I own several rifles, but all of them are either small .22's (open sights), or larger riles with optics (sights removed). Nothing in the calibers I'd consider lethal for bears that has open sights on it.

I have the opportunity to go bear hunting on the OP this fall and next spring.

I need a good bear gun with open sights.

Any recommendations? I don't really want or need to spend another grand on rifle - especially one without optics. Just a good brush gun.

Was thinking on something of the lines of a .308, as that's a great brush bullet.

Any thoughts on a good caliber for OP black bear? Any thoughts on a good rifle?

Got one you want to sell me for a reasonable price?

Just curious to see what you all come up with. I'm open to anything at this point.

Thanks!

No sight brush gun sounds like a lever action deal.
If you are hunting on the res (sounds like) talk to Dogfish. He bought a hunt for his father in law last spring and they had a ball.
He even got the whole thing on video.

My father-in-law bought a Marlin guide gun in .45-70, and that is what he shot "Boo-boo" with. He chose the stainless model because of our weather. It is plenty accurate with open sights, and I am able to keep 3 rounds under 3 inches with open sights using factory ammo offhand at 50 yards, which is more than accurate enough.

Th cartridge should be accurate out to 100 yards+, as long as you know your trajectory. Follow-up shots are pretty quick.

If I could ever figure out how to get the bear videos off the DVD I'd post a link to it here. I suck at video.

Offhand, do you know the model number for that Marlin Andy?

Kinda like this one:

http://www.impactguns.com/store/026495016500.html

Same gun, just in stainless. That bear got hit at 28 yards, took a leap of about 5 yards, and died. There was no doubt that it was enough cartridge. All you have to do is borrow Vince's gold toof and you are set.

It was this one: http://www.impactguns.com/store/026495010133.html

A 30-30 will work fine over bait on the rez.

I've used a Marlin 336 in .35 Remington w/200 gr Core-Lokts with great success. A .30-30 or .45-70 or .444 or .450 Marlin would all work very well.

Put any of those into the right spot & ya got a dead bear. Really, a .30-30 isn't a bad choice. Now ya just gotta sort out which load.

Could even go with the 300 savage. Killed a few bear with it when we were young. Great brush gun. Always found it was more accurate than the 30-30 in my hands. Havent seen one for sale in a while but I would recommend it if you can find one.

An inexpensive way to go is a New England Firearms Handi rifle or the H & R version of it. Its a single shot with interchangable barrels. You can get all kinds of brush busting calibers for it. I have one with .44 rem mag, .45-70, 12 ga, .357, .223 and .30-30 barrels. You can also get a real nice rifled 12ga slug barrel for it. The H&R version has some other calibers availible like .30-06 and .270. Accuracy isnt bad for shots under 100 yards with the iron sights. I could pick off soup cans @ 100yds wraped in the sling with the .30-30. 1" to 2" groups of the bench @ 100yds with the .44 mag and .45-70.

Thanks for all the info fellas!

Ok, next question:

Who or where is a good source for me to buy a new rifle? Pref someplaces close to Seattle so I can drive there.

I have my eyes on that Marlin. I just gotta shop around for it now.

Any additional info on dealers, etc would be helpful.

Thanks!

"Gonna get me a bear!"

That'a man! get the marlin, I can run over to tuttles here in enumclaw and get you a price. 45-70..or .30-30? stainless..or, cold blue steel? carbine or long barrell?

are you going to need the lessons with that?

You'll be happy with the Marlin. They have a tighter and stronger action that is much better than the Winchester '94.

You could always go with an AR-15 chambered in .458 SOCOM. My custom upper should be arriving any day.

It's the Marlin 1895GS 45-70, Guide Gun, Stainless Steel, 18 Inch, Walnut Stock.

Best price I've found so far is $650.

I'm going to spell in wrong but Kesslrings in Sedro Wooley.
I miss Warshalls.
Now that I think of it OE has a new gun room. I'm sure they'd order you what you want...talk to Tommy as Tommy Jr leaves for college tomorrow.

I bought a mint original marlin 1893 .30-30 a few years back, it does poke some sweet holes in a paper plate out to ahunnerd yards...figgur' ta bag me a bigOl'buck with it this year.

An open sighted lever action is kinda specialized.

Why no scope? I've hunted the Peninsula for about 20 years and I've never felt handicapped by carrying a scoped rifle. Unless you know for certain your shot is going to come at spittin' distance,I'd reconsider the scope. A 1-4 or 1-5 would be perfect. A low power scope has a large field of view and gathers more light than open sights. A scoped rifle is easier to shoot well also.

The .308 would be a great choice. With 180s it'll put the smack-down on any Black Bear you'll come across,it'll also reach further if you do run across a monster out across a clearcut.

A Remington Model 7600 would work nicely. Other than a semi-auto,nothing is faster than a pump,if you think you'll need a fast follow up shot.

Even if you have decided on a LA 45-70,I'd still consider a low power scope.

If he's shooting on the rez he'll be all of 10-20 yards from the bar...I think he's making a good choice with an open site lever gun.
I shot an elk two years ago with my scoped rifle from 11 paces. Man all I could see was brown in the scope!

