Check this out: Makah Greed

I'm so angry I don't know what to say or how to vent! I know how about, "Boycott Neah Bay!"

I saw that, too. UNBELIEVABLE! 20,000 chinook is more than the rest of the Puget Sound harvest combined, I believe.

What is the state going to do? Kinda hard to co-manage a resource when you don't really have a committment from all the co-managers.

I personally am going to write a letter to their Tribal chair and let them know that I am disappointed that they are exercising their treaty rights in this way. With rights comes responsibilities! And, any plans that I had about dropping some $$$ in Neah Bay have changed.

Wow that is bad. Who can we contact to discuss our displeasure.

"the tribe could not be reached for comment"

I especialy like that one.

Looks like someone screwed up and put out the real numbers. Im sure someone will be out of a job or already is.

Lets all give the State a big hand in this one. Way to go State. Now i know why I saw fresh fish the past few weeks very cheep. LB

"I'm not sure what the effect will be, but it doesn't look good and we had assumed that the catch was going to be 500 fish," said Phil Anderson, a state Fish and Wildlife salmon policy coordinator.

Just assumed. Is that what we pay these guys for, to assume?
Maybe I need to switch careers.


"The implications of this large catch are quite serious," Pattillo said. "The specific impacts are uncertain at this time, but it is likely that this catch will affect ocean (and Puget Sound) fishing opportunities."

We all know what that means! In this world anytime a quota is "accidentally exceeded" by the tribes or commercials, the sportfisherman ALWAYS takes it in the ass. Just you wait and see. I wonder if the Tribe or Commercials will get any type of shortened seasons as a result of this issue? ..not holding my breath.


Each year when state, federal, tribal, sport and commercial fishing constituents set salmon seasons, they come up with estimates on the number of fish that can be taken in all fisheries and are expected to stay within that ballpark figure.


"We will be contacting (the) Makah to discuss the issue and will request they close the fishery," Pattillo said.

Sounds like the typical slap on the wrist to me.
Does anyone know what types of action the WDFW can take in the event of this type of crime? ...yes it is criminal IMO!

500 fish was probably going to be used for ceramonial & sustinance purposes. \

I can hear the tribal coordinators now...."But hey, now that they have 19,500 more than we thought maybe we could sell some?"

Quite disgusting.

But, I would say thank you to Mark Yuasa and the Times for making this latest travesty public.

Traditionally, this type story was ignored by the media due to not being politically correct.

The greatest myth of all is the "great respect for the resource" that the tribes project. Maybe someday, the public will catch on to the truth.

Would these fish be primarily blackmouth, or spring run fish?

In light of the fact that the PFMC sport quota for the entire coast (including Oregon) was 39,500 Chinook, and the fact that Neah Bay and La Push area sport fishing quotas together only amounted to 5,600 Chinook, I would expect that the extra 19,500 fish harvested by the Makah will have a significant impact on the Sport quotas for the 2005 season. It is beyond my comprehension how a group can be so irresponsible with a shared resource and there seems to be no consequences.

They are mostly blackmouth, but I'm sure there are some Springers.

Are these not the same bunch that shot the whale a few years back with a 50 cal after paddling around in a fancy canoe they built ??? Maybe offer them another one.. I am sure the last one was real tasty.

why is that "assumptions" like this are never made in state's with properly managed fisheries.

If a mistake of this magnitude does happen, it seems that an immediate closure would result, not a chicken-**** politically correct comment like "...we will be trying to contact the Makah tribe to discuss possibly closing the fishery." If the indians aren't answering their phones (mild sarcasm), how about someone cab up and make a drive. How hard would it be to call an "emergency" meeting with the indians, for the sake of everyone's fishery.

Exactly what you get when the rats guard the cheese. These weasels should not be alowed to fish for the next 39 years since they burned their quota up for that period. I wanna puke. Thats showing alot respect for the fish and nature.

