#972505 - 02/03/17 07:43 AM
Re: WDFW Blows it again!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
[Re: WDFW X 1 = 0]
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River Nutrients
Registered: 11/21/07
Posts: 7428
Loc: Olema,California,Planet Earth
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Predation, and the known solutions to it, have been known and implemented since at least the late 80's. At that time, WDF stopped shooting birds because they were just doing what they were programmed to do. Instead, netting and covers to rearing vessels were installed. That means that 25 years of knowledge and practice got ignored. And, as a fish cultures, you couldn't tell that you were feeding 300-500K less fish? Tacoma should look into the massive waste of food as well as DOE for the deliberate pollution of the Cowlitz by throwing all that excess food in.
I find in interesting that the head of the Fish Program, who came up through Hatcheries (working in the ponds, spawning the fish, rearing the fish) was not at the hearing defending the actions. Rather, folks who "manage" them were there.
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#972515 - 02/03/17 10:25 AM
Re: WDFW Blows it again!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
[Re: Carcassman]
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River Nutrients
Registered: 10/22/09
Posts: 3020
Loc: University Place and Whidbey I...
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That takes us back to the gist of my question. Exactly how was 2016 significantly different than all of the prior years? The fish density theory simply didn't fly with me (pun intended) and if there was truly such a huge, disproportionate loss compared to prior years and the birds did it - why wasn't that bird activity observed by staff?
Will we ever have a supportable explanation? Probably not.
_________________________
Remember to immediately record your catch or you may become the catch!
It's the person who has done nothing who is sure nothing can be done. (Ewing)
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#972524 - 02/03/17 12:45 PM
Re: WDFW Blows it again!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Alevin
Registered: 03/29/13
Posts: 19
Loc: Hood Canal
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If they are actually short of staff, a quick fix would be to take those scientific folks studying the nesting habits of the Yellow Billed Cuckoos ( which my Audubon books say their are few to none) could either be released from WDFG to do something personally more satisfying or moved to some project our license fees are supposed to support, like hatchery support. Just my $.02.
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#972534 - 02/03/17 04:07 PM
Re: WDFW Blows it again!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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River Nutrients
Registered: 11/25/01
Posts: 2844
Loc: Marysville
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Maybe I'm confused but I thought that the Cowlitz steelhead hatchery is a mitigation hatchery funded by Tacoma City Light for impacts from their dams. If so isn't the funding source outside of Fish and Wildlife and General funds - no reason (at budget reason) to be shorted staff for any extended period of time .
Curt
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#972535 - 02/03/17 05:27 PM
Re: WDFW Blows it again!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
[Re: WDFW X 1 = 0]
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Shooting Instructor for hire
Registered: 10/26/10
Posts: 7260
Loc: Snohomish, WA
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Even with the extremely low bar already set, a public utility is hardly going to be more efficient or effective than a government run agency. Maybe by a half measure, but not by much. KPI's and personnel performance metrics are foriegn concepts to both - as are proper staffing levels. Doing less with more is the saying. It wouldn't surprise me one bit if Tacoma Light ran off a skeleton crew.
None of it is acceptable. My guess is that someone REALLY screwed up and accidentally killed the fish and the agencies are trying to cover their tracks. You just don't lose 300 - 500K fish. I'm a firm believer that the longer it takes someone to come forward with a problem or issue, the more likely fvckery is afoot. Gotta have the time to formulate the excuse.
But...but...but...the birds ate them!
_________________________
“If the military were fighting for our freedom, they would be storming Capitol Hill”. – FleaFlickr02
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#972602 - 02/04/17 07:36 PM
Re: WDFW Blows it again!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
[Re: NickD90]
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Fry
Registered: 09/23/12
Posts: 30
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This is my favorite comment in this entire thread. And I agree wholeheartedly. I also don't think state taxpayers should bear any of the financial burden in fixing this mess. It should come out of TPU's pockets and any state funded hatchery staff that were paid to monitor those fish should be released and/or relocated.
