I thought some of you may be interested in this video on youtube about the effects of fish farms on Pink and chum Salmon. These things are incredibly harmfull to native salmon. Only in the last year has DFO realized that fish farms may be causing the sealice problem that kills juvenile salmon.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1BcRBwCh6BA

I was shocked when I saw a program about that on the boob tube. Im not in touch with the GR committee of cca, but I bet it will get discussed. If you look up the newsletter on the ccapnw site, you should be able to send an email to the GR committee chairman. Most of the time, they list an email address at the end of the article. Send one to WA and ore chairman.

What in the holy hell do net pens and sea lice infestation in canada have ANYTHING to do with the CCA in washington and oregon??

Very interesting piece. I think a lot of us were hoping the fish farms would eventually take the harvest pressure off the wild and hatchery stocks and be the savior of sportsfishing. It looks like I need to re-evaluate my position on fish farming. To bad science seldom leads the charge. Thanks for the post.

There are fish farms in Washinton.

If I am not mistakin I think they are trying to expand fish farms in this state. Definately bad news for wild salmon.

Here's a pic of fish from the same area that the video was done in.

yada yada yada........fish farms ARE the future. You can't feed the world on wild fish, wild corn, wild cattle, wild oats (oops, Sol's territory) or wild anything else. Someone will figure out an answer to the sea lice problem......their livlihood depends on it. And when another problem arises, then they'll deal with that. Maybe someone REAL smart will find a way to teach sea lice to eat sea lions.....now you're talking!

Washington fish pass thru Canada and Alaska. The fish pass by the farms and pick up the parasites. All politics is local. CCA is capable of pressuring our politicians to find a solution. CCA reaches far beyond American waters. It works with other groups on similar issues that affect ocean habitat and fish in other parts the world.

Sardines are being sold to Austrailian Tuna hatcheries, because the Tuna have been overharvested. The sardines are required for their high oil content to raise the Tuna.

Last year, National Geographic did a very large article on the health of the Oceans. At this point the library is the best source for the article.

Fish Farms are just another instance where big business has come in and put there little spin on things and tell people how good they are for wild salmon when actually it is the opposite. This is purely about money to a point that DFO has stuck there head in the sand for years. We are doing the same hear in washington. Farmed fish will never replace Wild Salmon for the average seafood consumer. They have prooven that they will pay extremely high prices in recent years to have the real thing. Fish farms are an experiment gone bad and need to be curtailed. They should be treated like the plauge.

Jo Jo....seen a lot of fish farms going broke? Some folks....again....some....can afford to be picky. Most, and most is where the money is.....can't. Two bins of salmon in the grocery store. One is filled with $8/lb farmed salmon, the other $20/lb "wild caught" salmon. Want to bet which bin empties first?

Look, I'm not contesting the quality.....only the practicality. Fish farms feed folks, wild is wonderful and soon only for the wealthy. My 2

Wild salmon can't support the world-wide demand for salmon to eat. Just the same as with the other meats we eat. That said, raising the fish has to be done better than we see in BC. As has been alluded to, it is all about money. It is cheaper to grow fish in net pens becuase you don't need to pump water, build raceways, etc. We get what we are willing to pay for, whether it is politicians or fish runs.

Never see me eating that stuff. Studies found traces of the toxin that is used to kill sea lice still in the fish at market. When canadian government found that out instead of fixing problem and notifying the public they changed there policy and allow this highly toxic drug to remain in fish up to 50 part per billion. 95% of which ends up in the US.

Oh really now?

Here's a list of common pesticides used for sea lice control that I found while researching this topic on the web:

Organophosphates (Dichlorvos, Azamethiphos)
Pyrethrin/pyrethroids (Cypermethrin)
Hydrogen Peroxide
Ivermectin, Avermectin (SLICE™)
Insect Growth and Molt Regulators

These are not exactly nice agents. I remember learning about organophosphate poisoning in medical toxicology many years ago. Deadly stuff for humans. Pyrethrins are a common ester-based insecticide. I also recognize ivermectin as an anti-worm drug from medical parasitology.

HMMM makes you hungry for farmed salmon, eh!?

