Just needed some opinions. Bought a new Palmer defiance this year, which I like but the boat was advertised as self bailing. Now since having the boat, I've found out it won't bail at trolling speeds, or stopped. You actually have to throttle it up and get the boat to come out of the water a bit to get the floorline higher before it will start to bail. On top of it anytime the boat is at rest, or trolling, water comes in through the self bailing drains (even with check valves), and flows down into the bilge rather than draining out. So the bilge pump is going off every couple minutes trying to keep the bilge dry. The manufacturer, says this is normal for a self bailing boat of this size(20 feet), that they all take on a little water like this. They are willing to put in some macerator pumps that would shoot the water out the drains if I flip a switch but the boat definatly wont self bail after that. The floor line is just too close to the water. My questions are: Does anyone else have a different brand of smaller self bailing boat that has these types of problems? Should I just accept the manufacturers suggestion even though I don't want to? Or should I press it, and try and get a refund? Although both the manufacturer, and the dealer said they wont do that. They say my expectations of what a self bailing boat of this size will do are unrealistic. All I wanted is the boat to bail itself out using gravity at rest or trolling speeds and if water comes up through the drains, it at least will flow back out rather than loading in the bilge. Is this unreasonable? Thanks for any info.

Sark

I would take the damn thing back before it sinks. If your bilge pump or power were to go out you would be swimming. If it was designed to take on water while not on step it was designed by a moron. Something is not right.

I have a Tiderunner and it has a similar system. I don't have scupper valves and I use drain plugs to cap the inside of the scupper. When I start to accumulate water, from rain or whatever, I pull the plugs and either get it on step, or put passenger weight in the right spot to drain the sides one at a time. The good thing about my boat is that the deck hatches rest on top of channels that don't allow the water to get into the bilge normally, that is unlees you really get a lot of water going. I have never taken any quantity of water into the boat, so it hasn't been an issue.
Beeeeeeeeeee

I would have to agree, something is wrong if you have to plane to drain and you are taking on water sitting still. I beleive that Palmer bought out the old tried and true Tiderunner brand, made some tweaks, and now sell under the Palmer brand. Neat boats, but the redesign is still fairly recent and there might be a few bugs yet to be worked out.

I don't know about Palmers but Boston Whalers will self-bail at trolling speeds 100% and about 95% at rest. A controlled leaking system doesn't sound very safe to me especially in adverse conditions. Like the previous post- what if the battery dies or the pump decides to take a rest?

Good luck

I don't think you should have to be on plane to get the water to drain, it should drain at trolling speeds.

My dads 2004 21' Campion will sometimes take in a little water if three people stand at the transom and the boat is not moving. It will drain out as soon as it starts moving or people move forward.

It sounds like you may have a good fight ahead with the dealer and manufacturer.

Post a this qusetion on iboats.com and/or TheHullTruth.com I'm sure you will get a lot more replies.

Self bailing should be self bailing at any speed from 0 to whatever. Take it back, false advertisement. This is the most important issue for me when I was boat hunting last summer. I ended up with an Arima 22; self bailing at all speed and motion.

Good Luck.

Iron Head,

I have been looking at the 22 ft Arima. What can you tell me about it, good or bad? I would be using it a Sekiu, Westport, La Push, etc... a lot as well as in the Tacoma area. Good all around boat?

I don't want to hijack this thread, so I'll start a new one on the Arima 22, OK.

My Trophy 2052 bails just fine at rest and at trolling speeds. The only time I get "back-wash" is when I run my kicker motor in reverse.

NOT normal. IMO poor design. I have a ’90 21 ft. Seaswirl Striper that is self-bailing. Water is removed via the scuppers and an additional side drain all above waterline. There is a catch basin in both rear corners with the scupper going aft with flapper valve and the side drain with no flapper. Water does not get into the bilge.

I am a big fellow and water does not get in my boat when I am on the side netting fish or handling lines.

By the sound of your description of your boat, you can’t leave your boat moored. Not a good thing.

I would work with the folks you bought it and see what they can do to resolve this major design flaw.

Good Luck

So what is the advantage of a self bailing transom?

Wow! Thanks for letting us know about this. Palmer is in big trouble if they think this is an acceptable design.

Someone from Palmer had better explain this or their boat sales are going to drop to zero mighty quick.

I have a 1992 20' Tiderunner is the daddy of yours that probably uses the same system. There may be some mis-conception as to the term "Self-Bailing" on both your side & the dealer.

Mine has plugs in the deck holes that I keep in until I need to drain fish blood or wash the deck down. These plugs are smaller than normal drain plugs, so I just buy regular drain plugs & grind the rubber down to the right dia. on my 6" grinder. Now you can push them in & snap the lever over to tighten them in the deck drain. I run them plugged like this 98% of the time & only take them out when I need to wash down the deck.

Yes, with the plugs out & a heavy person standing in one corner, water will come back in thru the overboard drain. If you stand there long enough it will run under the battery hatch cover & into the bilge. The rubbber flapper valves on the outside of the outlets on the stern do not seal well enough. I bought from West Marine #3684107 which is a plastic hinged lid type scupper that replaces the originals. This is a way more secure unit what came with the boat.

I just went out & measured as best I can & the deck drain is about 9 1/2" above the center of the scupper outlet. As I see it with these boats being a DEEP VEE they appear to be more tippy with weight on one side than a flat bottom boat. But you would loose seaworthyness on a flatter bottom. You will never find one boat that will be everything.

I am familiar with the older tiderunners, they are quite a bit different . My defiance does not have drainplugs for the scuppers and is not made to. It has regular open drains like you see on other self bailing boats. I don't think the difference in the drain to the outlet height is as much either. But I haven't checked. I have a meeting with the owner of Palmer boats in about a week. We will see how they take care of the situation. As long as they fix it properly so the boat bails or refund my $. I'll be happy. Thanks for the replies.

Sark