_________________________
Always happiest with fish scales on my face.
"Hope I die before I get old" - Pete Townshend, The Who, Musician/Singer/Songwriter and Spokesperson of a generation.
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#972606 - 02/04/17 08:58 PM
Re: WDFW Blows it again!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
[Re: Salmo g.]
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River Nutrients
Registered: 10/22/09
Posts: 3020
Loc: University Place and Whidbey I...
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Money isn't the issue. TP spends $4,000,000 or so per year funding the Cowltiz hatcheries. Staffing shouldn't be an issue.
If the electronic fish counters are unreliable, which is common with that kind of equipment, how does WDFW know how many fish they are short? Does WDFW know how many steelhead and cutthroat were produced and released in any of the years since the electronic counters were installed? Absolutely on point. This really sheds doubt on all of the prior release numbers and could well explain - at least in part - poor rate of return numbers. During the hearing Sen. Pearson delved into the counter reliability and WDFW explained that the Cowlitz hatchery outflow with counter is unique to their hatchery system. That said, the counter was reported to have been calibrated as in prior years so any errors in 2016 should have been consistent with prior years.
_________________________
Remember to immediately record your catch or you may become the catch!
It's the person who has done nothing who is sure nothing can be done. (Ewing)
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#972683 - 02/06/17 08:39 AM
Re: WDFW Blows it again!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
[Re: WDFW X 1 = 0]
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The Tide changed
Registered: 08/31/00
Posts: 7232
Loc: Everett
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If WDFW cannot count fish in a pond, how confident can we be with the estimates in Rivers, Lakes, Sound, and the Ocean?
One has to wonder....
_________________________
You know something bad is going to happen when you hear..."Hey, hold my beer and watch this"
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#972738 - 02/07/17 08:07 AM
Re: WDFW Blows it again!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
[Re: WDFW X 1 = 0]
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My Area code makes me cooler than you
Registered: 01/27/15
Posts: 4549
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As far as I'm concerned they should put the guy who raises all the pheasants and plants them in charge of raising and planting the fish.
At least when people show up to hunt them they are always there.
Our fisheries are a train wreck. Heads should roll.
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#972818 - 02/07/17 10:29 PM
Re: WDFW Blows it again!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
[Re: WDFW X 1 = 0]
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Returning Adult
Registered: 04/28/10
Posts: 319
Loc: Adna
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Brett, rest assured no WDFW heads will roll in corrupt Region 5.
Biggest bunch of retards and liars that I have ever seen, this going at least twenty years. From Wolfe Dammers to pig nose Cindy and feckless Lee Van T. Screw the pooch on the job you were assigned, it's all good, no one will notice and we don't care if they should. We are un-elected power brokers and in totally in charge so don't even think you can suggest that we should be held accountable for the actions that we feel are needed to save the wild salmon from extinction.
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Just lettin' it roll, lettin' the high times carry the low Love livin' my life, easy come easy go
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#972831 - 02/08/17 08:52 AM
Re: WDFW Blows it again!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
[Re: WDFW X 1 = 0]
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My Area code makes me cooler than you
Registered: 01/27/15
Posts: 4549
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"Screw the pooch on the job you were assigned, it's all good, no one will notice and we don't care if they should."
I guess the only question that remains is what the hell are we gonna do with all the pups?
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#973817 - 02/24/17 12:45 PM
Re: WDFW Blows it again!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
[Re: WDFW X 1 = 0]
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River Nutrients
Registered: 10/22/09
Posts: 3020
Loc: University Place and Whidbey I...
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I was wading through the Senate Natural Resources and Parks Committee postings and found WDFW's presentation for those who may be interested: https://app.leg.wa.gov/CMD/Handler.ashx?...&att=false.
Edited by Larry B (02/24/17 12:45 PM)
_________________________
Remember to immediately record your catch or you may become the catch!
It's the person who has done nothing who is sure nothing can be done. (Ewing)
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