I'm curious to know what the answer is here... Tell the world to stop eating salmon altogether?? Don't think so guys...

Do away with the farms... do away with the hatchery programs... Do away with commercial fishing over wild stocks... If everyone gets their wish, well... No one is eating fish except those that can catch it themselves... NOT GONNA HAPPEN...

T-Bird,

Absolutely fish farms should be gone. There far more of a hinderance than good. If you take them away the people that are eating them now will do without unless they are willing to pay for the healthier wild salmon. I think most would choose to do without if they new what was in them. No doubt people were hoping they would take the preasure off wild salmon but the science is proving that they are hurting more than helping. Would be interesting to find out whether Puget Sound steelhead swim through Georgia Strait and whether they are effected by farms there.

Here's some more info.

B.C. sea lice infest juvenile sockeye and herring: report

The latest scientific report on sea lice off the British Columbia coast says an infestation near Campbell River fish farms has spread beyond pink and chum salmon to juvenile sockeye and herring.

The study, published online in the North American Journal of Fisheries Management, said the spread of lice will have devastating implications for these other marine species.

Researcher Alexandra Morton said the results were discovered during testing of 47,000 young wild salmon in 2005 and 2006.

When initial results showed lice infestations among sockeye and herring, Morton checked live fish populations, she said.

Older herring are prone to lice but this is the first documentation of lice on herring that have not yet formed scales, leaving the juveniles highly vulnerable, said Morton.

The sockeye in the study were not specifically identified as species from the Fraser River, but fish from those runs pass through the same waters, said Morton.

The study suggests lice may be able to account for last year's low sockeye returns on the Fraser River, she said.

Sea lice are small parasites that attach themselves to various marine animals. Two species are known to attach themselves to salmon.

They are known to affect farmed salmon populations and various studies in recent years have linked them to a decline in wild salmon populations.

They should just farm fish in ponds. Trout and catfish are fine.....

... or in CLOSED containments of other sorts.

Which seems awfully likely before too long, IMHO.

Here's a clip from an article showing locations of farms. My guess is that at least a few washington fish swim past these area's.

Didn't BC have a moratorium on licensing new farms? Seems like it expired recently.

What other livestock are raised where their excess uneaten rotting food, excremental sewage, and massive doses of toxic drugs are allowed to simply run-off completely uncontained into the environment?

Not saying that salmon farming isn't a viable option... but the industry is in serious need of reform to clean up its act.

Doc ... We're agreeing, I think?

The lady in the video tried in the last 3 weeks to get authorization to move the outmigrating fish around the farms and then release but she was turned down by the canadian govt. and threatened with huge fines if she did.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XHTQij_8O0w

Agreed.

When I was at the AG's office there was talk of trying to establish net pens as "point sources" of pollution due to the food and waste problem, which would bring them under the purview of the Clean Water Act...I thought the idea had some merit, but apparently it was never pursued, or at least never came to that conclusion.

Fish on...

Todd

I am not making this post to defend fish farms but I would like to point out that you tube is not recognized as a source of the best peer review science. It is good for promoting an agenda cloaked as science. Look at the link below, I have heard both of the scientists give presentations and their arguments are convincing. In one talk photos of steelhead smolts from Hood Canal, completely covered with sea lice were shown. Are there salmon farms in Hood Canal?

http://www.newsdata.com/fishletter/242/4story.html

Toxic compounds in farmed fish are a concern. One should read the paper, widely reported in the press a few years ago, and not just the stories in the press. Reported in the paper but not in the press was that tests indicated that chinook on the west coast had a higher level of dangerous toxins than any west coast farmed salmon.

Without a doubt there are significant concerns about LOCAL impacts of net pen operations. Those concerns can and should be addressed. However that doesn't mean the pens should be eliminated.

As WN1A is pointing out much of the "Science " being reported to support the negative impacts from the net pens are being cherried picked to provife a slanted view. If one digs into many of those sources you will find that the funding sources come from the commmerical fishig industry, which has a huge concern about the impacts from farmed fish on their profits.