$599 at Sportsman's Warehouse.

http://www.eastcountyguns.com
604.75 couple hours from seattle

Parker---I can get you a new Marlin 1895GS in 45-70 for $585 or I have a Winchester Mod 88 in .308 with a scope for $650.

RVW

RVW,

Dang!

I'll PM you for your email address and take this offline.

Thanks!

Parker

What I'd really like is a gun that has access to both open sights *and* a low power scope.

First choice would be to put an optic on the target. I'd like to have the open sights as a backup....if the scope failed (for whatever reason).

Can one even get/mount a set of scope rings that mount and sit high enough over the sights on a LA 45-70?

I come from the school of one shot, one kill. Don't really need a lever action. Any good bolt action gun would be fine.

Pretty much if I am not 100% sure I can't kill it with one shot, I won't shoot it.

So when is this bear hunt Parker?
I've given you some crap over the years for "not hunting". You always remind me that you do.
I'd love to see you get a bear and would gladly take a roast!

I shot a bear over bait some years ago. I was in a tree stand. .270 from about 20 yards. It died right on top of that pile of stale Hostess donuts and expired loaves of bread with Aunt Jamima Pancake syrup poured on it. 1 shot. does not really matter what you shoot it with at that range.

Parker - I'd stay away from mounting the scope on see through mounts. What happens is the mounts are high enough to cause you to "stretch" to access the occular lense. This tends to cause you to lift your cheek off of the stock which is not a good way to shoot.

Carry an allen wrench with you in the field and yank the scope off it causes you any trouble. Wiht the right scope you shouldn't have to remove the rear sight.

If you want open sights, go with open sights. If you want a scope, go with a scope. Having it both ways just doesn't work very well.

As far as calibers.....don't forget the .35 Remington.


Elk

Thanks elk. Good advice. Taken.

I have the kind of rings on an old 742 remington 30.06 and i would agree with what elk said...they are tough to get used to.

Thanks to all those that replied and offered to help! I settled on the regular Marlin Guide gun in 45-70. Going straight open sights. Should be picking it up on Friday.

i'm a big fan of adventure sports in edmonds. really sharp guys there who know their stuff. it's just north of aurora village on hwy 99 on the east side of the road. 425.771.3877



willy

Good choice there Parker!

Now...check out the ammo manufactured by the Grizzly Cartridge Company in Rainier, OR. It's some good stuff.

http://www.grizzlycartridge.com/

I've bought a couple guns from High Mountain Hunting Supply in Wenatchee. Yea, it's a 3 hour drive from Seattle, but the owner Kelsey is a great guy to do business with. He will also ship firearms if you're a Washington resident. I did all the paperwork via mail, and he was going to ship to me, but I was going to Wenatchee anyway. He also does a couple WAC shows in Puyallup a year. He just opened a brick and mortar store in Wenatchee a couple weeks ago too. His hours are limited though.
I've bought lots of guns from lots of guys, but this guy is the Les Schwab of gun dealers in my opinion. Unless I can't find what I want elsewhere, I'll go to him.
He lists the 1895 Marlin Guide Rifle on his site http//www.luvtohunt.com at $499 for the blued, and $599 for stainless.

Also check out http://www.garrettcartridges.com

He does .44 mag and 45-70 only, and he does them right.

barret .50 cal

Marlin 45-70 Guide Gun 18" Model 1895G

What a little sweetheart! Yesterday was her first day out on the range and she's a very tight shooter!

Sighted her in at 50 yards. First two shots were tight, inline, but low. After knocking the back sight up a notch, the next two shots fit within my pinky nail dead bulls eye!

Not bad for an open sighted gun, eh?

Since the range had a 18" diagonal steel clanger at 200 yards, I felt it necessary to take two shots at it. Ballistic charts for the 300 grain JHP Remington said the bullet would drop 16.9 inches at 200 yards. Ok. Aim at the lower corner of the clanger...raise up to the top of the clanger....raise half way and squeeze the trigger. 2 shots, 2 kill at 200 yards. Nice!

Final 2 shots were at 50 feet - the realistic range that I'll be hunting. I could and pretty much did hit a flees arse at 50'.

I've always been good at shooting and have never questioned my shooting abilities, but what a neat little rifle!

The open sights are a bit rough and restrict your total viewing area, but past that, I love the new gun. It's flat out gonna be lethal at anything I shoot at. Knowing that I can still hit a lethal target at 200 yards on open sights is a bonus. 50 yards on in is just flat out dead.

Thanks for all the recommendations everyone!

Glad to hear that you like it. My father-in-law likes his a well.

I just got my new .458 caliber upper for my AR-15. Similar ballistics to your .45-70, but in a gas operated semi-automatic configuration. The sight is a red-dot scope with no magnification. Shoots nice tight groups.


Here is a .45-70, .458 SOCOM, .223, and a .44 Mag for comparison.


And how they fill out a magazine.


A 10 round AR mag hold 4 .458 rounds, and a 20 rounder holds 6.

Ok, that is cool.

Do you reload your own 45/70? If so, I can bring you the brass before the next SRC. I'm not going to use it.

Parker,

I'll always take the brass.