#943097 - 11/12/15 02:47 PM
So Why is the Nooch closed to Gamefish
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Spawner
Registered: 03/21/06
Posts: 723
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10/26 has it closed to Salmon 10/30 they added the Willipa system and closed both Grays harbor and Willipa system to all fishing 11/06 they open select river sections. I call and am told the Nooch is closed to all fishing, and may remain so until they have thier egg take for Steelhead, and the run has not even really started.... What gives?
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#943099 - 11/12/15 03:09 PM
Re: So Why is the Nooch closed to Gamefish
[Re: Met'lheadMatt]
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River Nutrients
Registered: 03/03/09
Posts: 4393
Loc: Somewhere on the planet,I hope
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No hatchery Coho ( thanks to not getting the Mitigation done ) so the only thing left in the river is salmon. The Dec Steelhead season is in reality a late Coho season be it Rec or Tribal and natural Coho are in a bit of a failed return. Now after Jan 1 your fish in the river will be Steelhead and I imagine there are concerns that the Steelhead will perform similar to Coho which is a drastically reduced number available for harvest.
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Dazed and confused.............the fog is closing in
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#943100 - 11/12/15 03:21 PM
Re: So Why is the Nooch closed to Gamefish
[Re: Met'lheadMatt]
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Repeat Spawner
Registered: 03/06/01
Posts: 1194
Loc: Gig Harbor, WA
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Extrapolating the coho return to predict hatch steel would be a bit of a stretch, no?
fb
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"Laugh if you want to, it really is kinda funny, cuz the world is a car and you're the crash test dummy" All Hail, The Devil Makes Three
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#943104 - 11/12/15 04:46 PM
Re: So Why is the Nooch closed to Gamefish
[Re: fishbadger]
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River Nutrients
Registered: 03/03/09
Posts: 4393
Loc: Somewhere on the planet,I hope
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Yup but it goes like that. They get the brood from the dam trap and I do not recall them not making eggtake. I imagine it revolves around the QIN Steelhead fishery in Dec which is in reality a Late Coho fishery. I guess it could be a reaction to the you fish I fish thing.
_________________________
Dazed and confused.............the fog is closing in
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#943107 - 11/12/15 05:47 PM
Re: So Why is the Nooch closed to Gamefish
[Re: Met'lheadMatt]
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River Nutrients
Registered: 03/08/99
Posts: 3513
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I call and am told the Nooch is closed to all fishing, and may remain so until they have thier egg take for Steelhead, and the run has not even really started.... What gives? At least for now, part of the justification for the complete closure is they don't want hooking mortality on the coho while game(steelhead) fishing. As Riverguy said, the wild coho returns are in the $hitter this year. Keeping it closed til' steelhead egg take is achieved? I don't agree with that all. For one thing, there's nothing to indicate a poor steelhead return at this point. If returns are grim by, say, the end of Feb….then close it. Too keep it closed after the coho are done, when it has a sizable hatchery winter run, and leave neighboring rivers open doesn't make sense………will they re-close all the GH rivers then until egg take is met?
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#943116 - 11/12/15 06:54 PM
Re: So Why is the Nooch closed to Gamefish
[Re: Met'lheadMatt]
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River Nutrients
Registered: 04/25/00
Posts: 5074
Loc: East of Aberdeen, West of Mont...
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Well let's see:
From the Hatchery report, as of 11/09/15
Summer run......Van Winkel Creek-----664 Wynoochee Trap------112 On Hand Adults-------154 Surplused--------------569
I'm betting there are summer run that some would like to catch, not me, but surplus/kill just doesn't make any sense on what is a high priority for many sportsmen.
That's all I have to say...on this topic.
