Hey I do agree with the baitfishing ideal.. I know that many released baitfish do NOT survive...
I dont want to stir anything up so please people do not use this as a post that is trying to create havoc of any sort.
The thing is though... I cant afford to get into flyfishing. And its tough to have to go through with the whole thing of learning how to fish all over again. I do have a flyrod.. One of the cheaper beginners sets. I break it out every now and then, but its not nearly as productive for me as my baitfishing.
I'm just trying to say that, please understand that many bait fishers would love to get into flyfishing, but either cannot afford, do not know how, or even dont know what it really is.
Once again, I am NOT trying to create ANY kind of argument, and if the moderator would like me to take this to private messages I will not even hesitate to oblige.

Tight lines all

Curtis

Hi Curtis:
Hey I'm never really in the mood to argue either, I just like to preach conservation
because I think the long term future of all fishing depends on it and we're not adopting it nearly fast enuff.. Bait fishing does still it's place for those younger and those unable to afford or master flyfishing C&R.
My main complaint is that you baiters have it nearly ALL while we have a piddiling few
lakes that are getting so overcrowded it's a shame to fish them on a weekend. And that you get a new crop of planters to jerk out and eat every year while they ignore lakes like Blue and Aenias after rehabing and don't even suppliment them enuff to keep the fishing good.

Your flyfishing can be amazingly much more productive than Powerbaiting. I love to Bait (no pun intended) the powerbaiters sometimes by fishing out front of them nailing fish after fish while they catch the occasional fish. Love to hear them squeal "God he's got another one, wonder what he's a usin??" The only time bait is more effective than flies is early in the year when most lakes are very low on natural food.
So if your doing better on bait it's only because you've failed to learn the more commonly effective
flyfishing methods of Chironomiding (bobber fishing with a pupa fly) and/or nymph dragging (trolling sloooowly with a sinking line and fly). Neither one is particularly expensive nor hard to learn compared to Dry Fly fishing,which everyone thinks of when someone says Flyfishing. Now that's hard to learn and can be real expensive.

Hey I have a 5/6 wt... Will that work well for trout? It certainly seems like they dont fight as much... But I've heard a 5/6 is for steelhead mostly.
Also... If youre ever on the west side of the mountains, send me a message or put it on the board so i can maybe meet up with ya. I'd certainly like to learn to flyfish better, but I do need to stick with mostly bait for now.

Big Bad: 5/6 is fine for trout, that's what I use since I like lakes and rivers. Some of the bigger rivers need a heavier weight to hit the sweet spot. I have also found it helpful in assisting me in keeping the big ones out of the weeds. Now, TM tends to use his noodle 2 weight and swears by it. He's had a little problem hooking up lately, but that will change. Use what you got & enjoy. There are some good packages out there through Cabela's and others. Won't set you back a fortune. Seems to me that the big additional expense is in the spare spools & line for the different types of fishing.

If you've got it, use it!

Hey Big Bad VD (I'm sorry, I just can't resist). I hope you are reading the new articles from The Frugal Fly Fisherman (link is on the front page, left side bar under "Features"). He wrote a GREAT article on rods this issue and I am really looking forward to his next imstallments. I'd break out my old fly rod but I'm not ready to return to that type of fishing. Guess at this stage in my life I like to sit in my boat and motor around. Yes, I know it's not the same skill set as fly fishing but it does have it's place and I do enjoy it. I think you should enjoy your baitfishing and if someday you're able to get into flyfishing, more power to you. The important thing is to enjoy the resource and treat it with respect. Limit your catch, etc. Maybe we can get more flyfishing and selective gear only lakes - I think that would be appropriate, too.

Mike, I agree with you, but I enjoy just sitting back on the boat and still fishing (keeps the blood pressure down LOL). Since I am a lake fishing guide for trout I am a baiter and proud of it, (or maybe just set in my ways LOL). But, everyone in my boats obey the laws, all of them, as a matter of fact some times they aren't interested in catching a full limit, just getting out and fishing. Which is what it is all about.
Fishinfellas, I have lobbied the WDFW for more selective gear lakes for you as I said I would. Upon doing a tally, you guys are short on places to go, and I hate to see overcrowding on our waters. All you had to do was ask.
Tight lines to all on this holiday weekend and please obey the laws, one final comment, not ALL baiters are bad, there are alot of us that are trying to help, anyway we can.
Banock

The cost of fly fishing gear is not as much as it seems. You go out and spent oodles of cash on spinning outfits and think nothing of it. But when you think of fly fishing you all run and hide. I used to be that way. But I changed,and now all my stupid spending goes into flys,lines,pole repairs,and new reels.

