#201202 - 06/16/03 02:15 PM
Paying to punch
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Parr
Registered: 02/07/03
Posts: 41
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#201203 - 06/16/03 02:19 PM
Re: Paying to punch
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Spawner
Registered: 09/08/02
Posts: 836
Loc: des moines
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YES $10
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Chinook are the Best all else pale in comparison!!!!!
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#201204 - 06/16/03 06:54 PM
Re: Paying to punch
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River Nutrients
Registered: 11/07/99
Posts: 2691
Loc: Yelmish
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because the general fund can always use more money!
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#201205 - 06/16/03 07:22 PM
Re: Paying to punch
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Returning Adult
Registered: 09/01/01
Posts: 369
Loc: Shoreline, Wa.
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Chum Man, That is NOT general fund money. It is detacated to research.
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"Always on a mission to go fishin"
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#201206 - 06/16/03 07:52 PM
Re: Paying to punch
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Three Time Spawner
Registered: 06/14/00
Posts: 1866
Loc: Toledo, Washington
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Yea, right!
Research to see how they can keep increasing our fees without doing $hit for it! How did we all live so long without WDFW doing all that "research"?
What's wrong with WDFW just telling the truth and just saying; bad times; need more money to keep our jobs; and if you are dumb enough to buy that crock of $hit . . . then great!
What a bunch of hockey puck! It's all about money and keeping their jobs on this one and nothing else!!
Cowlitzfisherman
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Cowlitzfisherman
Is the taste of the bait worth the sting of the hook????
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#201209 - 06/16/03 08:46 PM
Re: Paying to punch
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Alevin
Registered: 03/21/03
Posts: 18
Loc: Duvall, Wa.
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Sounds to me like no money is safe with the stae or WDFW. This sounds just like the duck stamp money that has never been accounted for.
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BB
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#201210 - 06/16/03 10:16 PM
Re: Paying to punch
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Juvenile at Sea
Registered: 06/19/01
Posts: 175
Loc: Federal Way
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An interesting little bit of info most don't know, this increase was sponcerd by sportfishing as legislation and supported by all sportfishing groups that spend any time doing any work in Olympia. It was done specifically for the purpose of trying to minimize or eliminate further cuts to hatcheries and the money goes into the wildlife account. So if you dont like it, blame sportfishing groups, blame your legislators, or well, blame me.
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Mike Gilchrist
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#201212 - 06/17/03 02:16 PM
Re: Paying to punch
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Three Time Spawner
Registered: 06/14/00
Posts: 1866
Loc: Toledo, Washington
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Cowlitzfisherman
Is the taste of the bait worth the sting of the hook????
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#201213 - 06/17/03 05:12 PM
Re: Paying to punch
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Juvenile at Sea
Registered: 06/19/01
Posts: 175
Loc: Federal Way
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Cowlitz,
As you have allready found out, you wont find and specifics about hatcheries in the text. It is just that in the real world the Department needed $X dollars and the budget was only giving them $Y. Under the $Y there were going to be hatchery closures so there were some ideas thrown around to get the department more money. This idea was the one that stuck as the forcasted revenue was enough to run a couple hatcheries. What the actual revenue will be we can wait and see.
There are several funds under the control of the department. The wildlife fund is, I guess you would say, the primary one. There are others, like the PSRE (Puget Sound Recreational Enhancement, ie blackmouth). I can't name them all, some are dedicated for specific hunting uses and others for fishing uses. Whatever money the deparment needs that is not available from these funds is allocated from the general fund by the legislature.
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Mike Gilchrist
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#201215 - 06/17/03 06:26 PM
Re: Paying to punch
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Three Time Spawner
Registered: 06/14/00
Posts: 1866
Loc: Toledo, Washington
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Thanks Mike for your quick response.
Here is the problem in a nut shell as I see it now!
You said; "It is just that in the real world the Department needed $X dollars and the budget was only giving them $Y. Under the $Y there were going to be hatchery closures so there were some ideas thrown around to get the department more money. This idea was the one that stuck as the forecasted revenue was enough to run a couple hatcheries. What the actual revenue will be we can wait and see."
In the "real world" (today's government) state governmental agencies have to be up front and truthful with their needs! No longer are the days when they can tell us one thing, and do another.
I had read about all the "other" funds that WDFW has, and how they are most likely "kind of screwed up" also, but I had chose not to post all the RCW's that may apply to those issues on this posting.
How can fishermen ever learn again to "trust" a state agency when the "agency" is not totally up front or truthful with the people who pay the piper? Forgetting the facts or the merits for just a moment of "why" the WDFW needed this "extra funding", let's just talk about trust or maybe the lack of trust in the WDFW.
