http://finance.yahoo.com/news/US-loses-A...set=&ccode=

screw s&p. their crappy job of rating mortgage backed securities is one of the reasons the economy fell off the cliff.

now we're supposed to trust them as they just cost the american taxpayers tons of money due to likely interest rate increases.

the ratings agencies are just corporate madoff's.

Look for Turbo Tax Timmy to be sh!t canned next week.

So I see that Rubio is a concern for the Dems.

Todays paper reports that S&P made a 2 Trillion mistake in it rateing calculation. After their steller performance in the Bush crash, I wonder how anyione can pay any attention to them.

Dave, the S.P said before the debt ceiling debate that they wanted to see 4 trillion in cuts over ten years, we only cut 2.5 trillion which is mostly back loaded. If it wasn't for the Tea Party, that 2.5 trillion would have been one trillion.

Not so much the math was wrong the bone of contention was assumptions on the economy that S&P modified after the Treasury Dept went nuts.

Late on Friday, the Treasury said the rating agency's debt calculations were wrong by some $2 trillion. S&P confirmed it changed its economic assumptions after discussion with the Treasury Department but said it did not affect its decision to downgrade. "We take our responsibilities very seriously, and if at the end of our analysis the committee concludes that a rating isn't where we believe it should be, it's our duty to make that call," David Beers, head of sovereign ratings at S&P, told Reuters.

The theme running throughout S&P's analysis is the breakdown in the ability of the Democratic and Republican parties to govern effectively. The agency said that policymaking and political institutions had weakened in the past few months "to a degree more than we envisioned." This has major implications for the nation's budget and debt problems.

The S&P offices should be bulldozed, and every one of their chief officers should have his or her ass kicked half way around the block.

Their rating system is a disgrace.

Almost as disgraceful as our Congress and Executive branch........but I digress.

You may remember that the plan Obama was pushing was a 4 Trillion cut. That was scuttled because the tea party republicans would rather see us crippled than put the tax rate back where it was 10 years ago - when we had a surplus.

Had Bush left things alone and began using the surplus to pay down the debt we would not be in this fix. Instead he started two wars and a big new prescription program with no funding for any of them. Then he cut taxes - primarily for the wealthy. The dems like to tax and spend, but in recent years the republicans liked to spend and borrow. Both get blame for the deficit which has been growing since before Reagan, but the failure to solve the current mess rests firmly with the republican’s unwillingness to tax their base.


We can eliminate the problem quite rapidly if we make the cuts Obama and Boehner agreed to and put the tax rate back where it was. The only "crisis" here is due to pure political posturing. Why are the Republicans so unwilling to make any sacrifices for their country?

http://www.mcgraw-hill.com/site/our-businesses/mcgraw-hill-financial



Here's another one of McGraw Hill's companys to go along with Standard & Poor, seems alittle cozy to me.

Dave, the libs and some moderates said they would never approve of Obama's plan, due to the cuts of Social Security and Medicare. Not to mention a restriction of cost of living increases and a increase in Medicare. This all but seals Hussein's re-election, he will be forever remembered as the biggest failure in the history of the presidency.

The libs didn't like the big cuts but Obama was statesman enough to actually go against his base and propose those cut anyway. It was the republicans that rejected any form of compromise. Can you show me anyway in which the Rs compromised?

As to whether or not he gets reelected that's debatable. If the economy stays in the tank and the Rs nominate a moderate he will not be reelected. If the Rs nominate a nutcase like Bachman or Palin America will hold it's collective noses and reelect Obama.

He has been a disappointment to most of us, but not an embarrassment like Bush. Let’s not forget who started this mess. It was not Obama. He has not cleaned it up as well as we would like but we have gone form, losing 700,000 jobs a month to breakeven, from GM and America's biggest banks on the verge of collapse to where they are turning a profit again. We were on the brink of a total collapse of our economy. Thank you GWB! Now we have an anemic economy. I see that as a major improvement. I can only thank god we didn’t elect someone who would have let America slide into another great depression.

I said this when he was elected and I will say it again. Whoever get elected they have a good chance of becoming a one term president. We have massive financial problems, two or three wars, with others looming and a complete incompetent congress. Whoever gets the job will absolutely have to make major cuts to popular programs and or increase taxes. American’s are way to selfish to reelect anyone who might ask them for any sacrifice.