Every time something new comes out it seems that I need it. But being that I'm retired and on a fixed income I have to watch what I buy.

I started out cheap a long time ago. A fiber glass rod,with a cheap reel that you couldn't palm and a DT6 line. I then went out and beat the waters to death.

i agree with you voodoo, fly fishing is somewhat expensive and whats worse then the cost is understanding how to approach the whole thing. when i'm on a stream i theoreticly know where to put the fly on the water, but am at a complete loose as to where to start in terms of which flys on what line, size, color, ect. whats even worse is when i'm faced with a lake, the little understanding i do have is on moving water. it's a huge wall to try and figure out how to climb.

by the way fishinfellas if i pieved you off a couple of weeks ago i apologize, something struck an unexpected nerve.

Hey Mike, I've read EVERYTHING the Frugal Flyfisher has written so far, and have even talked to him on AIM and through e-mail. The whole section is an awesome idea, and his advice has enabled me to catch my SECOND flyfished fish off a bugger in the green river... a lil 9 incher but hey, its bigger then the last... its gettin better and better!

I see nothing wrong with baiting. I personally like sitting on my butt and fishing from a boat or the beach.

As long as everyone sticks to their limits, we all will have plenty of fish for YEARS to come.

Big Bad,
Glad to hear the Frugal Guy helped you out. It is awesume when someone with a lot of fishing knowledge e-mails me out of the blue with information and a desire to share with other anglers. I agree with you, the Frugal Fisherman is going to be a great addition to this web site.

Hi guys, I'm just back from Rock Lake near Kelowna Canada. It's up on the connector. I had a blast except that the 4th. waz windy with hail all day. Skunked out in the morning and sat by the fire all afternoon. The other two days I got 8 and 11 fish all from 2 1/2 to 5#. Couple of 5# just tore off line. One I lost got so much line out I couldn't believe it then started shaking and rolling and came off.
Shushi: No one peeves me off though sometimes I may sound like it, I'm a pretty cool guy.
I understand all fishing points of view,but like I say, I believe flyfishing and C&R is the future of our sport , so I'd love to make powerbaiting socially unacceptable....Right NOW.
Regarding the question someone ask about rod weights, heavier weights have their place,especially if you need to cast into a breeze dry fly fishing.
But I'm a proponent of ultralight flyrods. I land many big trout on a 2 1/2 oz. 2 wt. full flex rod from Orvis. It's very forgiving of my Steelhead reflexes when I'm chironomiding and get too excited. Only possible pblem asde from poor casting distance is you gotta let them run the first two or three lunges and like Microbrew mentions if theres weeds, well, kill that one goodby.
For a first rod for beginners I'd recommend a 4 wt. medium action if you're going to do any
Chironomiding....which you better around here.

hey thanks a bunch! I will definitely be saving for a new flyrod soon.
tell me if you are ever fishing a king county lake so we can hook up and do a little CPR