What are the potential adverse consequences to the Makah? Probably somewhere between few and none. This is the fundamental reason why there is little incentive to "co-manage" a shared resource by any way other than taking the biggest share you can, especially when you take your share first. The Makah are not popular with some of the Puget Sound tribes who necessarily fish after the Makah have caught their share, whatever percent of the harvest it is. I once heard a Makah fisheries manager - back in the 1970s mind you - say that they regarded 50% of the harvestable salmon passing Neah Bay as the Makah's rightful share, essentially cutting off all other Puget Sound area tribes from their treaty reserved fisheries.

Sincerely,

Salmo g.

Sincerely,

Salmo g.

and WDFW
still has the audacity to say " we will REQUEST them to stop netting". how bout the people REQUESTING the WDFW to leave our state....we can take no more of their corruption, collusion and incompetence

if we do not take control of WDFW we are doomed. and folks wonder how radical environmentalism got started? i say let all the radical environmentalists sink as many commercial boats as they can both white and red....


better yet i think i just made my decision to boycott buying anymore licenses.... i am done paying for others theft

The tribes screwed up and the overharvest should come from the tribal portion of the remaining catch. The Makahs typically have a large harvest of Chinooks in May and June and the 20k need to come from their share. No one elses.

I suggest sending your comments to the Fish & Wildlife Commission with a cc to
Director Koenings, WDFW. Koenings is at:koenijpk@dfw.wa.gov
The Commission is at: commission@dfw.wa.gov

I just want to see pacificnw try to defend that catch in this forum. It should prove interesting!

http://www.attrition.org/mirror/attrition/1999/05/26/www.makah.org/resource.html

here is a link as well with many contact #'s of makah locations... it is from back in the whale hunt days but i bet the #'s are the same.

i know i will be calling them to inform them at bvig salmon and the tyee hotel and others that i will be canceling the 2-3 weeks i was planning on fishing there this summer

Notice the line that say "through January 10", almost a month ago. How many more fish since then???

How far is it from Olsens in CQ to decent halibut water?? I was planning on spending some time in Neah this summer but they will not be seeing a nickle of my cash. I would love to hear any alternatives to fishing the area without spending any money in tribal buisnesses.
As far as co-managers of the resource I think this finally shows that the tribes have no interest in co-management. If you want to put the screws to these guys lets take the fish they caught out of the other tribes quota. Let the other tribes feel the sting of their greed. I know they will all claim that they are not makaws and don't deserve to take a hit for the makaws greed but I don't care what they say. They pool their resources to go to court and to lobby the legislature and any other time they want some hand out or special treatment, so let them pool their fish just like they do their money, and it looks like the tribes pool of fish is empty for awhile.

is it totally out of the question to sue the makah over this? possible?

the worst part about boycotting the makah is that now i wont be able to buy/win that bright red infalable living room chair at makah days next fall

If we can't sue... can the other tribes that stand to lose out, sue?

Here's the article

Makah salmon catch causes concern
By Mark Yuasa

Seattle Times staff reporter – 02/01/05

An enormous catch of chinook salmon during the Makah Tribe's winter troll fishery apparently exceeded, by about 19,500 fish, the estimate set by state Fish and Wildlife and is causing concern.

An e-mail yesterday from Pat Pattillo — of the state Fish and Wildlife's salmon intergovernmental policy group — to the sportfishing advisory board said, "We have been informed the treaty troll fishery in Strait of Juan de Fuca has taken 20,000 chinook (through Jan. 10)."

Under state Fish and Wildlife's salmon fishing season package, the Makah's winter catch was supposed to be around 500 chinook in Catch Areas 4B (Neah Bay), 5 (Sekiu) and 6 (Port Angeles).

"I'm not sure what the effect will be, but it doesn't look good and we had assumed that the catch was going to be 500 fish," said Phil Anderson, a state Fish and Wildlife salmon policy coordinator.

The fish managers will have to adjust the amount of chinook that can be caught by all other commercial, tribal and sports fishers in the 2005-06 fishing seasons so as to not make a severe dent in Washington's wild chinook stocks of concern.

"The implications of this large catch are quite serious," Pattillo said. "The specific impacts are uncertain at this time, but it is likely that this catch will affect ocean (and Puget Sound) fishing opportunities."

