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#648325 - 12/27/10 04:05 PM Re: will selective com. fishing ruin sportfishing ? [Re: Fast and Furious]
stlhdr1 Offline
BUCK NASTY!!

Registered: 01/26/00
Posts: 6424
Loc: Vancouver, WA
Originally Posted By: Lead Bouncer
Keith,

You dont have tribal harvest on steelhead on most of those rivers. Dont tell me its not harvest. I m not letting the dams off the hook either.


Laugh all you want...

We don't have tribal harvest on the rivers I speak of for steelhead or salmon. We don't have any harvest except the incidental kill with the nets and as I stated earlier, that's not much.

The Lewis River Bright's (Fall fish) have withstood extreme harvest through the 90's and early 2000's. They missed escapement for one year and it has been shut down since. Escapement is set at 6600 fish, this years return was predicted at 12,000. 2009's run was predicted at roughly 10,000 and the run came in right about that... Plenty of room for harvest, but groups stand in the way of letting us at those fish.

Again, plenty of harvest on these fish and I mean plenty over the years. We've more than took our share as well as the netters in the LCR. But the run is still healthy. Again, no HATCHERY fish in that system... Interesting isn't it?

Keith
_________________________
It's time to put the red rubber nose away, clown seasons over.


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#648326 - 12/27/10 04:07 PM Re: will selective com. fishing ruin sportfishing ? [Re: Fast and Furious]
stlhdr1 Offline
BUCK NASTY!!

Registered: 01/26/00
Posts: 6424
Loc: Vancouver, WA
Originally Posted By: Lead Bouncer


I dont know enough about wild steelhead populations in either state.


I'm not sure you know much about fishing in general let alone what rivers get what for returns... Might help if you get out a bit before you start running your mouth.

Keith
_________________________
It's time to put the red rubber nose away, clown seasons over.


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#648329 - 12/27/10 04:15 PM Re: will selective com. fishing ruin sportfishing ? [Re: stlhdr1]
Fast and Furious Offline
River Nutrients

Registered: 12/30/07
Posts: 3164
Its sound like you dont want hatchery fish. Selective harvest is only going enable hatchery production. Therefore you dont want selective harvest. That could fit the agenda of a few other people.

Am I close or should I hit the river and try again?

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#648332 - 12/27/10 04:17 PM Re: will selective com. fishing ruin sportfishing ? [Re: Fast and Furious]
boater Offline
Three Time Spawner

Registered: 07/01/09
Posts: 1760
Loc: common sense ave.
Originally Posted By: Lead Bouncer

Until 2009, I dont think a pink season was available.


rolleyes

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#648335 - 12/27/10 04:36 PM Re: will selective com. fishing ruin sportfishing ? [Re: Fast and Furious]
stlhdr1 Offline
BUCK NASTY!!

Registered: 01/26/00
Posts: 6424
Loc: Vancouver, WA
Originally Posted By: Lead Bouncer
Its sound like you dont want hatchery fish. Selective harvest is only going enable hatchery production. Therefore you dont want selective harvest. That could fit the agenda of a few other people.

Am I close or should I hit the river and try again?


No, what I'm saying is it doesn't matter what your group (CCA) does in the LCR. Even if "selective" harvest was implemented it won't do [censored] except take hatchery fish from the sportsman for the time being. Sooner than later you'll realize that hatchery fish are the problem and they will slowly be taken away. Sucks but true... So let us harvest on the wild populations that can sustain it... CR SUMMER KINGS, LEWIS RIVER BRIGHTS.... Ironically you're group has supported stopping this...

You ever actually meet Gary Loomis? He's a much different guy now than he was in his younger years... He's all about protecting the wild fish and those fall kings are his pet fish...

Keith
_________________________
It's time to put the red rubber nose away, clown seasons over.


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#648340 - 12/27/10 05:12 PM Re: will selective com. fishing ruin sportfishing ? [Re: Illahee]
Salmo g. Offline
River Nutrients

Registered: 03/08/99
Posts: 13521
Freespool,

They still are saying that it's harvest. So yes, it sounds familiar. And this thread is familiar in its inanity.

Sg

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#648348 - 12/27/10 05:34 PM Re: will selective com. fishing ruin sportfishing ? [Re: Salmo g.]
Rivrguy Offline
River Nutrients

Registered: 03/03/09
Posts: 4394
Loc: Somewhere on the planet,I hope
SG the thread was interesting until the girls got into a cat fight!
_________________________
Dazed and confused.............the fog is closing in

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#648405 - 12/27/10 10:00 PM Re: will selective com. fishing ruin sportfishing ? [Re: Rivrguy]
boater Offline
Three Time Spawner

Registered: 07/01/09
Posts: 1760
Loc: common sense ave.