You guys seriously think making the bush era tax cuts expire would do ANYTHING to our deficit? I honestly don't even care about those tax cuts, let em expire, but that will not even put a dent in our problem.

"According to the nonpartisan Tax Policy Center, making all of the Bush tax cuts permanent, as opposed to following the Obama proposal, would cost the federal government $680 billion in revenue over the next 10 years."

$680 BILLION over 10 years... so what that's $68 Billion a year in additional revenue from taxes... wow that really seems like a lot of money when compared to the $4.1B a day that is currently being added to our deficit under the current administration. NOT

Bush spent A LOT of money. Obama spends more than double that. We're all screwed no matter who's in office unless they do some serious spending cuts.

What's embarrassing is electing a POS based on the color of his skin...How's that working ?

Wha't really embarrassing is Americans who spew above comments.... To make excuses for their party's loss in the last election. McCain/Palin? Really? Not sure that was even an option.

I guess when your side wins an election it's because people voted with their brains and when the other side wins it's somehow based on..... ?

I'm no lib and didn't vote for Slowbama but 8 years of Shrub put the R's in a place that can't be dug out of easily. Now, I don't see either of the two parties as much of an option.

Vasiliy

Dont know where you got your data but the first hit I got when Googling this came up

“The health care programs are the main drivers of that growth,” the CBO said, responsible for 80 percent of the projected rise in spending on those programs over the next 25 years.

Tax collections could keep pace with those costs if Congress permitted the George W. Bush tax cuts to expire on schedule in 2012 and allowed the alternative minimum tax to hit millions of additional households, the CBO said. But under current tax policies, the CBO said, tax collections would barely cover the cost of the health and retirement programs alone by 2035.

“If policymakers are to put the nation on a sustainable budgetary path, they will need to let revenues increase substantially as a percentage of GDP, decrease spending significantly from projected levels, or adopt some combination of those two approaches,” the CBO report said.

The report cautions that taking either action now “would probably slow the economic expansion. However, the sooner that medium— and longterm changes to spending and revenues are agreed on— and the sooner they are implemented after the period of economic weakness — the smaller will be the damage to the economy from rising federal debt.”

And the economic damage of inaction could be huge, the CBO said. If current policies are unchanged and the national debt continues to grow, the U.S. economic output could be as much as 6 percent smaller than current projections by 2025 and as much as 18 percent smaller by 2035.

Despite the growing danger, both major political parties have declared their resistance to the types of policy changes that would be necessary to rebalance the federal budget, at least as part of the debt-reduction talks currently under way between Vice President Biden and six lawmakers from both parties.

Democrats have ruled out major changes to health and retirement programs, while Republicans have ruled out any increase in tax revenue, a position Senate Minority Leader Mitch McConnell (R-Ky.) emphasized Wednesday.

“I think I can safely say, this Congress is not going to raise taxes, so why are we still talking about it?” McConnell told reporters at a breakfast hosted by the Christian Science Monitor. “So, look, taxes aren’t gonna be raised.”

How about getting the 51% that freeload off this country to chip in something? Is that asking too much?

Yes.

http://news.yahoo.com/usps-posts-3-1-billion-loss-q3-warns-145707721.html



Here's one agency that needs to be phased out and turned over to private enterprise.

This sh!t ain't helping.
It's easy to dismiss individual programs that
Benefit non-citizens until they're put together
And this picture emerges. Someone did a lot
Of research to put together all of this data.
Often these programs are buried within other programs making them difficult to find.


A Real Eye Opener ...
WHY is the USA BANKRUPT?

Informative, and mind
Boggling!


You think the war in Iraq was costing
Us too much? Read this:

We have been hammered with the
Propaganda that it was the Iraq war and
The war on terror that is bankrupting us.


I now find that to be RIDICULOUS.


I hope the following 14 reasons are
Forwarded over and over again until
They are read so many times that the
Reader gets sick of reading them. I also
Have included the URL's for verification
Of all the following facts...


1.
$11 Billion to $22 billion is spent on welfare
To illegal aliens each year by state governments.

Verify
At: http://www.fairus.org/site/PageServer?pagename=iic_immigrationissuecenters7fd8 <


2.
$22 Billion dollars a year is spent on food
Assistance programs such as food stamps,
WIC, and free school lunches for illegal aliens.

Verify
At: http://www.cis.org/articles/2004/fiscalexec.HTML <http://www.cis..org/articles/2004/fiscalexec.HTML>;


3.
$2.5 Billion dollars a year is spent on
Medicaid for illegal aliens.