The forecasts available from the state on March 1 for Snake River fall wild chinook and Puget Sound weak wild chinook stocks such as mid-Hood Canal, Stillaguamish and Skagit wild chinook could be less than anticipated because of this unexpected catch.

This large catch has occurred in U.S. fisheries at the same time the U.S. is expressing objections to Canada in the Pacific Salmon Treaty forum over increased impacts on Columbia River and Puget Sound chinook stocks.

The Makah troll fishery, Pattillo says, is managed not under a quota but as a season, just like most Puget Sound sport fisheries.

Each year when state, federal, tribal, sport and commercial fishing constituents set salmon seasons, they come up with estimates on the number of fish that can be taken in all fisheries and are expected to stay within that ballpark figure.

"We will be contacting (the) Makah to discuss the issue and will request they close the fishery," Pattillo said.

The tribe could not be reached for comment.

State Fish and Wildlife will unveil Puget Sound, coastal Washington and Columbia River salmon abundance forecasts March 1 in Olympia. Final salmon fishing seasons for 2005-06 will be announced April 4-8 in Tacoma.

"is it totally out of the question to sue the makah over this?"

"If we can't sue... can the other tribes that stand to lose out, sue?"

I don't know about lawsuits right now (the proper protocol would have been to evaluate the fishery before it happened, judge that it was going to massively overfish, and get an injunction to stop it before the overharvest occurred), but I expect that there will be trouble, big trouble, amongst all of the user groups later this spring and summer.

The seasons in PS (tribal, commercial, and sport) are set by impact limits on ESA Chinook, and I'm sure that lots of those limits have been met or exceeded already.

Everyone "upstream" of the Makahs is going to suffer for this, including the PS tribes...and I doubt it will make any friends for the Makahs, of any of the user groups, the other tribes included.

I suspect that the NoF meetings are going to be very contentious this year.

This will be very interesting...

Fish on...

Todd

...I would suggest that we are "downstream" of the Makah and I'm afraid we're going to get hammered by the outfall.....

Some side questions that might be answered by others on this site:

What impact might this "overharvest" have on the quotas for the Lower Columbia net fishery for spring chinook this year?

Is it possible that the Makah action might be able to curtail the proposed increase in exploitation rates that WDFW is proposing for this year?

Good points Todd & Baddawg...

bushbear,

Only if they caught a significant amount of Columbia River wild spring Chinook, which I doubt they did.

Fish on...

Todd

It really will be interesting to see how PS tribes with casino money handle this!

Why not just close the sport fishery there(marine areas around the reservation)? No money from the sport-fishers at the marina ought to sting in the right place.

Aunty, I think that solely depends on how the WDFW decides to spread out the impact.

If the Commercials or Sporties bear the most weight, the local PS tribes might just let it slide. Why oppose overfishing from a partner tribe when they themselves push the boundaries or fair practice all the time?

I doubt that PS tribes will be comfortable with being the recipients of possible re-allocation forever. At some point, they will suffer also and I don't think they can let it go.

Interesting point, Rich G.

I wonder is if this is actually unusual or simply the first honest report of their catch?? They fish the same time, same place every year, but this year they catch 20x more fish. Seems fishy to me...

Since they have to report their own catch, I can't help but wonder if this is the first accurate report we've seen in years. Do you think someone within the tribe let the real numbers slip out??

Here is some contact information , for those that just want to reach out and touch someone....

Contact us!

Makah Tribe

P.O. Box 115

Neah Bay, WA 98357

360-645-2201

Web Designer

Amoreena L. Barnes

Web Administrator

Sarah Tholt

360-645-2201

mtcgmsupport@centurytel.net

Makah Cultural and Research Center

P.O. Box 160

Neah Bay, WA 98357

360-645-2711 Fax: 360-645-2656 email mcrc@olypen.com

I just reached out and touched the secretariey of the tribal office and left a message telling them that I was cancelling a trip that we had planned out there and that I was going to call for a boycott of all things having to do with the Makah tibe and its business's , also that they could see our displeasure by looking at the posts on this board....

These fish could include Oregon and Sacramento fish. Hopefully, the allocation reduction isn't limited to Puget Sound / Washington affected fisheries.