Just one example from the toxic issue referred to by WN1A; in this case PCBs. There was much made about the farmed fish having higher levels than wild fish - of course those making those claims didn't mention that they were comparing most wild chums to the farmed fish or that the famed Copper River Chinook had higher PCB levels than the farmed fish - wonder why?

As with most of this type of issues I encourage folks to take the time to local at the full range of information before making snap judgements.

FNP -
Regarding the polution by other commerical sources of protien. Who are cleaning up after the free ranging cattle - those grass feed animals that are so much better for you than those grain fed feed lot animals? While the feed lots may control the fecas of the animals what are the environmental impacts from the agiculture associated with the grain produced to feed the animals.

The real issue is where is the protein we human's want going to come from? Without a doubt it would be much better for the ecosystem if we all got our protein from sources much lower on the food chain. Instead of eating salmon (either farmed or wild) we limited our fish diet to such sources as fish meal from bait fish would be much better. However I suspect that most of will continue to want to enjoy a nice piece of salmon or a juicy steak from the grill.

Tight lines
Curt

Aren't we (as humans) finding out that picking on the smaller food chained critters, such as bait fish, is just as bad, if not worse?

Krill fishery - impacting the whale populations and everything else that depends on kill for their diets to survive.
Herring - impacting the Stellar Sealion populations, as well as the salmon/fish/birds.
Sardines - impacting many fish, birds, etc.
Anchovies - same, same.

I think we'd probably do more harm than good if we focused a majority of the harvesting on bait fish.

We tend to harvest fisheries in an all or nothing manner. The trend seems to be fish it until it collapses *then* work on recovering the fisheries.

Having no bait fish around because we are focusing fishing on them impacts many many aquatic species. Even I know that can't be good.

We'd cut down tremendously on our bait fish harvest if we weren't making fish meal out of them to feed fish in fish farms...

Fish on...

Todd

As I've stated earlier, the fish supply has to come from somewhere, so which is it? Are we gonna get them from farms, hatchery stocks, or wild stocks? Which evil are we going to keep?

I thought that is what happened to all those tribal gillnet caught wild steelhead kelts......

Here are a couple of good reads on the subject that I used for a research paper in Marine Biology. One thing that surprised me was the amount of organic matter that is associated with salmon farms. Apparently for each ton of salmon produced 55kg of Nitrogen and 4.8kg of Phosphorus are excreted into the ocean. I'd think that would lead to some heavy eutrophication and anoxic conditions in some areas with heavy densities of salmon farms.

http://www.bioone.org.ezproxy.lib.uwm.edu/archive/0006-3568/55/5/pdf/i0006-3568-55-5-427.pdf

http://biology.plosjournals.org/archive/1545-7885/6/2/pdf/10.1371_journal.pbio.0060033-L.pdf

Parker -
If you think back to high school biology and the concept of the basic food chain I think you will get what I was referring to.

For a fish such as a Chinook salmon that is feeding well up on the food chain it takes roughly 10 pounds of forage fish to produce 1 # of salmon. By consuming fish meal rather than salmon we can get much more protien ; for the same impacts from consuming 1# of salmon we can eat 10# of fish meal.

Todd -
You have to remember that the farm fish are much more efficient that the wild fish in converting their diet to usuable protein and that we can further harvest the final farmed product at a much higher rate than wild fish. As a result for say a ton of bait fish consumed the farmed fish will produce much more protein for the human table than the wild fish.

Of course the issue still remains where on the food chain we as a society opt to do are foraging.

Tight lines
Curt

That is the problem with fisheries science today and for that matter any science. Everybody has an agenda and there seems to be very little unbiased work being done. There is no doubt that the fish farmers are lining the pockets of DFO and the commercials are supporting those that are against fish farming. This is how it works in todays society. The question is can we believe any of them.

Agendas aside, one thing is clear.... the farms create an unequivocal biohazard for wild fish swimming past them. How can that be construed as anything but BAD?

This ain't rocket science... it just IS!

The farms serve to amplify sea-lice production in a VERY unnatural way. The man-made bloom of lice is like a plague of biting insects that literally suck the baby salmon dry.

Salmon sewage and uneaten fish-food is concentrated beneath the net-pens creating mini dead zones.

Mass doses of anti-biotics and anti-louse treatments add to the toxic brew.

