I was wondering if anyone had any information about what would cause such low returns of hatchery winter steelhead versus summer run when the amount of smolt released for each run were similar. Why would summer fish survive and return in higher numbers? My question comes from the example of the Cowlitz this winter.

I talked to Stu at the Palmer hatchery this fall about this same thing and they don't have a clue why they are getting a better summer run than winter runs on the green, although he did say he lost 80% of the smolt in the ponds last spring due to river otters 6 or 7 a night coming in to eat them.

He said he can't trap or kill them because of a new law but, they have since put in a new electric fence and fancy net setup over the ponds now and it is working good.

They also are fixing up or could be done by now at Icy creek where the kings are and they had 40,000 steelhead smolt in the small pond this year and I think last year next to the king smolts. They are dumping close to 300,000 smolt this year in three places on the Green. Said he was up to his eyebrow in them.

Glad to hear that as I'm only 5 minutes from some of my favorite spots on the upper green, well less hiking time anyway and would love to see better days again.

this pleases me, the green is my favorite river. and the whole river otter thing would explain alot cause the last two years have sucked on the green. i know that before that i'd catch quite a few summer run and winter run on the green.

I beleave this is the 3rd fall/winter in a row with bad returns and yes it really sucks. I to really like the mostly solitude time I have on the Green even if I hit nothing.

Luke,

That phenomena is not limited to the Cowlitz hatchery fish, but to winter run fish in general in the entire Puget Sound and Georgia Straits watersheds.

I think the best guess right now is that it is due to 1. when they leave the rivers, and 2. where they go when they do...and I believe that at this point there are lots of questions, and not many, if any, answers.

S malma would be the one to give the best answer to that question, so hopefully he'll chime in.

Fish on...

Todd

I haven't seen any data, but it seems like the Skamania stock (summer-runs) are doing better than the Chambers Creek stock (winter-run) in Puget Sound stream. Better with regard to survival (run size), the size of fish, and proportion of 3-salt fish. Kind of surprising since the Skamania stock didn't originate from Puget Sound streams.

A question regarding the original posting--Doesn't the difference between summer-run and winter-run size on the Cowlitz have more to do with the total number of smolts planted? Haven't they drastically reduced the number of winter run plants relative to summer-run, so that's why the difference in fishing catch rates during the past few seasons?

Another question: Are summer and winter-run smolts released at different times of the year? I thought they were both released around the same time during the spring.

Don't know the particulars in SW Washington due to differences in run timing I think it is pretty clear that the summer and winter fish would be at different places in the ocean and different times of the year. This could lead to different survivals.

Here on north Puget Sound Rivers while the winter returns (both hatchery and wild) went into the crapper during the mid and late 1990s the summer fish held their own or even increased some areas. In the last two years the winter runs have gone up some (better survival) while the summer run returns have fallen to as much as 1/3 as their abundance a couple of years ago.

Bottom line there seems to be little correlation between summer and winter steelhead.

Yes the summer and winter steelhead smolts migrate to sea at the same time of the with peak migration typcial in early to mid-May.

Tight lines
S malma