The only allocation reduction that should take place is with the Makah Tribe, anything else should bring the wrath of sportfishers all over washington upon them!

I wonder what the dead shaker to keeper ratio was fishing at that time of year. 5 to 1? 10 to 1?

At least in the summer, it's mostly keepers being caught.

I know that shakers rarely survive being caught by a commercial troller.

Whoever at WDFW agreed to a open-ended "season" instead of a quota should be fired.

"The forecasts available from the state on March 1 for Snake River fall wild chinook and Puget Sound weak wild chinook stocks such as mid-Hood Canal, Stillaguamish and Skagit wild chinook could be less than anticipated because of this unexpected catch."

This here just ****** me off!

Trying to help these two watersheds (Skagit and Stillaguamish) and this happens; I have sent this article to both Group attentions

I say first and foremost the Makah give up their entire summer chinook fishery. No incidentials either which means no coho fishery. Secondly, why oh why isn't the state watching these fisheries. Not hard or expensive to have a fish checker keeping an eye on things and dropping a dime now and then. The system is a joke. I wish we could put a road block up there. Wall them off on the res until they live up to their end of the treaty. Makah, like we already didn't know, but you have proven you cannot be trusted. I say penalize them hard with boycotts until they report all catch daily and accurately and earn our trust.

For those interested in the NOF process, here is a link and meeting info: http://wdfw.wa.gov/fish/northfalcon/ Here is an e-mail to send/voice your concerns: NorthofFalcon@dfw.wa.gov Here is a link to the Pacific Fishery Management Council website: http://www.pcouncil.org/ They are vital in this process as well.
I have never attended a NOF meeting, but plan to this year. I would hope that others would as well. I have a bad feeling about the impact this is going to have on our Sporties Seasons this summer.

Kev

Pretty sad to hear about things like that, I feel for you westcoasters. It is pretty pathetic that nothing can be done about the devestation that these tribal and commercial netters are doing to wild populations of Salmon and Steelhead. It does not seem that they will be happy until they kill off the last of them.

Kev:

What good is it taking part in the NOF process when A-holes like the Makahs just do what they want anyway?

Some way, some how, we need to get the feds involved in this. That seems like the only way we could get anything done in a situation like this. Of course I won't be holding my breath.

FYI

We can not lump all the tribes in with what the Makah Tribe did!

Stillaguamish Tribe is a great steward for the Stillaguamish River.

I just wanted to point out there service to Basin. Because I work with them on other projects and see this first hand.

Just received this E-Mail from one Watershed Group Member:

"I think this is another example that the current methods of management need improvement. It also shows that somebody at the commission needs to educate those out fishing about the basics of what not to do. I imagine that the other tribes that are impacted will have something to say about this rather than let a naive action hurt the positive efforts being implemented by other tribes."

I would sure like to know when the "season" started and if they are still fishing. January 10 was 3 weeks ago. The kill may be 40K by now.

Someone better dig up where these fish are being sold if possible so we can start a serious boycott of everyone down the line!!!! NO MORE PATRONAGE OF ANYTHING MAKAH>>>>>PERIOD!!!!!!!

These greedy mother****ers need to pay bigtime for this outrage!!!!

going to look into printing up BOYCOTT NEAH BAY bumper stickers.... anyone interested in any?

Lupo:

I'll take 2, please.

I'll pitch in a few bucks so we might also make some that say:

"Recind the Boldt Decision...while we still have fish left!"

Mike

One of my sources told me that the Makah were still fishing yesterday. He also said that a lot of the fish they take are "blackmouth" and there might be upwards of 50% hatchery stock. The fishery started about 20 years ago. The WDFW has programmed an annual season catch of 500 fish for the winter. The number is for the season and is not a quota. With the Puget Sound and Hood Canal wild chinook stocks being listed, 500 was a "safe" number. Obviously, the Makah fishery is market driven. It would be interesting to know who the buyers are....

I would like to see how this will impact our summer sports fisheries, in reduced days, quotas, or complete fisheries. This has gone on for to long, the WDFW has basically turned a blind eye or at best tried to play fireman, seeing what they can do after the fire has started to minimize the damage.

