Let the debate begin.

JOE LEGAL vs. JOSE ILLEGAL

You have two families: "Joe Legal" and "Jose Illegal".
Both families have two parents, two children, and live in California .

Joe Legal works in construction, has a Social Security Number and makes $25.00 per hour with taxes deducted.

Jose Illegal also works in construction, has NO Social Security Number, and gets paid $15.00 cash "under the table".

Ready? Now pay attention...

Joe Legal: $25.00 per hour x 40 hours = $1000.00 per week, or $52,000.00 per year. Now take 30% away for state and federal tax; Joe Legal now has $31,231.00.

Jose Illegal: $15.00 per hour x 40 hours = $600.00 per week, or $31,200.00 per year. Jose Illegal pays no taxes. Jose Illegal now has
$31,200.00.

Joe Legal pays medical and dental insurance with limited coverage for his family at $600.00 per month, or $7,200.00 per year. Joe Legal now
has $24,031.00.

Jose Illegal has full medical and dental coverage through the state and local clinics at a cost of $0.00 per year. Jose Illegal still has $31,200.00.

Joe Legal makes too much money and is not eligible for food stamps or welfare. Joe Legal pays $500.00 per month for food, or $6,000.00 per
year. Joe Legal now has $18,031.00.

Jose Illegal has no documented income and is eligible for food stamps and welfare. Jose Illegal still has $31,200.00.

Joe Legal pays rent of $1,200.00 per month, or $14,400.00 per year. Joe Legal now has $9,631.00.

Jose Illegal receives a $500.00 per month federal rent subsidy. Jose Illegal pays out that $500.00 per month, or $6,000.00 per year. Jose Illegal still has $ 31,200.00.

Joe Legal pays $200.00 per month, or $2,400.00 for insurance. Joe Legal now has $7,231.00.

Jose Illegal says, "We don't need no stinkin' insurance!" and still has $31,200.00.

Joe Legal has to make his $7,231.00 stretch to pay utilities, gasoline, etc.

Jose Illegal has to make his $31,200.00 stretch to pay utilities, gasoline, and what he sends out of the country every month.

Joe Legal now works overtime on Saturdays or gets a part time job after work.

Jose Illegal has nights and weekends off to enjoy with his family.

Joe Legal's and Jose Illegal's children both attend the same school.Joe Legal pays for his children's lunches while Jose Illegal's children get a government sponsored lunch. Jose Illegal's children have an after school ESL
program. Joe Legal's children go home.

Joe Legal and Jose Illegal both enjoy the same police and fire services, but Joe paid for them and Jose did not pay.

Do you get it, now?

If you vote for or support any politician that supports illegal aliens...you are part of the problem!

Lets be real, Jose Illegal is not working a consistent 40 hour a week under the table job. Jose Illegal's living conditions no doubt suck beyond belief and there probably isn't one american in line to take his under the table job. Jose Illegal lives in the shadows, but is probably more than willing to step up to the plate and be a tax paying productive legal worker.

By the way, where did Joe Legal get that insurance for an entire family at $600 a month? I want to check that out.

Interesting take on this,Hmmmmmmmmmm.
SZ

Who is Jose's employer?

WHERE exactly did the myth that illegals get free healthcare, foodstamps, Welfare and subsidized housing come from?

And if "Jose" can... why can't "Joe"?

Can someone... ANYONE provide ANY tangible proof AT ALL of these allegations?

C'mon Hank... if anyone can... surely YOU can.

The same asswipes that claim this are the same that claim that all Native Americans get gazillons in free money from the taxpayers. Hardworking white taxpayers of course. They also like to claim that everyone on welfare is black.

So... it's just as I suspected, it's not ILLEGAL immigrants that get welfare... it's just the scary brown people with Spanish last names that the wingnuts hate so much.

Hank, the reason people take issue with your penchant for C&P is because you so often utilize wingnut hate blogs... peddlin' baseless propaganda... like you did this time.

No question about it that illegal immigrants are a burden on States, especially places like California and Arizona. My point is, that JLH makes it seem so appealing, so why wouldn't the rest of us do it? You don't have to be illegal to earn money under the table and take advantage of Goverment care, just not a life I would want to live, nor would most of the rest of us.