Verify at:
http://www.cis.org/articles/2004/fiscalexec.HTML <http://www.cis.org/articles/2004/fiscalexec.HTML>;


4.
$12 Billion dollars a year is spent on
Primary and secondary school education
For children here illegally and they
Cannot speak a word of English!

Verify
At: http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANscriptS/0604/01/ldt....0.HTML <http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANscriptS/0604/01/ldt.....0.HTML>;


5.
$17 Billion dollars a year is spent for
Education for the American-born
Children of illegal aliens, known as
Anchor babies.

Verify
At http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANscriptS/0604/01/ldt.01.HTML <http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANscriptS/0604/01/ldt.01.HTML>;


6.
$3 Million Dollars a DAY is spent to
Incarcerate illegal aliens.

Verify at:
http://transcripts.cnn.com/%20TRANscriptS/0604/01/ldt.01.HTML <http://transcripts.cnn..com/%20TRANscriptS/0604/01/ldt.01.HTML>;
http://transcripts.cnn.com/%20TRANscriptS/0604/01/ldt.01.HTML <http://transcripts.CNN..com/%20TRANscriptS/0604/01/ldt.01.HTML><http://transcripts.CNN.com/%20TRANscriptS/0604/01/ldt.01.HTML <http://transcripts.cnn.com/%20TRANscriptS/0604/01/ldt.01.HTML>; >




7.
30% percent of all Federal Prison
Inmates are illegal aliens.


Verify
At: http://transcripts.CNN.com/TRANscriptS/0604/01/ldt.01.HTML <http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANscriptS/0604/01/ldt.01.HTML>;
<http://transcripts/ <http://transcripts/>; ..CNN.com/TRANscriptS/0604/01/ldt.01.HTML%3E <;;



8
$90 Billion Dollars a year is spent on
Illegal aliens for Welfare & social
Services by the American taxpayers.


Verify
At: http://premium.cnn.com/TRANSCIPTS/0610/29/ldt.01.HTML <http://premium.CNN.com/TRANSCIPTS/0610/29/ldt.01.HTML>


9..
$200 Billion dollars a year in suppressed
American wages are caused by the illegal
Aliens.


Verify
At: http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSC RI PTS/0604/01/ldt.01.HTML <http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSC%20RI%20PTS/0604/01/ldt.01..HTML>;



10..
The illegal aliens in the United States
have a crime rate that's two and a half
times that of white non-illegal aliens.
In particular, their children are going
to make a huge additional crime
problem in the U.S. .


Verify
at: http://transcripts.cnn..com/TRANscriptS/0606/12/ldt...01.HTML <http://transcripts.cnn..com/TRANscriptS/0606/12/ldt..01.HTML>;



11.
During the year of 2005, there were 4
to 10 MILLION illegal aliens that
crossed our Southern Border, also,
as many as 19,500 illegal aliens from
Terrorist Countries. Millions of pounds
of drugs, cocaine, meth, heroin and
marijuana, crossed into the US from
the Southern border.


Verify
at: Homeland Security Report:


12.
The National policy Institute estimated
that the total cost of mass deportation
would be between $206 and $230 billion
or an average cost of between $41 and
$46 billion annually over a five year
period.


Verify
at: http://www.nationalpolicyinstitute..org/PDF/deportation.PDF <http://www.nationalpolicyinstitute..org/PDF/deportationPDF>



13..
In 2006, illegal aliens sent home
$45 BILLION in remittances to their
countries of origin.


Verify
at: http://www/. <http://www/..rense.com/general75/niht.htm>; rense.com/general75/niht.htm <http://www/..rense.com/general75/niht.htm>;


14.
The Dark Side of Illegal Immigration:
Nearly One million sex crimes committed
by Illegal Immigrants In The United States .

Verify
at:
http: // www.drdsk.com/articleshtml <http://www.drdsk.com/articleshtml>;
<% 20w.drdsk.com/articleshtml <http://20w.drdsk.com/articleshtml>;


The total cost is a whopping
$ 3383 BILLION DOLLARS
A YEAR AND IF YOU'RE LIKE ME,
HAVING TROUBLE UNDERSTANDING
THIS AMOUNT OF MONEY; IT IS
$338,300,000,000.00 WHICH
WOULD BE ENOUGH TO STIMULATE
THE ECONOMY FOR THE CITIZENS OF
THIS COUNTRY.

