I want to get a new steelhead flyrod for mostly summer and occasional winter steelhead fishing and would like to get some suggestions from experienced fly fishers here. Some of the places I plan to fish are Deschutes, Umpqua, Santiam and McKenzie River. What length and weight rod would be appropriate?

I like the 9'6" 8WT.
The longer length helps mend / control the line better and for the bigger river you can get that extra distance.
I know a lot of guys prefer the 7Wt for the summer runs.

Ditto, IMO, If you are looking for a "dual service rod" 8wt 9 1/2', the extra weight and length will pay benefits on rivers such as the D when the wind kicks up and the casting situations you will encounter on the U, unless you want to consider a double hander.

I'd decide how bad you want to fish for winter runs with the same rod. An 8 is the best compromise, but a 7 would be more comfortable and very capable for floating lines and summer steelhead. Personally, I use a (strong) 10 foot 6 wt for summers and a 9 foot 9 inch 8 weight for winters. The first time I fished the 8 wt was a long weekend of thrashing the N Umpqua. By the next week, my right elbow was in pain and my right hand swollen. It lasted almost a month! Now I only use that rod for certain pools.
Good luck.

Actually I was leaning towards a 7wt 9'6" rod but they're not very common so I may have to go with a 9' 7wt rod. I looked at some name-brand rods locally and had "sticker shocks", and realized why some call them INVESTMENTs. Not having used any of the pricy GLoomis, Sage, Orvis, St. Croix and the like, can someone help me justify their hefty price tags?

Bass Pro Shops and Cabela's offer some decent looking combo packages for around $150 to $250 which include IM-7 or IM-8 rods, cast aluminum with disc drag reel, fly line, backing, tube, etc. Has anyone used these seemingly good valued rods?

Power, Action, Weight, Warranty, Service.

I understand some of the Cabela's rods are made by decent manufacturers, but you really do get what you pay for. If you're fairly new to flyfishing, the BPS and Cabela's rods may serve you well. If you've developed tight loops and a quick, smooth casting stroke, you may be disappointed. My first fly rod was a BPS 5 wt beginner combo. It was adequate for the first year as a teaching trout fly rod, but had little power and a slower action than I now prefer. You need more power fishing for steelhead due to the length of casting, need for long line mends, weight of sinking lines/flies (for winters), and stength of fish. A reel with a powerful drag is a big plus too. Just because it's a disc doesn't mean it's strong. Some people start with one of these combo outfits and use them as a spare later when they upgrade.
Hope this helps!

I'd HIGHLY suggest the DS series fly rod by Sage. They are great rods, and I have a DS890 as a backup for my RPL.

Don't mean to knock anyone. But it's funny, I wonder how many guys are new to the sport in the past 10 years (or I guess a bit more since graphite has been readily used for awhile now). All these rods nowadays are a dream to use. My 8wt is about 50% lighter then the old fiberglass 5/6 wts I used in years past. I used to salmon/steelhead fish with a 8wt Fenwick glass rod. Could toss it all day. Used a big fenwick glass 10wt with 6" extension handle for salmon. I could throw them all day long. Once I got my first graphite was like tossing a whip around. No problems. Funny that these "8/9wt" rods are such a bear to cast all day. I guess it comes from using dinosaurs so long ago (up until fairly recently). Go figure.

But, DS you get the sage name, a wonderful rod to cast/fish, and all the benies of a Sage. I sometimes use her as my primary 8wt in fact.

I agree, you usually get what you pay for in a flyrod. Cheap usually is just that.

I would also suggest that if you go with a combo,replace the line and go with a high quality line. A lot of times those combo will give you some crappy line that will hinder your cast and mending capabilities.

I also vote for the Sage DS. I have a 9'6" 8wt and a 9' 5wt that I've been happy with. Performance is good enough for me and if I break it Sage will fix or replace it. As said above, quality line makes a huge difference.

Has anyone used St. Croix rods, especially the Pro Graphite series? They feature SC II blanks and I was curious whether they are comparable to Generation II blanks on the Sage DS series. If that's the case, there is a pretty big price difference between the two rods while both have unconditional lifetime warranty.

Also, I want a moderate fast action, but I think the Generation II and SC II blanks are moderation action. So I may have to move up to a Generation III or SC III blank rod. Being a novice fly fisher and unable to distinguish a good rod from the not so good by merely flexing them rods around at the fly shop, I appreicate all of your input.

Nymph-
I could give you a 5000 word dissertation on the best rod for steelheading fishing...or I can tell you to go to a reputible shop and have them take you out in the parking lot to throw the differnt rods you are intrested in.

If they balk...go somewhere else!!!

Two friends of mine have the Cabela's rods and like them. LL Bean also has a good mid price series of rods.