Is it viable for “US” the sports fisherman and those business that are connected with the sports fishing industry, SUE the Maka tribe for the loses of our fishing rights and moneys due to their negligence and the DFW for their gross mismanagement. I would be willing donate $ 200.00 right now and more in the future. I feel this is the only way we can get anything accomplished, through the courts.

Mikes comments

“Rescind the Boldt Decision...while we still have fish left!"

Might be the best effort we could make for the long run. I don’t know how or where to even start. Todd I hope you could shed some light on this.

We have the numbers

Number of sports fisherman vs. commercial vs. tribes

Greatest number of Dollars generated per fish.

We just need to harness these and the many others that I have not mentioned and make them work for us.

I, like many, have finally woken up and realize now that by just making sense and the correct thing to do, has no effect on what or how the decision to set allocations or fishing RIGHTS what so ever.


I am willing to put my TIME and what MONEY I can to fighting to get our RIGHTS back.

Enough is enough and I am ready to act, I just need to know how and with who.

I belong to the PSA and the RFA and will be asking how can we take this issue on in the courts. Hope to hear more about this very soon.

J.R.

Does my terrorist huntig permit apply to Indians?

Head Hunter: Not funny. Sorry...but that kind of statement perpetuates the attitude that all native people are bad...ain't so. Just a few.

The best way we can fight this issue is via PUBLIC AWARENESS.

If we ca let the non-fishing and ignorant of the facts public folks know what is going on, and back it up with the facts and data, then we begin a long process of changing the LAWS.

Public pressure and the lawmakers bowing to it will be what makes the change. We can all sit here and carp about it till hell freezes over, but until we take this fight into the MEDIA,a nd show the people of the COUNTRY (not just the western states) what is going on with the issues, then nothing will change.

While I hate gill nets, there is a MAJOR difference between non-native commercial fishers and the Tribes.

The non-native commercial must follow the laws, and are accountable for every fish they catch or kil.

OTOH, the TRIBES just thumb their noses at us all, and do whatever the hell they want to...just daring us to say something. Not one politician in this state has the brass ones to stand up to the tribes. NOT ONE!

Mike

I've sent my e-mail (copy below) to the Commission and Director Koenings and my state legislators letting them know that I am expecting an appropriate response from WDFW that will not impact the recreational fishery this year and in the years to come.


"I read the article in the Seattle Times about the “overharvest” by the Makah tribe in their winter Chinook fishery. It would be most unfortunate if the recreational fishers were to be impacted by the actions of the Makah commercial fishery. I would hope that there are avenues available to WDFW and the other co-managers which will ensure that the recreational fishery for this year and the years to come are not impacted. I’m assuming that you and the WDFW are making sure that such intentional actions, by any sport or commercial fishery, are properly punished."

The tribes and NWIFC are talking already. As mentioned earlier, this is one commercial fishery and we can't use a broad brush to paint our picture.

I sat down today at lunch to enjoy a few minutes of respite and grabbed the Times..First thing I turned to was Mark Yuasa's article on the Makah travesty. I just about shot out of my chair. My soup got cold while I scrambled on the cell phone. I could not believe that this was allowed to happen. The impact on sports fishers remains to be seen but it sure looks like we will take it in the shorts AGAIN due to overharvest by nets. I just can't believe it. And when I saw the date of Jan 10th...that being the date of the report of 20,00o fish reported....That is 3 weeks ago my friends!!! And they are still fishing!!! Pat Patillo from WDFW says he is going to contact the tribe to ASK them to stop fishing....ASK??? What the hell is going on over there at WDFW? Oh sure the tribes self-monitor the fishery so WDFW cannot be blamed for overlooking this HUGE "mistake". OH MY GOD!!!

This is the last straw for me. The tribes are running rough shod all over the WDFW, NOAA and the fishers of the state of Washington. This has got to be challenged.

Anyone who goes to Neah Bay this year for any reason should be singled out for ridicule by all concerned fishers. This cannot stand! That tribe is even screwing over the other tribes and the rest