Are we THAT Stupid?
YES, FOR LETTING THOSE
IN THE U.S. CONGRESS
GET AWAY WITH LETTING
THIS HAPPEN YEAR AFTER
YEAR!!!!!


If this doesn't bother you, then just
delete the message.. If, on the other
hand, it does raise the hair on the back
of your neck, I hope you forward it to every
legal resident in the United States .

"Facts" posted above re illegal immigrants are not accurate.

http://www.factcheck.org/2009/04/cost-of-illegal-immigrants/

Most of these - please forward me - emails are bogus. This one was. Fortunatly they can be checked out easily if one wants to take a few moments.

why check when one can blame the budget crisis on illegal immigrants, welfare queens, the poor, american workers, and whoever else had nothing to do with the true structural problems regarding the debt.

raise taxes (including tariffs), stop favoring unearned income in the tax code, stop the three wars and cut the defense budget and we'd be a lot closer to cleaning up the republican debt than if we continue their policies of drowning government in the bathtub. if you want tax cuts they should be for creating jobs in america, not overseas. we need to focus tax reform on helping restore american manufacturing, not continuing the "giant sucking sound" of jobs heading overseas. the rich will create just as many jobs with top tax rates 3-5% higher than they do now.

why we allow people who honestly want government to fail to frame the debate is beyond logic. their beliefs are no more valid than the kid who believes a fat man crawls down his chimney with presents on christmas.

the debt downgrade is part of grover norquist's plan to destroy government. the republicans gave us the debt problem and this is a result of their "hate america" policies.

you need to reload your pipe with plain tobacco that way your thoughts might make some sense.

Why would economy of scale work with Obamacare when it doesn't work in the rest of the federal government?

Because you have people who think the Govenment owes them.......because they're "special", I guess.

Hank

Reread your tag line quote. Then ask yourself if it doesnt seem hypocritical coming from a slave owner?

Maybe.

Gold = 1708.00 up 57.00.

Hank owns slaves?

Just 'cause he's from Cali doesnt mean he hires illegals....

The guy I ordered 175 lbs of 1oz. silver maple leaf's for back in early July is pretty happy. Got those in last week. Needed a hand truck for that pick-up.

This is really a fabricated paper debacle more than anything else. I'm hoping it clears up, but there certainly will be some money made on this. Plenty of blame to go around, to everyone involved.

S&P, who essentially sells their ratings to the companies they rate.

Politicians of all flavors. If you think your party isn't at fault, you are whacked.

American public, because we elected them, and we keep doing so.

The economy is in a lot better condition that we were 3 years ago. The real estate markets are recovering, not healthy, but they are recovering. Unemployment is making a gradual decline, even after taking into account folks who have dropped out of the measuremant stats, and bank closures have dwindled from a torrent to a trickle.

The is a correction, a bit stiff, but we will recover.

Vote them all out.

What's really embarassing is voting for a "guy I'd like to have a beer with".
Where'd our money go? Some seem to forget Homeland Security and TSA.

Shrub and his treasoness second to Hitler henchman:

Lower taxes squandering the surplus while......
Two wars.
Privatization with no bid contracts.
Two new massive administrations.
Lost entire pallets of cash to the tune of billions in Iraq.
BLM land giveaway to Halliberton et al (watch Gasland)
Attempt to corner the electrity market and bankrupt California (Enron).
Katrina failure.
mortgage crisis.
Attack all things environmental
accidently shooting your attorney in the face.....priceless.

As long as people want to blame everything on Bush we won't be able to move forward.

And until we see campaign reform that separates politicians from special interest cash, we will see more of the same from both parties.
Tell the voters what they want to hear, then after being elected they serve those that paid them the most.

It's your job as a voter to see through the BS. If you voted for Bush please discontinue doing this country a disservice by voting. If you voted Tea Party then ditto.

Can we move forward if I blame Obama for everything?

Then tell the D's to stop trying to out do the R's in picking dumb candidates. Al Gore and Kerry WERE NOT great choices. BO was not either but he is done with his OTJT and might do OK. His nearly three years learning the job have not been that hot. Hillary would have done a better job as she is a mean ole broad that knew the system. The D's have had some of the best to choose from but they head off with the PC crowd & down the tubes.