I use Sage rods, but can't convincingly say that you need to spend that kind of money. I do think you need to be looking at one of the rods in the $150 range or higher, or you're liable to get a poor stick. The cheapest rods I have cast are not worth it, IMHO. My preferred weapons are the old Sage RPLs, and the newer XPs.

For summer fish, I like a six weight in smaller rivers, seven or eight weight in bigger, windy rivers, like the Deschutes. A 10 foot rod is better for fishing, but you will need forearms of steel to fish one all day. A nine footer is probably the best rod for the occasionally fly fisher. I use 9 footers and 9 foot 6 inchers. Even that one makes my forearm hurt after a long day, and I work out with weights specifically to help that. I have tendonitis from too much golf and fly casting. I know, cry me a river. I now use a spey rod, because it doesn't make my arms hurt. But there your talking real money to get started - not recommended until you know you've really got the bug.

If you are going to try to save money, probably the best place to go cheap in the beginning is the reel. I can hear a lot of guys arguing already, but I have caught and landed too many steelhead while cutthroat fishing to think you need a fancy reel. Get one that you can palm, and you can be fine. Make sure that it's big enough to hold at least 100 yards of backing and the line you want. You can trade up to a better reel in the future.

The other way to save money is to build your rod. You can save at least 1/3 of the cost by doing this.

Take Sparkey's advice and try before you buy.

The Sage DS is a nice entry level setup and would treat you really well for summer fish. I have fished this rod some and find it a little soft for winter fishing with sinktips. That just might be my preference for faster action rods though. For single handed work, I fish a 10' Scott STS for 8.

I would also try and cast a Scott SAS. They are about the same price as the Sage, have a similar warranty and tend to be a little faster actioned.

Question for sparkey or anyone else on fly rods. The other night after a meeting Sparkey and I attended he was proclaiming the greatness of fast action Winstons. They are very nice and I own a couple fast action Winstons for winter steelheading but when I mentioned the beauty of a Winston BL5 for casting a floating 8wt double taper line he called it a noodle and drove off quickly. It would have been a whole lot of fun to talk with a experienced rod salesman as he about why so many now a days are using fast action rods. The BL5 is a soft action rod and a finess rod to cast. The beauty of the cast is part of the fishing experience.
On this post there have been mentions of sore arms, elbows and other ills such as being tired out after casting an 8wt all day. Does anyone else out there believe that it could be these fast action rods causing a lot of the injuries and not so much the wt rod? Why are so many sucked into the manufactures BS that faster is always better and power is what counts in a cast. A good soft action rod you can cast just as far and with less effort if you take the time to learn how to use it as it was intended and not try to over power it. now I'm talking about with floating line for summer steelheading.
I agree with sparky and sinktip go to your local fly shop and try out a bunch of differnt rods but try out some of the soft rods and see if you can figure out finess over power, you may find a whole new world of enjoyment and you may find you are less tired may have less sorness.
Tuna

I think the problem is that heavy sink tips and\or heavily weighted flies used for steelheading - combined with often windy conditions - and the need to do a lot of mending, roll casting, and shooting your line - the slow action less powerful rods just aren't as practicle. The general idea is to do as little false casting as possible - and maximize the amount of time your fly is being presented to a fish. After you finish the swing, just strip in a little line, do a small roll cast to get teh line out in front, and then shoot the line on the next foward cast. Not as easy to do (with any distance) with a slower rod. Now for summer fishing for trout with dries on a calm day - I'd love to have a slower action rod... my .02cents.

Since you only want to occasionally fish winter runs i'd geat up for summer runs and just sacrifice a little ability on the winter run end. I would be looking for a 10 ft 7wt as Wild Chrome suggested. I have a personal disfavor( is that a word?) for the Sage DS models. I think you can get a much better rod for less money by going with a st croix. But thats based on my experience with the DS rods. I think they are stiff and lack power, a combination I hate. I'd buy a used top of the line rod nefore i'd by a new DS or VPS for that matter. In fact the only mid range rod i would recommend as a new purchase would be the Loomis GL3.
mid range is 200-350 dollars. I just don't think the mid ranges sages are a good deal.

My first recommendation would be to look for a used 7100 sage RP or RPL ( not RPL+)
if you can't find one of thoes look for a St croix that you like and if you don't like that I'd go for the GL3

Thats my recommendations based on my opinion. But heck if you wanna spend top dollar for a rod get a CF Burkheimer..

Tuna,

I don't think fast action rods have anything to do with the injuries. I have several slow action rods as well, that I use for dry fly fishing. They hurt, too, when the elbow is acting up. As does rowing the drift boat, and drinking coffee. The tendonitis is an overuse injury. The steelhead rods cause it, and would cause it even if they were slow action rods, simply because they require more force or effort to use. The light rods don't bother me as much, the heavier ones do. My elbows start acting up when I use anything heavier than a four weight.