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#648411 - 12/27/10 10:32 PM Re: will selective com. fishing ruin sportfishing ? [Re: stlhdr1]
Magicfly Offline
River Nutrients

Registered: 01/13/07
Posts: 3444
Loc: Pasco Bulldog country
Originally Posted By: stlhdr1
(which were actually truly hatchery fish) I had to release... Keith


Keith were the dorsal fin's about a 1/2" tall? The reason I'm asking is I caught a couple of summer runs back in Sept. that were Idaho bound that have the nick name "stubbies". The Indians don't clip their Adipose fin's. Sucked releasing those brutes.

Just curious.

Mf
_________________________
Born again with IRON MAIDEN!

"Go hard, today Can't worry the past, coz that yesterday". GO COUGS!!!



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#648420 - 12/27/10 10:49 PM Re: will selective com. fishing ruin sportfishing ? [Re: Magicfly]
stlhdr1 Offline
BUCK NASTY!!

Registered: 01/26/00
Posts: 6424
Loc: Vancouver, WA
Originally Posted By: Magicfly
Originally Posted By: stlhdr1
(which were actually truly hatchery fish) I had to release... Keith


Keith were the dorsal fin's about a 1/2" tall? The reason I'm asking is I caught a couple of summer runs back in Sept. that were Idaho bound that have the nick name "stubbies". The Indians don't clip their Adipose fin's. Sucked releasing those brutes.

Just curious.

Mf


I was actually speaking of the summer kings, but have seen a lot of that with the summer steelhead. Those dorsals get the hatchery rash when they're smolt...

Keith
_________________________
It's time to put the red rubber nose away, clown seasons over.


Top
#648422 - 12/27/10 11:04 PM Re: will selective com. fishing ruin sportfishing ? [Re: stlhdr1]
Magicfly Offline
River Nutrients

Registered: 01/13/07
Posts: 3444
Loc: Pasco Bulldog country
I don't fish summer kings, and I just was curious if the sk's "hatchery rash" is similar to the summer steelhead. Wondered if the sk's & ss are from the same tribe, by chance.

Thanks

Mf
_________________________
Born again with IRON MAIDEN!

"Go hard, today Can't worry the past, coz that yesterday". GO COUGS!!!



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#648483 - 12/28/10 10:49 AM Re: will selective com. fishing ruin sportfishing ? [Re: Magicfly]
DrifterWA Offline
River Nutrients

Registered: 04/25/00
Posts: 5074
Loc: East of Aberdeen, West of Mont...
Definition of INANITY. 1: the quality or state of being inane: as a: lack of substance : emptiness b: vapid, pointless, or fatuous character : shallowness

Sg:

Way to go......had to use my resourses to look up another word.....Thanks....

Kinda wish we could start 2011.....with this "thead being shut down".
_________________________
"Worse day sport fishing, still better than the best day working"

"I thought growing older, would take longer"

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#648534 - 12/28/10 02:10 PM Re: will selective com. fishing ruin sportfishing ? [Re: DrifterWA]
boater Offline
Three Time Spawner

Registered: 07/01/09
Posts: 1760
Loc: common sense ave.
Originally Posted By: DrifterWA


Kinda wish we could start 2011.....with this "thead being shut down".



so you dont think this issue should be a concern to sportfisherman ??

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#648574 - 12/28/10 05:56 PM Re: will selective com. fishing ruin sportfishing ? [Re: boater]
Salmo g. Offline
River Nutrients

Registered: 03/08/99
Posts: 13521
Boater,

I doubt it. The issue should be of concern to most. However these threads always go sideways with posts that are sarcastic to idiotic, like yours, posts in response to posts 6 or 12 posts earlier without referencing them, posts that just lob fuel on a fire with no constructive or informative intent whatever, like many of yours. You seem to think it's an important subject, and you contribute unproductive posts endlessly, so I have to conclude you're really only here for the perverse entertainment with no intent toward constructive discussion. I guess another possibility is that you're the idiot that some posters call you.

Sg

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#648707 - 12/29/10 12:46 AM Re: will selective com. fishing ruin sportfishing ? [Re: Salmo g.]
DrifterWA Offline
River Nutrients

Registered: 04/25/00
Posts: 5074
Loc: East of Aberdeen, West of Mont...
What ya think???????
















Have a good New Year............


Edited by DrifterWA (12/29/10 12:48 AM)
_________________________
"Worse day sport fishing, still better than the best day working"

"I thought growing older, would take longer"

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#648766 - 12/29/10 11:29 AM Re: will selective com. fishing ruin sportfishing ? [Re: Salmo g.]
boater Offline
Three Time Spawner

Registered: 07/01/09
Posts: 1760
Loc: common sense ave.
Originally Posted By: Salmo g.
Boater,

I doubt it. The issue should be of concern to most. However these threads always go sideways with posts that are sarcastic to idiotic, like yours, posts in response to posts 6 or 12 posts earlier without referencing them, posts that just lob fuel on a fire with no constructive or informative intent whatever, like many of yours. You seem to think it's an important subject, and you contribute unproductive posts endlessly, so I have to conclude you're really only here for the perverse entertainment with no intent toward constructive discussion. I guess another possibility is that you're the idiot that some posters call you.