Besides neither party should want to win this next election. The long range economic forecast 2012 through 2014 keeps looking like something from hell. We are just at the start of this ugly thing and people have gotten used to getting things with out paying for them. The D's, under LBJ, started the Social Security / Medicare mess by flat stealing the money and moving it into the general run of things. Every President and both parties since has continued this and added to the mess by expanding things without funding. Even BO's health plan is a pile of crap ( I preferred single payer that was FUNDED ) as it is a trillion or more short 10 years out as they phonied up the numbers which was wrong. Health care is a right in my book but lying and deceit is not the way to get it implemented.

It isn't that the American people can not be bribed it is just that we aren't cheap!

Tea Party downgrade

That doesn't work either.

"You'll always be AAA to me."






Fk me.

Look at the monkey! Look at the monkey!

You know if that picture had someone elses face on it we would be hearing stlhead and many others here going nuts with rants about racism. All the local ballwashers would join in and it would continue for days. But with Bush we just "look at the monkey".

Yup, while the organ grinder was raiding your freedom, personal finances and future you were worshipping the monkey. The real irony is you'd still be entranced by the monkey if given a chance. Instead you complain that a miracle didn't come along and cure you from the monkey. Maybe this is what they mean by "a monkey on your back"?

Why is it so important to folks to fix blame? WE, by who who WE have elected over the decades (none of these problems happend overnight) are the root cause. And, like the issues with salmon recovery, solutions won't work overnight.

The whole blame game takes away from actually solving the problems we face, whether in salmon, finances, or wherever.

Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! --Homer Simpson

Not overnight. It took eight years. After four the whack jobs should have woke up. I know a lot of people, especially Bush apologists, aren't interested in preventing this from happening again. The blame game is no fun as it leads to a long look in the mirror. They want the reasons swept under the rug and magic dust sprinkled around to fix it. And, of course, Obama to take the blame so they can elect another Bush.

If a person can't see that both repubs and dems have heavy hands in this there isn't much chance of fixing it.

Yes this part is true: "there isn't much chance of fixing it."

I notice the Fed will keep interest rates at near zero into 2013. This means Corp America can continue to borrow near interest free and invest overseas NOT in America. It's your money.

Here's the host of your tea party:
"Former Alaska Gov. Sarah Palin, who plans to announce whether she will run for president sometime next month, said Monday night that she predicted the credit rating downgrade long ago."

Going thru life saying everything bad is someone else's fault is an easy out. It's time we all look in the mirror and take responsibility for voting these buffoons in office.

Palin has done nothing, yet people on the left look at her as the source of our problems. She's not in office. Find somewhere else to place your blame.

I don't think anyone's blaming Palin...just making fun of her lack of knowledge, analytical thought, and integrity...the only ones she's screwed are the Alaskans who voted her into office, and then got to watch her traipse around the country making a fool of herself, and then quit on the job they elected her to do.

I doubt anyone is much interested in fixing the problems...that's not how you win elections. You win elections by fixing the blame, preferably directly on your opponent, and failing that, on whomever is in the same party as your opponent, and then somehow linking them together under one banner.

Fish on...

Todd

To me, victory would be a strong America. I don't see that happening. Winning re-election should be based on how you helped America become strong. I don't see that happening.

It's about time people on both sides of the aisle walked on their state's capitol demanding change. I don't see that happening because people/voters don't care about uniting to build a stronger country. It's only about winning an argument on web forum. Looks like we're pretty much going to get what we deserve.

Palin is attepting to position herself as queen bee of the Tea Party. The Tea Party that has infested the severly wounded GOP post Bush. The Tea Party who wanted America to fail.

It won't happen but not for those reasons. It won't happen because change cannot negatively effect Corp America or the rich and the dissappearing middle class doesn't have enough blood left to give.

"If a person can't see that both repubs and dems have heavy hands in this there isn't much chance of fixing it."

You forgot the Supremes.

Ok.

The blame game, a wonderful tool to use for deflection.
How about that gorrila everyone ignores in the room corner.
AMERICAN CAPITALISM IS ONE GIANT FAILURE.

At least Bush didn't bow and curtsy to other foreign leaders.

" I don't think anyone's blaming Palin...just making fun of her lack of knowledge, analytical thought, and integrity "

Just caught that one T BUT you could apply that to most but just so we do apples to apples want to take a look at our buffoon VP Mr. Biden? Christ he makes Palin look like she is giving ole William Buckley a run for his spot in history!