/26/12
Posts: 1057
Loc: Graham, WA
How many of you know that our illustrious Commission Chairmen, Larry Carpenter was one of the original "observers" that were hand picked by Phil Anderson and the tribes. Of course, then got thrown out!

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#1024788 - 03/11/20 09:01 PM Re: WDFW Commission; The discussion [Re: Bay wolf]
ondarvr Offline
Repeat Spawner

Registered: 09/07/05
Posts: 1185
Loc: Spokane WA
I remember him discussing it and saying he had a very good reputation and relationship with the tribes, this is why he was allowed in.
_________________________
"You may live ondarvr but that doesn't mean you owndarvr." - Fish Prince

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#1024836 - 03/11/20 11:25 PM Re: WDFW Commission; The discussion [Re: Bay wolf]
Bay wolf Offline
Repeat Spawner

Registered: 10/26/12
Posts: 1057
Loc: Graham, WA
“But I guess in closing, I do think openness and transparency is probably a very, very healthy thing,” added Carpenter, who is the vice chair and a Skagit Valley boat dealer. “And hopefully we can achieve more in 2017.”

Hey Larry, you said this back in 2017! It's 2020 and you still haven't done a damn thing to end the secrets, and NOW YOU'RE CHAIRMEN! ANSWER THE LETTER, WE CAN'T WAIT TO HEAR YOUR EXCUSE

Meanwhile, in the back room, the recreational angler is once again bent over the barrel...


Trust em, they got your back

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#1024844 - 03/12/20 06:49 AM Re: WDFW Commission; The discussion [Re: Bay wolf]
RUNnGUN Offline
Repeat Spawner

Registered: 12/06/07
Posts: 1042
How about making the Commission an elected position, responsible to the people?
_________________________
"After fishing for Steelhead for over 45 years, Steelheading as I know it is gone in Puget Sound!"
ME

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#1024852 - 03/12/20 07:33 AM Re: WDFW Commission; The discussion [Re: RUNnGUN]
Tug 3 Offline
Juvenile at Sea

Registered: 03/06/14
Posts: 136
I think electing commissioners or a single commissioner to run the agency is an idea whose time has come. DNR has an elected leader and it is also an agency who manages OUR natural resources.

A single leader, or a board of commissioners? How about electing one each from the westside and eastside, and an at large commissioner?

Lots of political hurdles to jump, but it is time.

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#1024869 - 03/12/20 09:25 AM Re: WDFW Commission; The discussion [Re: Tug 3]
darth baiter Offline
Juvenile at Sea

Registered: 04/04/10
Posts: 101
Loc: United States
Be careful what you ask for when pushing for an elected position to run a natural resource agency. Hilary Franz, the Commissioner of Public Lands was an environmental attorney, active in conservation groups who lived on Bainbridge Island. She wasn't exactly the darling of the timber industry and didn't win a single county in eastern Washington. A nominee for WDFW could similarly get the votes from westside (seattle,King County etc) that has a non consumptive fish and wildlife perspective. Such a candidate taking the urban Puget Sound vote may not have the background to know the importance of hunting and fishing to the state. Hunters and fishers are a minority in this state.

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#1024875 - 03/12/20 10:50 AM Re: WDFW Commission; The discussion [Re: Bay wolf]
Bay wolf Offline
Repeat Spawner

Registered: 10/26/12
Posts: 1057
Loc: Graham, WA
Rather than an elected leader, or group, how about a wide open and fully in the public selection process?

Right now, the process is anything but transparent. The only information on candidates are buried in obscure files and is not at all easy to access. And then, all the public can do for input is to send a letter of endorsement if they happen to know someone who is a candidate.

NOW THE TRUTH: In the last Commission selection, do you know how many people applied for the two positions? Do you know who they all were? Did you see their names and qualifications anywhere?

Even if you could have possibly found this information somewhere, it made no difference at all. WHY? Because at least one of the persons who was selected, hadn't even put his application in until AFTER the end date on the announcement. And, there were no public meetings, no public input period, no public discussions on who the best candidate was. JT Austin from the Governors office sent an email to Keith Swensen who is in charge of Commissions and TOLD HIM WHO TO APPOINT.

So you see. Even though we are fed a bunch of Bullchit about the Commissioners being OUR representatives, they are there to do the Governors bidding, or better yet, to insure things stay away from the Governor.

ANY WONDER NOTHING IS BEING DONE TO FORCE THE NWIFC TO OPEN THE MEETINGS?

Follow the money, right....Casion to Governor to Commission to Casino

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#1025176 - 03/13/20 11:25 AM Re: WDFW Commission; The discussion [Re: Bay wolf]
Bay wolf Offline
Repeat Spawner

Registered: 10/26/12
Posts: 1057
Loc: Graham, WA
DAY 5 AND STILL NO RESPONSE FROM WDFW COMMISSION CHAIR LARRY CARPENTER ON OUR LETTER.

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#1025182 - 03/13/20 11:42 AM Re: WDFW Commission; The discussion [Re: Bay wolf]
darth baiter Offline
Juvenile at Sea

Registered: 04/04/10
Posts: 101
Loc: United States
What did your letter ask?

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#1025183 - 03/13/20 11:54 AM Re: WDFW Commission; The discussion [Re: darth baiter]
Bay wolf Offline
Repeat Spawner

Registered: 10/26/12
Posts: 1057
Loc: Graham, WA
Originally Posted By: darth baiter
What did your letter ask?




"We would like your timely response to the following questions:

Why can’t the major Co-manager/Department harvest sharing discussions be broadcast live, as was just done for the forecast meeting?

What recent efforts have you undertaken to resolve the issue of having no citizen observers in these harvest sharing negotiations?

Who is responsible for the continued prohibition of citizen(s) from attending these harvest sharing negotiations as observers?"

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