I think it's pretty risky even more so given the events of the last week.

Why? They've been taking it in the shorts the entire down turn. Now Boeings outlook has improved dramatically and they want a piece. Tit for tat. A lot more of this is coming soon. Many corps are cash cows now and not spending on the employees or new hires. But yeah, it's another damn Boeing strike and I'm glad our economy isn't as dependant upon the rise and fall of Boeing any more.

Ditto on the why? The machinists surely aren't going to get a bigger cut of the pie without trying. The aircraft market is dicey, but only a direct action like the strike can reveal what they can truly get. No risk would sorta' be like, "no guts, no glory." The union membership has spoken. Things couldn't be much fairer than that.

Sincerely,

Salmo g.

You mean like a pink slip?

They had a good offer on the table--everyones cost of healthcare has gone up in the real world--Why should Boeing employees get something that no one else is?

They need to realize that everyone is replaceable and if they're not willing to work for up to $65 an hour w/ overtime then Boeing will either find other machinists here who are or if they have to move the shops to areas that have people who will.

I doubt the public is going to have much sympathy for them right now.

Rory,

A good offer is relative. Boeing’s offer might look good to you or I, but we’re not the ones being asked to accept it. Apparently over one-half of the union’s membership didn’t think it was good enough, and that’s what matters.

Neither does the public’s sympathy, or lack of it, matter, except to the extent it influence’s management’s decision to hold firm, cave, or negotiate. Nor does it matter if other people get the same kind of deal or not. Are you really this uninformed? The Boeing machinists are worth whatever they can get from Boeing. Those are the basic economic facts of life, and the only things that directly matter in the issue.

What other people make in wages and benefits in the same or similar trades is a reference point, but is not a benchmark for what these machinists ought to be making.

So, should your salary be pegged to what a person doing similar work in Alabama or China makes?

Sincerely,

Salmo g.

You mean like gauranteed pensions for new hires? The whole pension fiasco in the U.S. really chaps my hide.
Yeah Boeing could give them all pink slips. Always could have. Obviously they still need them because if they didn't they'd be out on the streets. No charity cases when it comes to Boeing. If they could find better machinists in China or India they would do it in a heart beat.
It's funny how it's Ok for Boeing to demand concessions from this states tax payers but not for it's employees to demand concessions from the company.

The state has to compete with Airbus as much as Boeing does.

It good top see the socialist here are in lock step with the union. Timing is everything and I think their timing stinks. Seems few remember the laid off employees crying a river back after 9-11.

Boeing is notorious for over hiring then laying off.
I'm not sure how you think that employees having the same right as corps to get all they can is socialist TK. Why don't you volunteer a pay cut where you work? Take one for the gipper.

Boeing is finding plenty of machinists in China, not better ones but cheaper ones. One of the areas more well known shops I used to work at has a shop in China now. I've seen the pics of Boeing assemblies being built there in other plants. Not for the shop I used to work at but for direct shipment to Boeing.

I think this is a foolish time to strike. They're canceling hundreds of flights, shutting down airports, the economy is probably going to tank and you think Boeing has a good enough outlook to provide more than they are?

And look at whats happened when the state didn't give concessions, they packed up and left, They've sold off plants in other states. They've already sold of a good portion of Auburn and I think it's a matter of time before the others are on the block as well.

Yeah, everyone should make the same wage!

SOCIALISTS OF THE WORLD UNITE!!!




Look familiar?

------------------------------------------------------------

Goharley,

It's well known how enamored you are with the idea of socialism- :p -However, while your medical/dental coverage/co-pays may have not gone up because you had a carreer in the military (you earned those benefits and I think anyone who serves enough time in the service should be entitled to them)

Hey ya'll. Have a NICE FREAKIN "LABOR DAY" that we can thank unions for, among hundreds of other things they've done for all workers.

Rory, you have absolutely no idea, AGAIN.

WOW I guess we'll have to start calling you Norma Ray. :p




http://www.workersoftheworldunite.org/communism.htm

A Union is only as good as the members that make up the membership.

You're proud of my driving a vehicle made by an American owned company yet you spit on the union labor that makes it?

Have you always been in need of a reality check or did this condition only make itself apparent since Bush's election?