Hey Voodoo, I avoid W. Wash like the Plague now. Spent too many years over there
because I had to. Discovered a FEW great troutfishing spots and Steelheaded and Salmon
fished a lot,but for trout there is NO REASON for me to go to W. Wash. ever again. Sorry,
but if you ever get over this way......well I can show you what real troutfishing on the
flyrod is all about.
Sushi mentioned that all his/her? experience is on moving water and lakes are a mysterious
puzzle that's hard to crack. Well actually a lake is easier to analyize than most streams.
The feed is in the littoral zone, that area where sunlight reaches the bottom and weeds and
plankton/nymphs that support the food chain are. Generally this is from 3 feet deep to 15-20 feet deep depending on water clarity. The feeding fish (not all fish at any one time are feeding) are where the feed is. Not all spots in the littoral zone are as rich as others, some may be too rocky or hardpan soil etc.
Usually the inlet and outlet areas of a lake if they exist, are very rich. Good places to start.
Other ways to find the fish in a lake:
Go where the other fishermen are concentrated especially the "old hands" on a lake if you know any.
Where is the Loon concentrating his fishing....go there.
Where are the swallows feeding....under them are the trout eating the hatching chironomids.
Use your fishfinder to find concentrations of fish....if you have one.
Large relatively flat areas of 6-12 feet deep with a fast dropoff to deeper water are good chioronmid spots.
Look for the deepwater edges of dense weedbeds...always an area where trout will search food.
Once you find a hotspot on a lake remember it...map and write it down. It will usually pay off
time after time.
Lakes are no mystery,they are actually easy to read....if the fish are still there that is!

FF - Nice to see your comments. Sounds like Canada was good. Guess I'm going to have to try out a 2 wt., but that means another reel and set of spools. I tend to use the heavier rig for the bigger rivers, which tend to get windy. At times, my casting is questionable, so the heavier weight helps(?)!

Hey thanks a bunch for the help.. I'll head out to deep lake today and try that out.

I know of a creek that runs into it, so ill check there first, and I know of one area where the brush is really thick... So I'll try there and a little deeper around that point. I'll buy some chrononids before I go.

Hey do you ever fish near MarDon Resort? My dad wants to head over there soon, so we could probably break off and try out a different lake id that would be alright. I went out yesterday and tried a woolly bugger yesterday with my bait rod... just for the fun of it. I rigged it up with a small split shot and actually got a bite, it was great

You think that your casting is questionable. You should of seen me yesterday on the Stilly. I was using a 6wt fwd with a weighted fly on just about too long of a leader. Until I got my rythem down,I was all over my self. I got wrapped around my pole,my arms,my legs. I guess I put on quite a show.
I think that you get that way when you don't fish all of the time. I haven't been able to get out but once a week. No I don't work,I end up watching kids.

Old Man - Been there! I know that barbless is the way go for C & R, but I find it more important when removing that hook from my hand and clothing. Never could cast heavily weighted stuff worth a darn, like to lead eye zonkers. A lot of ducking involved.

I like the bigger corkies for chironomid and mayfly nymph fishing because you
can keep them in sight easier and you can use a small shot with them without
sinking the indicator on windy days. The shot keeps your chironomid vertical
more of the time when the wind is pushing your bobber around.

Anyhow, my casting with the 2 wt and bobber is soooo bad that I hesitate to
even call it casting. a 15-20 foot flip is maximum for me. Untangling snarls and
wind knots is a big part of the game on those windy days.

Micro, if you do get a 2 wt. full flex for chironomiding I highly recommend the
Orvis full flex Silver Label. It's very soft action and very forgiving, but you can
put a lot of pressure on large fish without worry of busting the high modulus
graphite. And do get a good 3 wt line for it. Those 2 wt lines just have no load
and if you ever try useing the rod without a bobber to cast you'll be disappointed
unless you got the added load factor of a 3 wt. The rod can easily handle it.

Being the highly edumicated fly fisher that I am, I will agree with f.f. with the two wt. I have both floating and an intermediate sinking line that I love to fish with. A 27" bow was taking from the used to be secret lake in november with it. I have a gl lomis gl4 2wt. And I love it.

Hey Voodoo, If you skunk out at Deep with those newly purchased Chironomids
I talked you into.....DON"T loose the faith.
I forgot to mention that everything has it's season and now is not particularly
Chironomid season (Except at 5000' in Canada). There are usually good
second generation hatches of Chironomids on most mud bottomed lakes in W. Wash
around Mid September depending on elevation and running to late October most
years.

I went out today... had my fly line trailing and my buddy had a wedding ring and worm trailin us. we were goin nice and sloooow for trolling, and what do ya know, we only get this stupid little perch... I hate perch...they would be cool, but the fact that i could reel them in with one finger if i tried just ruins it. I dont blame anything cause that red wedding ring usually limits us, so it was just a bad day. i definitely have NOT given up on 'nids