On the other hand I don't like pointing to a specific group of people and marking them as the cause of all of our woes. Kind of reminds me of something the Nazi's did. They may be illegal, but they are not "illegals", they are people, who from my experience, want what we want, a better life for thier families. I can empathize with that, but at the same time, I don't have any problem with enforcing our laws.

So was the research only on illegals, or all immigrants in LA? Makes a difference. And "non-citizen heads of household" does not necessarily equate to "illegal-immigrant heads of household." Just sayin'.

But why does everyone focus on stopping them from coming across the border with fences and such? Why keep persuing the most expensive solution? Start putting employers in jail. Force them to dissolve their business when they're caught hiring illegals. Zero tolerance for hiring undocumented workers. Remove the motivation for them crossing the border: jobs. When someone hires an illegal, they're aiding and abetting a criminal. They should go to jail and lose their business since they've proven they can't run it legally.

"and live in California" so who cares.

Want to enforce the law then jail the employers....or banish them to California.

I still say the US should simply annex Mexico as the 52nd state (after Canada). That would end the illegal border crossings. Mexican-Americans would be US citizens, could work anywhere for anyone, pay their taxes, receive social benefits legally, and then people who bitch and whine about illegals would have to find some other cause to bitch and whine about.

Cheap Tomatoes

THIS HAS GOT TO BE PASSED ALONG TO AS MANY AS POSSIBLE OR WE WILL ALL GO DOWN THE DRAIN BECAUSE A FEW DON'T CARE.

This English teacher has phrased it the best I've seen yet.
Tomatoes and Cheap Labor

CHEAP TOMATOES?
This should make everyone think, be you Democrat, Republican or Independent.

>From a California school teacher - - -


"As you listen to the news about the student protests over illegal immigration, there are some things that you should be aware of:

I am in charge of the English-as-a-second-language department at a large southern California high school which is designated a Title 1 school, meaning that its students average lower socioeconomic and income levels.

Most of the schools you are hearing about, South Gate High, Bell Gardens , Huntington Park , etc., where these students are protesting, are also Title 1 schools.

Title 1 schools are on the free breakfast and free lunch program. When I say free breakfast, I'm not talking a glass of milk and a roll -- but a full breakfast and cereal bar with fruits and juices that would make a Marriott proud. The waste of this food is monumental, with trays and trays of it being dumped in the trash uneaten.

I estimate that well over 50% of these students are obese or at least moderately overweight. About 75% or more DO have cell phones. The school also provides day care centers for the unwed teenage pregnant girls (some as young as 13) so they can attend class without the inconvenience of having to arrange for babysitters or having family watch their kids.

I was ordered to spend $700,000 on my department or risk losing
funding for the upcoming year even though there was little need for anything; my budget was already substantial. I ended up buying new computers for the computer learning center, half of which, one month later, have been carved with graffiti by the appreciative students who obviously feel humbled and grateful to have a free education in America ...

I have had to intervene several times for young and substitute teachers whose classes consist of many illegal immigrant students, here in the country less than 3 months, who raised so much hell with the female teachers, calling them "Putas"(whores) and throwing things, that the teachers were in tears.

Free medical, free education, free food, free day care etc., etc, etc. Is it any wonder they feel entitled to not only be in this country but to demand rights, privileges and entitlements?

To those who want to point out how much these illegal immigrants contribute to our society because they LIKE their gardener and housekeeper and they like to pay less for tomatoes: spend some time in the real world of illegal immigration and see the TRUE costs.

Higher insurance, medical facilities closing, higher medical costs, more crime, lower standards of education in our schools, overcrowding, new diseases. For me, I'll pay more for tomatoes.

Americans, We need to wake up.

It does, however, have everything to do with culture: It involves an American third-world culture that does not value education, that accepts children getting pregnant and dropping out of school by 15 and that refuses to assimilate, and an American culture that has become so weak and worried about "political correctness" that we don't have the will to do anything about it.

If this makes your blood boil, as it did mine, forward this to everyone you know.

CHEAP LABOR? Isn't that what the whole immigration issue is about?

Business doesn't want to pay a decent wage.

Consumers don't want expensive produce.

Government will tell you Americans don't want the jobs.

But the bottom line is cheap labor. The phrase "cheap labor" is a myth, a farce, and a lie. There is no such thing as "cheap labor."

Take, for example, an illegal alien with a wife and five children. He takes a job for $5.00 or 6.00/hour. At that wage, with six dependents, he pays no income tax, yet at the end of the year, if he files an Income Tax Return, he gets an "earned income credit" of up to $3,200 free.