Sg


a typical response from a non-thinking cca member

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#648773 - 12/29/10 11:49 AM Re: will selective com. fishing ruin sportfishing ? [Re: boater]
Lucky Louie Offline
Carcass

Registered: 11/30/09
Posts: 2286
Originally Posted By: boater
Originally Posted By: Lucky Louie


For giggles and grins let&#146;s say this is a hearing and here is your chance to present why the tribe should not be entitled to their share.



i dont recall anyone saying that the tribes would not get there share, plus your focusing to much of spring chinook as there are other runs of salmon in that river that this new commercial method will effect.




Most folks on here would agree that the tribes are entitled and will receive 50% of the Selective live capture additional harvest windfall that gill nets can’t catch due to the 2% incidental impact cap and the high mortality of gill nets.
When the allocation balance of commercial and sport takes place the tribes will receive their 50% according to US VS Oregon management plan and that will leave a savings of around ½ of the ESA listed normally killed in gill nets to continue their swim upriver when selective live capture gear is implemented.
Todd has said it can’t happen in a layered generalization oratorical way without any substantial facts other than it just can’t happen. Well I think you are just as WRONG today as you have been for over the past year.

You and your followers have continuously bashed people and organizations over this subject for over a year due to the inability to do the homework letting ignorance fuel the continuous prejudices about the new kid on the block.

I suggest that the highly contested---” gill net VS selective live capture gear equals no ESA listed saving” is incorrect and that 50 % ESA listed can be saved by using the new selective capture gear.

Myth busted.


Edited by Lucky Louie (12/29/10 11:58 AM)
_________________________
The world will not be destroyed by those that are evil, but by those who watch them without doing anything.- Albert Einstein

No you can’t have my rights---I’m still using them





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#648786 - 12/29/10 12:24 PM Re: will selective com. fishing ruin sportfishing ? [Re: Lucky Louie]
Salmo g. Offline
River Nutrients

Registered: 03/08/99
Posts: 13521
L Louie,

Just because you suggest something, and include your reasoning, doesn't equal myth busting. Sorry, it doesn't work that way. The legal standard for persuasion in arguments or debate of this sort is clear, cogent, and convincing evidence. And it's generally missing from 99% of the posts in these on-going threads.

Sg

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#648788 - 12/29/10 12:25 PM Re: will selective com. fishing ruin sportfishing ? [Re: boater]
Salmo g. Offline
River Nutrients

Registered: 03/08/99
Posts: 13521
Originally Posted By: boater
Originally Posted By: Salmo g.
Boater,

I doubt it. The issue should be of concern to most. However these threads always go sideways with posts that are sarcastic to idiotic, like yours, posts in response to posts 6 or 12 posts earlier without referencing them, posts that just lob fuel on a fire with no constructive or informative intent whatever, like many of yours. You seem to think it's an important subject, and you contribute unproductive posts endlessly, so I have to conclude you're really only here for the perverse entertainment with no intent toward constructive discussion. I guess another possibility is that you're the idiot that some posters call you.

Sg


a typical response from a non-thinking cca member


And a typical unconstructive and useless post by Boater. Hell, I'm even on your side in this, you idiot!

Sg

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#648796 - 12/29/10 12:45 PM Re: will selective com. fishing ruin sportfishing ? [Re: Lucky Louie]
boater Offline
Three Time Spawner

Registered: 07/01/09
Posts: 1760
Loc: common sense ave.
Originally Posted By: Lucky Louie
[

I suggest that the highly contested---” gill net VS selective live capture gear equals no ESA listed saving” is incorrect and that 50 % ESA listed can be saved by using the new selective capture gear.



one of the guiding principals for the wdfw is the new Hatchery and Fishery Reform policy http://wdfw.wa.gov/commission/policies/c3619.html, one of the guiding principals in that is the 21st Century Salmon and Steelhead Initiative http://wdfw.wa.gov/publications/00036/draft_framework_20090131.pdf, now, for some unknown reason your thinking that gillnets are going away and we are going to a total new commercial harvest method and i`d have to ask "where did you wish you heard that" ?, i`d suggest that you ask who ever it was that told you that why the 21st century initiative calls for having a net drop out study done by the year 2040 is there that much drop out in purse seines or beach seines ?, plus, do you realy think the non-tribal commercials are going to give up harvesting upriver brights ??, i dont.

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