I think most people like fast action rods because they are easier to use for the longer casts. While an able caster can cast any rod, the faster rods seem to be a bit easier to use for most casters, based on my experience of introducing people to fly casting. I think it's due to the longer acceleration cycle required by slower rods. Slower rods require a more deliberate stroke and better timing, which is harder for beginners.

My preferred stick is a Sage RPL, no longer available. It is slower than many of the faster sticks available today. I like it's feel. I have cast the BL5, and just don't care for it's action for the type of things I do. Others may feel differently.

As to the implication that you make that a cast made by a faster rod is perhaps less graceful, well, I think that's a matter of opinion. I disagree myself. Certainly the pace required by my spey rod, which is quite slow, is different than the fast rods I own, but they are all pleasant for me. As is a nice cast with a bait caster.

Hey Rob, was wondering when you'd bring up a Burkheimer. :p I guess I should add, I have an old DS series, same era as the RPL's. Have no idea on the new ones.

Hey, one of these days you're gonna have to let me take a Burk for a test run. Maybe not, don't want to ruin my love for rods I have now.

Nymph,

I'll echo the recommendation for a 9 1/2' 8 wt. fly rod as the all-around steelhead rod. It will cover more kinds of rivers, summer and winter, and still be a useful rod after you begin to acquire more specialized equipment.

You don't need a $600 fly rod to catch steelhead. I've caught hundreds, maybe more, and they never knew how much, rather, how little I spent on my rods. For a number of years I caught scads of steelhead on an 8 1/2' fiberglass rod that I spent about $28 to build up. I guess it would cost $75 to $100 to do that now, and it might as well be graphite. But don't think for a second that a more expensive rod will catch you more fish. That's nothing more than the hype of Madison Avenue inspired magazine advertisements for rod companies.

If you build a rod, and it really is easy, you can save almost half the cost, depending on how spiffy a tool you want to fish with. If you don't think you can build your own rod, you can still get a good one for $150 or less. I believe Lamiglass offers some at $129, but I'm not sure if they offer the 9 1/2 length.

If you don't already have a strong preference, I'd recommend a medium action rod. As Land Tuna suggests, many are the users of stiff graphite rods who complain of tendonitis and other elbow and shoulder ailments associated with all-day casting. Casting with a fireplace poker will induce that result. I've got severe elbow tendonitis, and I've fished for years with old heavy split bamboo fly rods (which couldn't be made stiff if they tried compared to most graphite today). Those rods and most fiberglass rods never agrivated my elbow or shoulder conditions, but stiff (read fast-action) graphite rods do. It's inherent in the material. There is a jolt from powering a flyline through hundreds of casts over the course of the day. A moderate action rod, regardless of weight, absorbs more of that jolt than a stiff, fast action rod. And if the rod doesn't absorb it, then the angler's shoulder or elbow will.

There are so many good fly reels on the market now, it might be hard to find a bad one, except for the very cheap. A good steelhead reel can be had for about $100, and for $50 more you can get an unnecessary disc drag.

I should have said I recommend against buying combo deals, unless one has been assembled specifically for the all around steelheading you're inquiring about. Buy a good line. I'm sure I could easily catch steelhead all season long with a very cheap rod and reel, but a decent fly line will make a profound difference. Buy a good floater, and then buy a second one, cut off the forward 15', and make your own custom sink tips. The ready mades are getting better all the time, but the best are still home made, and they are much less expensive.

As you can see, fishing gear opinions are like certain parts of anatomy. Everyone has one. If controversy confuses you though, consider this: until 1973 there were no graphite fly rods, and disc drag reels were nearly unknown to most steelheaders. Yet anglers had been catching the hell out of steelhead for decades without ever knowing that they really needed a disc drag and an IM7 or IM8 or VPS or RPL or WQRXZL rod to pull off this stunt.

There are two products that would have allowed those long ago steelheaders to improve their catch. Those were today's sinking line materials and modern waders that permit the angler to wade warm and safely from dawn to dusk.

Sincerely,

Salmo g.

Thanks everyone for sharing your knowledge and preferences, now it's time for me to start shopping for the best price. Some of you have suggested building my own fly rods and I'm looking forward to the day, which probably will be in a few years. Seems like we have a good number of experienced fly fishers here, so I'm sure I'll be taking advantage of you guys if you don't mind.

As mentioned earlier I'm probably going to get a 9' or 9'6" 7 wt. moderate-fast rod. I have a couple of Redington RS2 7/8 reels I bought on eBay coming to me this week, so I'm eager to match one of them up with a rod soon. What I would like to know now is where I can find good prices on a fly rod.