I guess I shouldn't complain about getting my toes stepped on, after all I was the one who threw my dance card on the floor.
Hey all, let clarify what I said and suggested.
I never said lets give up our rights. In fact I said just the opposite.
I said I don't want to abrogate anyones right against unlawful search and seizure.
I don't advocate legally prescribing greater power to our fish and wildlife officers.
I don't want to get involved in what you do in the privacy of your home.
I expressed that I didn't have much trouble voluntarily conceeding some of my rights while fishing if that would help protect the resource. AND I suggested that if you had nothing to fear discovery of, then you had nothing to fear from voluntarily complying with a search.
***Individualized Responses ***
If I have only fishing paraphernalia on me, then the obvious reason to search me is for game violations. I said I was OK with being searched. I didn't say you had to be OK with being searched.
The entire key to this thread was 'is it OK to search a particular boat.' I don't have the answer to that, because as they say, "it assumes facts not yet in evidence"
The entire key to this thread for me was to express a manner in which we may lessen some of the apparent fear and hostility towards our fish and wildlife officers and make the whole process work towards the good of our sport.
I would like to go fishing more, but no matter how hard I try, over the years I have only been able to average about 150 days on the water a year. This last year wasn't quite up to snuff in that regards, but having 4 kids, 8 to 1 (for an old fart I guess I'm not shooting too many blanks
) and a wife that wasn't up to par, made it a little difficult to shuck the whole thing and grab a rod.
In that vein, if you feel like sharing,if any of that Cowlitz River water is any good for fly fishing maybe we can hook up on the water sometime.
I haven't advocated giving up any of our rights, only voluntarily conceeding on one of them while fishing.
Concerning the elephant illustration. Two big game guides are looking at a guy smashed flat in a tent. The first one says, 'What happened?', The second one replied. 'He thought by keeping the trunk out he could keep the elephant out. What he didn't realize is that closing the tent flap wouldn't necessarily keep him from getting squished.'
At what point do we balance the protection of our rights against the loss of our privileges?
Are we going to see a catch and release fishery on any of the S-rivers this spring?
You mention ethics and making sure those in authority don't abuse our constitutional rights that many have given their lives to defend. I agree 100%. I spent my time in the service, and was medically discharged with a bum leg for it. I know what men have given up to protect our freedoms, and I have given so little as compared to some.
But as a matter of principal how can you say the above about ethics and principal and yet a couple of posts up you suggest lying about the situation you find yourself in. It doesn't wash to me. Ethics is like a chain, it doesn't matter which link is broken, the chain is still broken.
I didn't say we should let someone violate our rights, I suggested voluntarily conceeding one for a while, like while on the water.
I was pretty sure it was just an example, I just wanted everyone to know where I'm NOT coming from.
Hey at my age I do so know what pot is, it's what I don't have to piss in.
I think the statement 'to reason that if I'm not doing anything wrong, I shouldn't worry' is goofy, is what's goofy. Tell me if I'm not doing anything wrong what have I to fear?
Also nowhere did I suggest we put a government agent your house, your business, your car, well yes your car but only long enough to ensure that you aren't cheating the rest of us by fishing unethically.
Yes, I get just as frustrated by the zillion game violations I have witness that aren't written up. But what do we do about that? It's not always possible to just whip out the ol' cell phone and touch them Ma Bell style.
I certainly would be the last to condone perjury. Especially by an officer of the court. However, by your own admission you were in the fix you were in because you didn't take the time to make sure before you went fishing. The way to avoid this situation, and it goes for all of us, it to make sure we know the regs for the water we are going to fish, before we get there.
I am always amazed at the posts on this and other boards where someone will ask, Is it OK to fish for this fish, in this water, in this way right now and by the way how many can I keep. (not directed at you RT) why not get the regs and make sure that someone isn't giving us incorrect information.
I don't want to see anybody break the rules to facilitate accomplishing their agenda, certainly not to the point where they violate your rights.
I can guarantee you that I am not too weak willed to take a stand. And seeing as how I was the first one in this thread to pretty much state directly that 'if you don't do anything wrong, then you have nothing to hide' I take a little umbrage that you make the generalization you do without knowing me.
No, having a badge and a gun does not make cops superior to us. But having duly constituted law behind them should make us at least repect their postion.
No you don't have the reason to look in my boat just because you want to. You don't have the authority to enforce anything. But if a game officer asks to inspect my equipment, I can say with a certainty, because I have nothing to hide, I have nothing to fear and will let them inspect to their hearts content.
I agree intrusions into your privacy as a private citizen without just cause is not acceptable.
The only problem with a 'thorough and accurate' investigation into game violations is that by the time they get started the fish is 'HOME' in the freezer. The same 'HOME' that I don't want to see subjected to unlawful search and seizure.
What I think we all ought to work towards is ensuring that the abusive behavior is stopped on the water or bank before it has a chance to get 'HOME'.
***End Individualized Responses***
Anyway I'm tired, I won't convert anyone, and I'm not really trying too.
I will continue to fish and be pretty relaxed about it.
Thanks for the discourse, it was enlightning.
Good Luck to all on the water this year.
Cordially and Respectfully