_________________________
"Worse day sport fishing, still better than the best day working"
"I thought growing older, would take longer"
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#943150 - 11/13/15 08:17 AM
Re: So Why is the Nooch closed to Gamefish
[Re: Met'lheadMatt]
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River Nutrients
Registered: 10/28/09
Posts: 3314
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This doesn't make me happy, as the Nooch is my best local winter steelhead fishing option. That said, if our inability to fish for steelhead means the QIN can't fish for "steelhead" in December, I'm good with it. Last I checked, they were planning to fish for "steelhead," so maybe it just means we're getting shafted again. We'll see.
Salmon and steelhead bite similar stuff, but the presentations are usually pretty different, and I've only personally encountered one late coho while targeting steelhead on the Nooch in Dec.-Feb. I'm pretty sure it survived the 10 seconds it was hooked before breaking my steelhead leader like it was a noodle. I think the "you fish when we fish" thing is playing a part in this, but as I said, as long as the QIN isn't fishing to protect salmon, I'll accept not fishing to protect salmon.
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#943152 - 11/13/15 09:02 AM
Re: So Why is the Nooch closed to Gamefish
[Re: Met'lheadMatt]
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Juvenile at Sea
Registered: 01/09/07
Posts: 155
Loc: Olympia, WA
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The Nooch was loaded with summer run steelhead right before the closure, all hatchery fish. Maybe a lot of them were hatchery strays but there were a lot of them. My step son hooked 32 two days before the closure. I feel there should have no closure on the gamefish, only how we were allowed to fish for them. Selective Fishery Rules, no bait would have been sufficient to protect the salmon instead of closing the whole damn thing.
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#943153 - 11/13/15 09:41 AM
Re: So Why is the Nooch closed to Gamefish
[Re: Met'lheadMatt]
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Spawner
Registered: 03/21/06
Posts: 723
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I just don't know how they can lump Coho and Steelhead togather on predicting runs, Coho go who knows where, and don't steelhead cruse the coast line. I did not really see a drop in Columbia Steelhead, it appeared to be a longer sustained run. Numbers not far from predicted, But it was my best year to date, boat wise, with over 300 to the boat. I can see if they don't want pressure on the Coho in November. But if the Quin's go back to netting Wk 48, then the gamefish should also be opened Dec 1st. But overall this past year was awsome for both food and game fish, Maybe not Coho, but kings, starting in the Spring never ended thier push....Awsome
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#943158 - 11/13/15 11:42 AM
Re: So Why is the Nooch closed to Gamefish
[Re: Met'lheadMatt]
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River Nutrients
Registered: 11/21/07
Posts: 7410
Loc: Olema,California,Planet Earth
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Actually, we know were they go. Coho are essentially costal in the ocean, which is why the fisheries out there hammer them. Steelhead hit the high seas, way off the coasts. In fact, WA steelhead go over almost to Asia.
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#943160 - 11/13/15 11:43 AM
Re: So Why is the Nooch closed to Gamefish
[Re: Met'lheadMatt]
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Juvenile at Sea
Registered: 01/09/07
Posts: 155
Loc: Olympia, WA
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According to the WDFW In Season Hatchery Escapement Report as of 11/9/2015 shows a surplus of 562 steelhead returned to Van Winkle Creek and 62 surplus steelhead at the Wynoochee dam trap. Granted I do not want a summer steelhead to eat this time of year either but I would like an opportunity to go catch one. Any more we all buy our license just hoping we will be given an opportunity to use it.
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#943161 - 11/13/15 11:44 AM
Re: So Why is the Nooch closed to Gamefish
[Re: Met'lheadMatt]
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River Nutrients
Registered: 11/21/07
Posts: 7410
Loc: Olema,California,Planet Earth
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Salmo, since when did R6 have red face, chuckle, or professional ethics tests?
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#943184 - 11/13/15 02:34 PM
Re: So Why is the Nooch closed to Gamefish
[Re: Met'lheadMatt]
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Spawner
Registered: 03/21/06
Posts: 723
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I plan on calling back next week when Region Bio gets back from out of town meetings. I voiced my frustration, and was told I need to speak to The Bio that made the decision.