He qualifies for Section 8 housing and subsidized rent.

He qualifies for food stamps.

He qualifies for free (no deductible, no co-pay) health care.

His children get free breakfasts and lunches at school.

He requires bilingual teachers and books.

He qualifies for relief from high energy bills.

If they are, or become, aged, blind or disabled, they qualify for SSI. If qualified for SSI they can qualify for Medicaid. All of this is at (our) taxpayer's expense.

He doesn't worry about car insurance, life insurance, or homeowners insurance.

Taxpayers provide Spanish language signs, bulletins and printed material.

He and his family receive the equivalent of $20.00 to $30.00/hour in benefits.

Working Americans are lucky to have $5.00 or $6..00/hour left after paying their bills and his.



Cheap labor? YEAH RIGHT!

THESE ARE THE QUESTIONS WE SHOULD BE ADDRESSING TO THE CONGRESSIONAL MEMBERS OF EITHER PARTY. AND WHEN THEY LIE TO US AND DON'T DO AS THEY SAY (or what we ask?), WE SHOULD REPLACE THEM .

Nice work. I like the way you used the paste feature after using the copy feature.

"New diseases"...

Want facts?

http://www.snopes.com/politics/immigration/taxes.asp

John Lee... when did you become a wingnut?

Say it ain't so...

What about this is false?

Even the Snopes article tries, it does not debunk most of it.

Do you guys really believe the above is really a bag of lies?

Marz,

It's impossible to know. That's a problem. Because people are so willing to just make stuff up, it renders every statement suspect.

I have no problems with Mexicans who come into the US to live and work peacably. I can't see that they're taking jobs US citizens want. Those who want to come here and make trouble, shoot 'em and feed 'em to the condors. I'm just a liberal who doesn't have the time or money to give fair trials to non-citizens who coincidentally don't have Constitutional rights.

To the extent that we have laws, regulations, and policies that require giving free education, health care, free meals, rent, utility subsidies, and ESL to people who are here illegally, we are stupid for doing so and thereby deserve the consequences. If we didn't have stupid laws, regulations, or policies, then stupid [censored] wouldn't happen.

Sg

Although illegal aliens are not generally eligible to collect public welfare benefits, an illegal alien may receive benefits under the Aid to Families with Dependent Children (AFDC) and Food Stamps programs on behalf of his or her U.S. citizen child. (Any child born in the United States is considered a U.S. citizen, regardless of the parents' immigration status.) A 1997 General Accounting Office (GAO) report determined that in 1995 households headed by illegal aliens received a total of $700 million in AFDC benefits and $430 million in Food Stamps.

There really is a problem with this, it isn't just hype. It isn't just Mexican immigrants, but on the west coast and Texas, mexicans make up a large majority of illegals.

It's true, look it up.

But, but, but, but show me the stats Marz,...........

I want you to do all the work for me Marz,............

Grrrrrrrrr, Fox, grumble, Hannity, gargle, Limbaugh, wingnuts, racists, show me, give me, hand me, teach me, feed me.

I think that about sums up the opposition argument.




Sometimes dude there's no educating those who are unwilling to listen.

The system will break under it's own weight soon enough and most of the dimbulbs here will be there to point the finger once again.

Not my fault,........he did it children

I could understand if I actually listened to / watched / or quoted any of those.

No matter how civil and honest I try to be, some here take more pride throwing me under the bus or pointing an accusing finger at me all while assuming I actually am the opposition.

You nailed it SW, unwilling to listen.

Say there is an immigrant problem, they are chomping at the bit to call you a racist. Disagree with expensive social programs, they assume you hate poor people.

You can tell the difference between those that read about it and those that have been there.

No biggie, I will be the bad guy... never really wanted to be on the bandwagon anyway.

Doesn't matter Marz. You think different than they do therefore you are lumped into the heap with the real wingnut right.

No real debate here,......just left and right, black and white.

People cling to their political identities like 3yr old children clutching their favorite blanket. Should they give even an inch, then they would be going back on the years of diatribe they have posted here.

A sad state of affairs really.

Keep convincing yourself deficits don't matter KK and pray at the alter of Krugman that you are right.