Obviously, WDFW believed that they needed more money to continue whatever programs they were involved in when they predicted these finical shortfalls. Instead of being up-front with "the public", apparently they had chosen people who were brought into play to help put pressure on the legislators to pass this new law.
Common people must ask; why then didn't WDFW open this issue up to all it's public supporter and ask for their help and support. Instead, it certainly now appears that only a few groups of hand picked "supporters" were told the real facts.
And you and others wonder why some people start talking or implying the age old "conspiracy" thing! The more I read and research this issue, the more I understand why WDFW is always being cut from the general funding. I know better then most, of the games that are now being played out, but I still expect, no I demand, that WDFW be honest and up front when they need more money from their number one supporters.
I can say more, and I most likely will, but for now let's see if some other bb members can explain this fiasco any better. Again Mike, thanks for all your hard work and efforts and my reply does not in any way reflect on either you or your integrity. At least you are a doer, and not a just a talker! You can say that you have "walked the talk"
Aunty, you are right, but WDFW has a public responsibility to inform us all were they are going to "spend" the money from this new tax. I am not against WDFW using that money for enforcement, but if they can not be "up front" from the very beginning, who in the devil can trust them?
Cowlitzfisherman
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Cowlitzfisherman
Is the taste of the bait worth the sting of the hook????
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#201218 - 06/17/03 11:30 PM
Re: Paying to punch
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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mike, do you have a list of the fishing groups that were involved in this issue, thanks.
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#201219 - 06/18/03 03:33 AM
Re: Paying to punch
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Returning Adult
Registered: 05/10/03
Posts: 318
Loc: Vancouver WA
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JUST MY opinion and i don't wanna debate it cause you guys already know how i think.
1 punchcard per angler per year period.. no additional fee increases of any kind period.
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#201222 - 06/18/03 01:07 PM
Re: Paying to punch
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Parr
Registered: 02/07/03
Posts: 41
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Hey CF how many punch cards do you usually fill each season on the cow?
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#201223 - 06/18/03 06:06 PM
Re: Paying to punch
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Three Time Spawner
Registered: 06/14/00
Posts: 1866
Loc: Toledo, Washington
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That depends on the size of the silver run each year! Last year it was five cards. The year before it was 4 cards. Nobody in Toledo ever goes hungry when I am fishing for silvers. You might say that I specialize in silver!
But it's not just the cost that was at issue in this post; it's the issue that WDFW kept their real reasons for increasing the fees pretty much in secret, except to that of only a few groups that they knew that they would count on for support.
Do not forget, I have personally worked with many of the top staff in the WDFW for many years now, some are still there while others have retired or have moved on . Both our attorneys and I have had numbers of closed doors meetings concerning possible wrong doings by WDFW and we have also had judicial hearings concerning some shaky things that WDFW upper staff has done in the past. So remember, I have years of experience and hands on action to support 99% of what I say when it comes the WDFW's past history. remember this; you can take it to the bank.... history always repeats itself!
If some of these members had spent just one half of amount of time that I have working with different groups and the WDFW,WDOE, NMFS, USFWS, and the utilities (BPA, TP, LCPUD), they would probably be eating a little crow pie (and it would be well done....if not burnt!).
Grandpa, that was meant to answer your statement; "If you don't like this minor battle won then go fight along side the rest of us and come up with a better idea." If you were addressing that to me, and I am assuming that you were I would be more then willing to match my time card against yours when it comes to the volunteer hours spent working with WDFW, Utilities or other fish related groups!
How many times have you signed up and testified at hearings to support our fish runs and drive over 100 miles to do it?
Maybe I better stop now before I really get my hair up with your statements! You may or may not agree with what I write or opine, but you have no grounds to stand on "IF" you are trying to insinuate that I am not an active participant in making change to our sport fishing opportunities!
PS, were your "cloned"? If so, are there now you & it? If so, are you you or are you it?
Driftinforchrome: Please explain how WDFW can charge us an extra $10 dollars for a "punch" card when they do not spend a dime on rearing the silvers on the Cowlitz? Tacoma Power pays 100% of the bill to raise all of the coho on the Cowlitz, so how in the hell can WDFW justify charging us and extra ten bucks for something that they didn't do?
Cowlitzfisherman
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Cowlitzfisherman
Is the taste of the bait worth the sting of the hook????
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#201225 - 06/18/03 07:12 PM
Re: Paying to punch
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Three Time Spawner
Registered: 06/14/00
Posts: 1866
Loc: Toledo, Washington
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Aunty Well, we will talk this week end! But grandpa needs to think before he makes such statements like he has (if they were indeed intended for me). Could just be a communications problem, but then again maybe it's just a standard cloning problem Cowlitzfisherman
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Cowlitzfisherman
Is the taste of the bait worth the sting of the hook????
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