This reminds me of the Coho that return to the upper Willamette (Tualatin and yamhill rivers). These fish are not truly native according to ODFW. They began planting them in the 1920's and stopped in the 40's. They have managed to reproduce and on some years thrive over the past 70 years without any help. In fact, both of those rivers mentions have been strait up $hitholes for many years. Last 2 years there have killer returns. ODFW considers them evasive species...... Tuff goddamn fish either way.

+10000 on that statement if the runs being kept alive with hatchery fish it ain't Wild.

Where you've truly failed is driving anyone that wants to get involved in this marine resources mess, away with your caustic behavior, belittling and know-it-all attitude and have absolutely zero credible progress to show for it.

We agree on one thing, you have failed!


Fishy

Hmmm, No.... He hasn't....

One thing that is factual is Boater is up on his fishing politics and he's spot on with CCA...

Keith

i agree, me and a few others here have tried alot of different ways to get people like you to understand whats going on and we have failed, i`m to the point now of just sitting back and waiting for the right time to say "i told you so" and i`m sure a few others here will say that to.

What a burden...

Poor Boatless

you should change you nickname to clueless because you really don't have a clue

Boater-less said(i`m to the point now of just sitting back and waiting )

There you go, that is about what I could expect from someone of your ilk!

Most of us here would love to hear the silence.


Fishy

i`m probly going to be gone for awhile as i am going to be writing a book called " fisheries management for dummies" and i think to be the nice guy i am i think you deserve the first copy because your one of "them" that need the most help.

You'll probably just copy and paste like most of your posts and break your arm patting yourself on the back, just like you do when you alone pronounce that you have all the answers to our marine resources problems. Problem with that is you have not put any of that into action, so I won't hold my breath about the book.
Course there is that pesky problem of learning to write, putting things together in a cognitive sentence structure and then there are all those distracting punctuation marks.
No, I think you will just linger on doing the same old thing that has gotten us to this point, after all that has been what you have done all along!

Fishy

probably? jury deadlocked?

Far be it from me to get in the middle of you guys having a little "look who's penis is smaller" conversation...but I'm going to anyway.

boater may be boatless, but he's not wrong...the CCA Kool-Aid must be strong at those auctions, because things like math, logic, and plain ol' common sense don't seem to ring true to those who have had a glass or seven...

Anyone who thinks killing the same amount of ESA fish, while the commercial guys catch more hatchery fish, is good for anything but hatchery managers and commercial fishermen needs their head examined.

Fish on...

Todd

Ahh Toddy, I will leave the penis measuring to you and your buddies.

You guys should get together and form your own "I will stand around and denounce anyone's effort to make changes to protect our marine resources club." If you clowns have the the grand scheme I am sure there are millions of people in the NW that would love to hear it. Improve the habitat, who wouldn't like that? When you raze your house let me know so I can bring the marsh mallows. Remove the dams? Not ever going to happen( talk about kool aid drinking!)
You have to gain a foot hold before you can begin to climb.

Good luck boys!


Fishy

Fishy, I work on fisheries issues on a daily basis, on all different kinds of issues from habitat (including dams, land use, etc.), harvest, hatchery reform, the structure of fisheries...the whole shebang.

With a few exceptions of "getting the word out" when important meetings are happening, or significant comment from all sportsmen is necessary, I don't do it on the InterWebz...nor do I do it for glory, for myself or any organization.

I've been "front man" for lots of stuff in the past, but I didn't find it to be as helpful as I had hoped, in many ways...I spend most of my time in this realm now being a sounding board, helping others define what the issue is that they are really after, what changes they need in order to achieve their goals (the "goals vs. positions" discussion...most useful)...and sharing the information I have that I hope people will find useful, when they ask.

When I think that my personal participation is what needs to happen, then I do it...thankfully I find that that's almost never required, as whomever is asking for it can handle it just fine on their own, they just needed to know that.

For all the "gigantic" issues batted about all over the message boards, the infighting, arguing about this type of hatchery fish or that type of hatchery fish, this net or that net, catch and release versus kill some, or kill 'em all...a lot of folks seem to think these are the issues that are driving reform and activism...and they're incorrect.

This stuff is mainly just "rearranging the deck chairs on the Titanic", to borrow a phrase. Yeah, it feels good, and it even looks like things are getting done (whether or not they're things that actually do anything useful).

The "big stuff" is happening all around us, just not on the InterWebz...and most of the actual players, the actual decision makers, the generators of the science, politics, and laws...well, they're not here.

I think they like it that the cast of thousands who are up in arms about this or that, all the time, are busy rearranging the deck chairs...keeps them out of the way while the other stuff is happening.

Two thoughts:

1. Anyone who ever tells you that you "have to" join this group or that group, because they're the only ones who can save the world, is a goddammed idiot...period. They clearly don't know their ass from a hole in the ground.

2. Reviewing the concepts surrounding having goals, and having positions, is the number one...by far, very far...best thing that any person or group should spend some time doing. Having goals is necessary, and taking positions is how things change...not having a clear connection between the two is unfortunate, and far more likely to be the case than otherwise. It would be funny if it weren't so sad.

Fish on...

Todd

Very well said...

Keith

i agree 100 percent

Just admit you are wrong and you know going in the direction of seine nets will give away sporties fish.

Keith

he doesnt belive that because he didnt get that info in his 25 dollar fisheries expert information booklet from the cca

Even if this *is* the same topic/debate/argument that pops up ever spring, please keep the conversation civil. You all can argue with each other until your blue in the face, but stop the stupid name calling and childish crap that always seems to be the result of this topic.

The "Boss" has hired "extra help" to keep the crap around here to a minimum.

Y'all been warned. There's a new Sheriff in Town and he's quick on the draw.