Although, history shows a different outcome for those who choose to willfully ignore the consequences of monetizing debt. Ask your socialist buddies in Europe how their little experiment is working out for them

I understand you are so clung to your world view that it would be blasphemy for you to acknowledge this. In your case it seems the mind has grown stale and stagnant with age. So much for that "change".

I'm not a seller yet although I am positioned to be. Gold has a long way to go. Talk to me in December

I'd say both.

Oh the Irony....
California is the laughing stock of the nation due to it's insane liberal politics.
I'm constantly trying to defend my hunting & gun ownership on the outdoor message boards I play on.
And who rips the almighty Mecca of liberalism?
Another hard core liberal.
Wow.

It ain't so!!!!

Guess it's time I explain myself.....

4Salt I promise you, I am not a wingnut! I started this tread because this is the debate that's going on all over the country and amongst all races and political persuasions. It's a very emotional subject that need's light and political attention, without the shouting and name calling. I got this from one of the most respected liberal minded and caring people in Seattle. She helps others as best she can and is not a hater. She is very intelligent and educated. Both her and I are not a racist. Because we care to share, discuss and look deeper at this issue, does not mean that we have to ware the label Wingnut.. For me the issue is the need for legislative action regarding immigration laws, or the need to offer work permits in order to stop the extreme suffering that persist now. How about having them apply for citizenship and pay taxes and contribute to the general welfare. Surely we can find a legal solution.

Building Higher walls will not solve the problem or silence the screams of a hungry child on the wrong side of the ditch. Both parties are avoiding the issue and counting on our continued screaming and yelling, and not looking for resolve. Ignoring the voices of the people that are funding (tax Payers) this dysfunction, offers no answers. Yelling racist, or using the "N" word does not work, as all it does is creates a lot of noise and static while avoiding a civil solution to the problem. Have you heard of the threat to our Social security funds (that people paid in all there life) being depleted because of this issue? If it's true, we should care and demad answers, because those are our mothers and fathers, sisters and brothers that are being affected.

Instead of giving the banks all those trillion to take out of the country, maybe some of that money could have gone to help Mexico and it's people? I promise you, that issues involving Social Security for those that paid or are paying into it, and concerned about it's use, does not qualify that person as a racist for asking questions relative to any issue that threatens it's future. Because somebody is screaming "racist" louder, and getting attention because it sets off an alarm that triggers a reflex that has us jump into our bunkers(democrat, republican. liberal, conservative, etc.), while others are questioning how some (that don't qualify and not even a social security card) are getting this money that they have earned, and was deducted for SS retirement. Now they say it's (SS) running out, and to question inappropriate use of these funds is t be labeled a racist? I think not!!! I would rather they print more stimulus money, and use it to fund this dysfunction, or have it voluntarily deducted from passionate sympathizers earnings at a rate of say 25% in order to facilitate the issues involved(i.e.,Medical, housing,etc.).

I posted this to get reactions and input as to what others were thinking. I don't want the continued demoralization of a people (Mexicans) by requiring that they crawl on their belly's and begging in order to do us a favor (labor) in order to survive and care for their family's. The problem is that the Mexican and American government refuses to look at the realities of whats driving this dysfunction. The system on both sides of the boarder is set up in a way that results in the misery and suffering of those not lucky enough to crawl to Mr. Man's Apple orchard's or lettuce fields. The so called grunt work that they do( some say other American wont do), should pay a wage according to it's value. Food has more value that some paper shuffler in a suit and tie taking home 100 g's a year, and commuting 100 miles a day to an office to fake work ( to many chiefs and not enough Indians) . We need to rethink and organize so that the system is more equitable, fair and self sustaining, and not the dysfunctional and toxic mess it is now. The various diseases ( cancers, etc.)we see now are a direct results of the toxic ( physical, emotional and spiritual) mindset and behavior that most of us are program for. All I'm saying is that we can do better with running to get our guns and acting barbaric. I'm sure there are many like myself that will chooses to be true to their hearts, before surrendering to a reflex to duck and run to a bunker, and began firing noise at anything that challenges the imagine rightness the labeled (democrat, republican, liberal, conservative, etc.) box we get locked into. I'm still and Independent, and will remain so. There are many more that think like I do when it comes to getting us out of this mess.

