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#77401 - 01/06/04 02:55 PM More on Muzzleloaders
brassonbrass Offline
Juvenille at Sea

Registered: 11/22/02
Posts: 103
Loc: Poulsbo
I appreciate the advice and help on choosing a muzzleloader, however, your thoughtful comments have led me to more questions. I noticed, thanks to one of your tips, that Cabelas is selling the T/C Black Diamond .50 cal for about $280. I noticed some of the other guns with bolt actions. Is it true that the true bolt action muzzleloaders completely protect the cap from the elements, therefore are illegal to use in our state?? Also, the MDM Buckwacka Magnum is a break-open muzzleloader. This gun looks really interesting and fun, however, the nature of the action again hides the cap from the elements, rendering it illegal for our state during muzzleloading season. True? Lastly, CVA makes a "Staghorn" and an "Eclipse" 209 Magnum muzzleloader for $99 and $119 respectively. Are they good rifles for the price, or junk, or somewhere in between? T/C also makes a muzzleloader for $199 called the "Wildcat". However, it has only a 22" barrel versus the 26" barrel on the Black Diamond and the 24" on the CVA's. I realize that a longer barrel will reduce noise, but does it also reduce recoil? Are longer barrels more accurate? I am not worried about the weight of the gun, hence, should I opt for a longer barrel? How much advantage will a 26 incher give me over a 24 inch barrel? Does anyone know the rate of twist on the T/C Black Diamond? The CVA's are a 1 in 28" twist. Is that going to give a guy good accuracy using conicals? Thanks again for all the help you guys and gals have offered. I truly appreciate having a place to ask local experts questions about hunting. Thanks. Brass

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#77402 - 01/06/04 03:44 PM Re: More on Muzzleloaders
HBP Offline
Spawner

Registered: 01/07/02
Posts: 941
Loc: Everett,Wa
I have a bolt action CVA that was about $150 from Cabelas.I bought it not knowing much about MLs,and I've been pleasantly surprised. It has a faster twist I think its about 1 in 28". It shoots conicals very well,the gun will shoot better than I can see with open sites. I can get about 4" groups at 100yds,and thats shooting over the hood of my truck. 100yds is my self imposed limit with my ML.

I havn't looked at MLs lately,but my bolt action does not act as any kind of shield for the nipple,the nipple is completly exposed.

I wouldn't hesitate to buy a CVA or Traditions or other less expensive ML if you don't know if you'll like a ML. I know I would have no problem killing a deer or elk with my cheapie ML.

I don't know if this applies to MLs or not,but generally,a longer barrel on a rifle will increase the bullets velocity. Usually an increase of 2" will net you about 100fps. The extra length of the barrel will allow more of the rifles powder to burn,before the bullet exits the end of the barrel.
_________________________
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#77403 - 01/07/04 10:21 PM Re: More on Muzzleloaders
Buck Offline
Juvenile at Sea

Registered: 01/17/02
Posts: 237
Loc: Tumwater Wa
Brasonbrass, Well first off not all bolt action type muzzleloaders are ileagal. You just need to make sure the bolt doesn't cover the niple. With that said, I like the T/C Black Diamond style the best, as you know for sure the nipple is exposed. It's bult is on a sprin and you pull it back to cock it. The other types that you mentioned, the ones that are like a single shot rifel or shot gun, aren't legal. They cover the cap. Also a 209 promer isn't legal either. So make sure if you don't buy a BLack Diamond, you get one that has a conversion for a percussion cap. The black diamonds come with that already. I said this before, but if I were to buy a new muzzleloader today, it would be the black diamond. And the longer barrel helps burn magnum charges better nad gives you more velocity. Which will equal more enrgy. Hope this helps. I know there are a few out here that know a lot more than I do about muzzleloaders. I would go with the T/C Black Diamond. I don't think you will be dissapointed.
Buck

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#77404 - 01/14/04 06:10 PM Re: More on Muzzleloaders
Jason Offline
Smolt

Registered: 11/25/02
Posts: 76
Loc: Lake Stevens, WA
Brassonbrass,

If you want to come up to the Everett area sometime and try out a couple inlines, I can meet you at the Everett Sportsmen Club range just outside Everett. I have a CVA Eclipse that I've tricked out a bit and a Knight Wolverine II that I just got this year, but I've got it almost to what I call perfect. You might get HBP (his location is shown as Everett) to show up and bring his gun, too, and we can have some fun making smoke. I might even bring my Hawken and flintlock to play with, too.

From my experience an extra 2" of barrel on a muzzleloader is lucky to give you half that much extra speed, and even then it will probably only do it if you are shooting a fairly lightweight (by muzzleloader standards) projectile. I've tried longer barreled muzzleloaders and now I'm back to using the 22" barreled Wolverine II. The shorter barrel gives the gun lighter weight, better balance, and it's a lot easier to maneuver through any thick stuff you may hunt in.

I've been into muzzleloaders pretty seriously for the last few years and would be happy to show you what you need and what you don't, as well as letting you try actually shooting some guns and giving you tips on making them work the best they can for you. Let me know if you're interested.

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