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#943189 - 11/13/15 03:30 PM
Re: So Why is the Nooch closed to Gamefish
[Re: Met'lheadMatt]
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River Nutrients
Registered: 11/21/07
Posts: 7410
Loc: Olema,California,Planet Earth
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So staff was not told why the decision was made? Good communication there, to be sure.
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#943190 - 11/13/15 03:37 PM
Re: So Why is the Nooch closed to Gamefish
[Re: FleaFlickr02]
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Repeat Spawner
Registered: 12/06/07
Posts: 1382
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Salmon and steelhead bite similar stuff, but the presentations are usually pretty different, and I've only personally encountered one late coho while targeting steelhead on the Nooch in Dec.-Feb. I'm pretty sure it survived the 10 seconds it was hooked before breaking my steelhead leader like it was a noodle. I think the "you fish when we fish" thing is playing a part in this, but as I said, as long as the QIN isn't fishing to protect salmon, I'll accept not fishing to protect salmon. [/quote]
Interesting because I have never caught one, maybe because I fish "Run-n-Gun". I would guess things will change soon after this blowout.
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"Life moves pretty fast. If you don't stop and look around once in a while, you could miss it.” – Ferris Bueller. Don't let the old man in!
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#943231 - 11/14/15 11:19 AM
Re: So Why is the Nooch closed to Gamefish
[Re: Met'lheadMatt]
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Ornamental Rice Bowl
Registered: 11/24/03
Posts: 12766
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Nooch may be the exception among the Chehalis tribs since it has summer steel available...
BUT...
For the most part, there are exceedingly few winter steel to be had until the last week of December. In the meantime, the system will be full of wild late coho... a species of conservation concern in 2015. The conservation concern for wild coho has been severe enough to warrant closing the entire system to not just salmon fishing but ALL fishing. Yes a handful of reaches in hatchery-producing tribs has bee re-opened for hatchery coho, but the rest of the basin remains closed at this time. The million dollar question is when to re-open for steel?
Looking at tribe gillnet data, when they start their so-called steelhead season, the encounter rate on steelhead is an order of magnitude less than late coho..... 10:1 with coho predominating.
It's not until the last week of December that it swings the other way 10:1 with steelhead predominating.
So if we want the QIN to suspend their fishery to lay low on wild late coho, the state has no choice but to do likewise.
The best indicator the state has for late coho is the late return to the Satsop hatchery at Bingham Creek. We don't really get a good feel for how well that late run is doing until the after the 3rd week in December. At that point WDFW can determine if the late coho run is of sufficient size to warrant additional H&R impacts from a rec fishery for steelhead.
If we're going to re-open, my advice would be to wait until at least Christmas to target steelhead in the Chehalis Basin. It's the intellectually honest thing to do.
_________________________
"Let every angler who loves to fish think what it would mean to him to find the fish were gone." (Zane Grey) "If you don't kill them, they will spawn." (Carcassman) The Keen Eye MDLong Live the Kings!
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#943232 - 11/14/15 11:23 AM
Re: So Why is the Nooch closed to Gamefish
[Re: Met'lheadMatt]
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Ornamental Rice Bowl
Registered: 11/24/03
Posts: 12766
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_________________________
"Let every angler who loves to fish think what it would mean to him to find the fish were gone." (Zane Grey) "If you don't kill them, they will spawn." (Carcassman) The Keen Eye MDLong Live the Kings!
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#943239 - 11/14/15 11:49 AM
Re: So Why is the Nooch closed to Gamefish
[Re: Met'lheadMatt]
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Ornamental Rice Bowl
Registered: 11/24/03
Posts: 12766
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Co-managers will soon be having some "uncomfortable" discussions to address just that.
_________________________
"Let every angler who loves to fish think what it would mean to him to find the fish were gone." (Zane Grey) "If you don't kill them, they will spawn." (Carcassman) The Keen Eye MDLong Live the Kings!
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