Pretty much every law covering your working butt is a result of unions Rory. You do work don't you? Why don't you take a pay cut, work an extra 60 hours a week and take no days off? Do it until you drop or your performance suffers and you are fired.

I see it differently. The tax payers made concessions, and now the employees (the people who benefit directly) are unwilling to do the same.

Or you could think of it as would you rather have the money go to Chicago or stay here?
The state didn't give concessions the last go around. That's supposedly why they moved to Chicago.

Used to belong to that Union way back in antiquity. They were a bunch of Dumb S. s then and it doesn't appear as though they've learned much. Perhaps they can get jobs with Airbus after they have put Boeing into Toxic shock syndrome and they are no longer competitive.

I hear the "bad timing" argument. When a contract is up why is it bad timing to try for a better one?
My dad has worked for Boeing for 40 years now. He's not a machinist but everyone has been operating lean and mean for years. My dad now does the work of what used to be three. And it shows. He looks completely burned out. I am constantly on him to retire.
I think the timing is near perfect for the company to give pay back for all those years everyone there has sucked it up.

"I'm not sure how you think that employees having the same right as corps to get all they can is socialist TK. Why don't you volunteer a pay cut where you work? Take one for the gipper."

Stlhd. I get paid after I complete the work and then only if it is successful. Up until that point I am working on my own dime. Why don't you with out a net if you think your work is so valuable?

Labor unions served a purpose once and now that purpose is long gone. I worked for a construction company one summer while I was in college. The going rate in 1978 for unskilled contstructuion labor was about $3.50 an hour. This shop paid me $10 and hour because of the union. I could not come in before 8 am. At 8 I could load the truck and head to the job site. By the time I got to the jobsite it was time for the first 15 minute break. By union rules I could not skip the break and work. After the break I would work for 1 hour and 45 minutes and then it was time for lunch. After lunch I would work for 1 hour and 45 minutes then it was time for the afternoon 15 minute break. Then it was time to load up the turck and go back to the shop. Unload the truck and punch out no later than 5:00 PM. The shop stewrad and the union rep where after me daily to join the union. I had 90 days to join or quit. I knew I was headed back to school so I just rode it out. This company is no longer in business. Wonder why?

My biggest issue with unions is that they sometimes lower productivity. They also promote unfairness in the workplace as much as fairness.

Lazy employees are protected from discipline, while the hardest working, industrious types are prevented from benifiting from their hard work.

Those two things were apparent to me as a chief steward. I was forced to protect employees that I felt should never have been employed, based on their poor work ethic.

I've never worked in a Union but have worked along side Union people and yeah seniority can make it hard to trim the worthless. My dad was forced into the SPEEA union against his will on their last contract. Until then he was never in a Union either.
The plus that still exists is safety in numbers in an employers market. The flip side of the coin for un-organized labor is that many corp's will walk all over their employees in an employers market. Then the pendulum swings to an employees market, people walk and the execs wonder why. The pendulum might be starting to swing.

I think it is an employees market Re; Areo space workers here. It's the reason Boeing did not leave years ago. You cannot find skilled labor force anywhere in the world like the one the exhists here. Boeing runs the numbers all the time on how much it would costs to shift production and train a new work force. The Boeing unions are making sure that Boeing leaves a worker at a time vs. all at once and they know it. The older workers are just holding on to hit 30/60 or what ever years of service formula they use to retire and then leave for the pension. The area and the younfgers workers will pay the price for the unions BS.

http://komotv.com/stories/39079.htm

The head of Boeing Co.'s commercial airplane operations says the company and the Machinists Union were $1 billion apart when more than 18,000 workers hit the picket lines Sept. 2, according to an internal memo to company executives.

This could be a long one.

Not sure how this fits here..but it does somehow, I hired one of the strikers to fill in here and am impressed with work ethic, and skill level, if he is a fair represention of the group, then I say pay 'em what they want, (I am) and it's worth it.

Stam,

Your right on! Anybody who thinks this is the lazy "B" is a fool. Expect your new worker to point out a bunch of waste and if you listen you should be able to increase profits! They have gotten really good at that over the last few years

Unfortunatly though this dispute is not about wages. If it was they would be talking and I agree Boeing should pay them what they are worth which is a hell of a lot!

did you say you work for boeing, or are you just on the payroll like most of the others.