Ideally, I would love to see a world without boarders, and all people having a right to a place under the sun as divine beings that are also blessed with the special gift called human life. That would be my wish (keep dreaming). It would be wonderful to expect our leaders to do the right thing in resolving issues, instead of the polarization, and offer up bait that will appeal for the hateful voter. That goes for both parties!!!! In the last election, I worked my tail off to get candidates elected and with success. I will continue to be politically involved and hope that I can support the best of the choices offered on the ballot. However, I see the potential of all my recent work getting erased, simply because, yet again the mass stupidity button gets switch on , via media and scarcity and presto......you get the picture.

After all, there ain't enough X, Y, Z to go around, and the ego wants it all.

You really are the King of the Pillow Biters aren't you? ,..........and Quatre Sel your faithful concubine

How did I know that you'd take one statement I made and twist it with your own childish logic. Then proceed to ignore the rest of my comments. Your tactics are old and tired, like you.

Your thoughts don't seem to travel much further than your limited scope will allow. If they did you might come to realize that I might have diversified myself sufficiently to whether financial storms good and bad.

To put it in terms you can understand,.....the market does good,....I do good,......the market does bad,.........I do good. One area of investments might not always perform but one will,......keeping my accounts in the black.

That said I have no wish, nor have I ever stated, that I want the wheels to fall off. Show me where I have or quit putting words in my mouth. If that's the only route you have to take it shows what a complete waste of space you are.

I have plenty to lose if the wheels do fall off. Which is why I have stated many times that the monetization of debt as opposed to liquidation will lead to currency problems in the fututre,.......as is being witnessed in Europe right now and as has happened to every fiat currency in the history of mankind.

Don't blame me that you're too stuck to your world view to pull your head out of your a$$ to take a look around and witness what is happening right in front of your face.

another topic derailed...

A few years back (Bush admin.) the left was preaching dread jut as much as the right is now. I am not saying it was unfounded, but there are plenty of issues with the current expensive solutions too. Both sides will have plenty to bitch about as long as there are 'sides'.

Once again proof that those caught up in drawing lines in the sand are solving nothing more than self confidence issues.

Back on topic, I read there was a woman raped behind a Safeway in Edmonds the other day and the rapist was an illegal immigrant... I am not saying that illegals are criminals but would better immigration enforcement resulted in this woman not being victimized?

Is there any viable solution to the immigration issue besides "building a big ass wall" or making legal US citizens that may be a little too brown feel victimized?

+ 8,000,000,001

Seems you imply that crime will rise or fall in direct proportion with illegal immigration. I highly doubt that.

Just a few ideas:

Make it easier for the illegal aliens who are contributing members to American society to become citizens.

Improve the conditions in Mexico.

Legalize weed.

So you are saying it will have no impact?

No impact on the rate of crime? absolutely. Well it would probably raise it. Crime rates are based upon a percentage of the population. I'm willing to bet the rate of crime amongst illegals is much lowr than among legals.

Oh, that's is the topic.

I would hope that to be the case, but the actions taken in AZ seem to suggest differently.

From my own experience, most illegals seem to obey the law more than the average American citizen out of fear of being deported.

Bottom line, I don't think profiling is a good solution but the federal action on immigration has been pretty weak, possibly forcing AZ to initiate federal attention to this issue by implementing this law.

Now this may not be the most PC post on this topic, but even though we live in a society that preaches against racial profiling, in this day in age I believe it to be at least a little necessary. On a whole, I am a little more leery of a sketchy looking middle easterner sitting next to me on a plane than I am a person of Spanish origin. I would not say that is being prejudice, more like keeping up with the times.

I do not know the ins and outs of what Arizona is trying to do, but why is it wrong for an official to approach anyone of Spanish origin and verify their right to be in this country. We have a big enough problem in this country with illegals that the people of Spanish origin that are here legally should understand the need to enforce what is right. If I was in an area where a crime had taken place and the description of the perp matched what I look like, then would I not scream bloody murder if someone verified whether or not I was the culprit? That is not to say that it would not suck to have a run in with the fuzz over a crime that I did not commit, but that is a part of life and I would get over it without trying to file a farcken lawsuit. I realize that it comes down to enforcement doing the right thing, but what is the right thing?

It is irritating how soft America is getting with EVERYTHING. And for those of you who think that illegals are only doing the jobs that no one else will do for nothing, then you should go to any construction site and see who is doing a majority of the skilled work. I would venture to guess that they send more money home than they put back into our economy.

Flame away if you like, just my two cents.