Bottom line... wild juvenile salmon can't help but die by the millions.

It doesn't need more study.... just responsible action. History has already shown that Scandinavian rivers' wild salmon populations crashed due to sea-lice infestation as salmon farms proliferated in their vicinity. What makes them think it would be any different on this side of the globe?

It's an utterly indefensible way for ANY business to operate.

Doc! You're starting to sound like my wife! "Act Responsibly!" WTF does that mean, anyway? Do you have a workable recommendation?

Big Bird sums it up nicely here.....worldwide, most ocean fisheries are fully exploited or overfished and the fish have to come from somewhere to meet the world's huge demands for seafood. The US, due to the lack of farm raised fish, has about about an $8 billion/year "seafood trade deficit". We get most of our farmed fish from BC and Chile. The Bush Administration set out to rectify this situation by passing legislation allowing industrial scale aquaculture in ocean waters.

American Gold Seafoods is the only company in this state currently farm raising salmon, and they operate 8 marine net pens, so it is a concern locally.

I think I can speak for most of us here who are privileged enough to be able to eat "wild" salmon on a regular basis....farm raised Atlantic Salmon just plain sucks. It's soft and mushy and tastes like crap. Back when all my friends were getting married (bigamy is one wife too many; monogamy is more of the same) I attended a lot of rehearsal dinners and weddings; they almost always had farm raised Atlantic on the menu....."I'll have the chicken please".

Ike

I don't understand why they can't create saltwater pools or tanks on land to raise these fish. That way there is NO chance any fish will be affected by this problem.

Because they get free water and free water filtration/aeration by doing it out in the salt...waaayyy cheaper.

They could easily be required to do it in tanks, though...I wonder what the added cost would be?

Fish on...

Todd

Land basing the salmon farms would most likely kill the industry. It started out with big profits in the 1980s. Previously most local salmon farming had been limited to pan size coho from saltwater pens. The chinook and Atlantic salmon farms are huge in comparison. The cost of pumping all that salt water might be enough to kill the industry, but we would likely have to require that the pump intakes be screened to our WA and northwest region screening criteria. Maintaining those screens in a saltwater environment seems like it would be prohibitively expensive to me. As far as I know, using salt water pens in the public water domain is essential to the economic viability of commercial salmon farming.

In the mid-80s I favored salmon farm development for many of the same reasons already expressed in this thread. For the last several years I've become a lot more apprehensive about them.

Sg

Todd et al.

In the early 90s Ecology designated that net pens were point sources. As such, under the Clean Water Act, those that exceed minimum sizes must have Discharge Permits. There is monitoring that is required. Still, as others noted, they still use the water flow to keep the pens clean. It is cheaper to let nature and the tides move the water. Raising fish in the upland facilities can be done in a more controlled manner. It just costs more money.

You know "if cheap" was the main concern....we'd "bag" the gill net fisheries World wide and go back to the days of the "fish wheels". That way maybe "wild fish" could make it to the sprawning grounds.

The politics of "gill net fishing", just don't hold water.........the fish wheels of the "old days" were much more effective. Take the hatchery fish....allow the wild fish to continue "up the rivers" to do their thing.


Bottom line......soon the "general public" won't be able to afford the price of "wild fish"....many of them can't right now.....so either "fresh fish" is eliminated from thier diets or they buy the "less spendie" farm raised fish.

Mercury content of many of the wild fish is higher than thought.....tuna, and wild salmon have had articles written on that.......just the commerical industry wants that "kept quiet".

An aside:

Drifter,

The fish wheels were effective, but not that effective. At their peak, the fish wheels on the Columbia River accounted for only 3% of the total chinook harvest. Still the gillnetters thought that was too much competition and got initiatives passed in both WA and OR banning fish wheels.

Not to detract that fish wheels are a good fishing device for sites they are suited to.

Sg

i don't think fish farms are going to be the answer...you're just stealing from peter to pay paul....why use 10 pounds of food to get one pound of fish...not very efficient....and costs just to treat sea lice are up to 20 cents a pound or so...plus cost of feed rising ... farmed fish isn't going to be that great a deal either...