Lavro8 - I am tired of the Spaniards too! Although I have a hard time telling them apart from people like me until I hear their accent.

7 hour work days, with a 2 hour lunch siesta. NOT in my country.

He did promise... personally I think it is far past due.

One question remains though, how do they stop (or at least slow) the influx of illegals after a "pathway to citizenship" is implemented?

As long as US residents/citizens hire illegal immigrants, the US-Mexico border will remain porous. The solution is NOT a 2,000 mile long fence or wall manned with armed guards ordered to shoot anyone crossing. The solution is so simple even the stupid Dems and Reps in Congress could fix it by passing a law making it a federal crime, punishable by imprisonment to hire an illegal immigrant. But that would piss off the Senator's and Congressmen's constituents who hire those illegals. So they won't do that. If they do anything at all, count on it being complex and ineffective. Sound like a betting guy, don't I?

Sg

Remember that same wall to keep people out,.....can be used to keep you in.

Just ask the East Germans about that

It ain't any lack of common sense by Congress... or any stupidity on their part either.

It is the fact that the monied interests who control them and this country want illegals here competing for jobs, driving wages down, corporate profits up and keeping the citizens so preoccupied, fighting amongst themselves over what to do about it that they continue to completely ignore the fact that they're gettin' screwed royally by these very interests.

After all... it's SO much easier to blame Raul, his wife and 6 kids for all of life's troubles.

tt
THIS IS NOT A JOKE

Bank of America,

Customer: Yes, I want to cancel my account. I don't want to do business with you any longer.

The Bank: Why?

Customer: You're giving credit to illegal immigrants and I don't think it's right. I'm taking my business elsewhere.

The Bank: Well, Mr. Customer, we don't want to see you do that, but we can't stop you. I'll help you close the account. What is your account number?

Customer: (gives account number)

The Bank: For security purposes and for your protection, can you please give me the last four digits of your social security number?

Customer: No.

The Bank: Mr. Customer, I need to verify your information, but in order to help you, I'll need verification of who you are..

Customer: Why should I give you my social security number? The reason I'm closing my account is that your bank is issuing credit cards to illegal immigrants who don't have social security numbers. You are targeting that audience and want their business. Let's say I'm an illegal immigrant and you've given me a credit card. I have a question about it and call for assistance. You wouldn't be asking me for a Social Security number, would you?

The Bank: No sir, I wouldn't.

Customer: Why not?

The Bank: Because you would have pressed '2' to speak in Spanish. We don't ask for that information when calling in on the Spanish line.


Provided "snopes" for doubters:
http://www.snopes.com/politics/immigration/bankofamerica.asp

Calling an illegal alien an 'undocumented immigrant' is like calling a drug dealer an 'unlicensed pharmacist'.

Ducker

The law in AZ is constitutional. So would be rounding up every single person within our borders with a Spanish last name and herding them into concentration camps.


Korematsu Vs United States.

Hank,

I think someone in the Dept. finally tipped him off that the AZ law is based on the US federal law. So if it's unconstitutional, then the feds also have a problem.

Sg

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WgOHOHKBEqE

Ducker

If the administration has a hair on its azz about dealing with the illegal immigration problem, all he has to do is propose legislation to Congress that imposes mandatory fines and jail time for anyone who employs an illegal immigrant. And if Congress also has a hair and wants to deal with the issue, they would pass it.

But they won't, will they? Of course not. Too many individuals and businesses benefit by hiring illegal immigrants, and they'll exploit humanitarian or any fake reason in lobbying against this or any meaningful reform.

I sympathize with certain of Mr. Alvarado's concerns (the day laborer network guy) but overall his position statement is nucking futz. Some of those undocumented folks are criminals, and I don't even want to extend them a small measure of equality. The non-criminal illegals are still illegal and need to obtain a green card. And the gubmint needs to figure out how to issue them more quickly. I feel like such a redneck today.

Sg

A redneck would never advocate throwing an American business man in jail for using cheap labor. So I think you're still okay.

My biggest worry about a porous border is the ease of a terrorist getting across. Al Queda partially funds through the sale of drugs, the Mexican cartels sell drugs so I could see them entering into a loose partnership allowing the cartels to bring terrorists across in exchange for drugs.

Typical Democrat/Obama/Alfred E Newman thought process--- What, me worry?

KK you are starting to flounder...