Look on the bright side... you'll always be able to buy a steelhead at pike place or eat one at a casino

While the tribes are *part* of the problem, they are not and have not been the whole problem.....Only a fool completely blames the tribes for the loss of the wild steelhead. We are just as much to blame.

Unfortunately, at this stage of the game, as we the sportsmen are no longer retaining wild steelhead and are further going at each other restricting how, where, and why we fish, with nothing to show for our efforts, I've seen little to nothing done on the tribal side of the equation to really and truly help out their beloved natural resource.

Our wild steelhead runs are not healthier. They are not better. They are getting worse. And it doesn't and won't matter what we do.

Didn't just Salma just preach to me how our steelhead runs are and have been in decline?

Why are the OP tribes till running their gillnets across the Hoh, Queets, Clearwater, Quil, etc?

Why do we, as a citizen of our state, sit around with our thumbs up our butt and let the tribes continue to rape and destroy our beloved natural resource and state fish?

But yes, in 20 years from now, the only wild steelhead we will see is on a dinner plate, or sold in a select market.

Nothing and no one will stop the tribal gillnet fishery until the last wild fish is gone.

Parker -
Not sure that I was preaching to you about the status of our steelhead but rather presented some information that over the last 30 years as the State's population has grown the wild steelhead abundances declined. Not sure the two events are entirely related by it does cause one to pause.

The comment that I did direct you was that you may have underestimated the skills of some of those that have opted to switch to fly fishing with non- fly gear.

Your point that if opportunity most be reduced that it time to shut things down is certainly valid though not sure everyone would agree. However following that logic with the ending of harvesting wild steelhead in recreational fisheries should have resulted in the complete closure of steelhead fishing.

If that is your position have you ended your steelhead fishing?

Curt

I have and it's left a huge, sad void in my life. If I wasn't sitting on 11 points ea. for quality bull and buck I wouldn't be buying a Wa fishing OR hunting license!

I've spent exactly one day fishing steelhead in the last three years .

The bottom line is fly fisherman are just comfortable with balls bouncing off their chin while on their hands and knees taking it from behind.

Catch and Release.

This fits the WDFW model perfectly.

It's been about two years since I've fished steelhead. Don't plan on buying a WA license this year

The reduction in smolt plants is the problem on PS rivers, many have no chance(green, puyallup, snoqualmie) in recovering wild steelhead to fishable numbers so why waste the money and time on it and instead plant large numbers of hatchery fish and leave the rivers open through spring to take the pressure off the OP.

That would require triage, actually "writing off" wild fish in those urbanizing streams. While it makes sense, folks won't do it because of the money involved. No recovery funds if no "wild" fish.

It's like the "Plant the **it out of the Cowlitz and only put wilds above the dams. That writes off the below dam tributaries. Won't do it.

Triage is exactly the right thing to do in this case, as is the smart thing to do financially. Imagine the economic impact in puget sound if just one system had a return like the cowlitz. Also less anglers fishing where wild runs of fish have a chance of being self sustaining.

Just imagine:

Paker,

That is exactly what the Wildcat Steelhead Club said in regards to the Skagit wild steelhead CNR season in 1985. That if the runs wouldn't support the traditional (at that time) season of killing two steelhead per day per angler, then just shut it all down. A major problem with that line of thinking is the exceedingly faulty assumption that the steelhead run will ever again at any future time be capable of supporting that kind of fishery. Ignoring reality won't make reality go away.

I just heard last weekend that the human population in the Seattle area alone is increasing by 200 people per day. Per DAY! Even 20 years ago the WA state population was increasing by more than 50,000 per year. Among those new residents, guess what? Many come here expecting to participate in outdoor recreation, including sport fishing.

The opinion you express is fairly common. Unfortunately, it's a head in the sand way of thinking. Those good ole days are not coming back. With twice as many people and the same number of rivers as there always were, the fishing conditions and opportunity we most want ain't a happening thing. It's not on the menu.

You've taken Fisheries 101 and beyond, so you understand the concepts. It's not about what you or Stam or I want. It's about what's possible, given the conditions at hand. Those conditions are about managing what opportunity that does exist to provide something along the lines of the maximum potential or optimal fishing opportunity possible. And we have to look forward, not backward, to see that.

Sg

Insert sound of rhythmic skin slapping, dam building, and fly lines landing on the water.

Bob Behnke once calculated that a stream could support 60 hours of consumptive angling per acre per year and be sustainable. At a 5% release mortality of 5%, that same acre can support 1200 hours and be sustainable and suffer the same mortality. It is like C&R vs. gill net argument.

If your reason for fishing is dead fish in the boat the short kill seasons are the answer. This will require significantly higher costs as there will likely fewer anglers in the short, intense season. You can hunt pheasant on the eastside a lot cheaper than on the westside release areas.......

But, there should be no reason why WDFW can't provide both experiences. The knowledge is there to create the fisheries.

Plant fish.

Beads are all the rage now. Same guys will still pile below 101...just will now kill off the same fish using small beads or yarnies.

You don't need bait below 101 to lay waste steelhead, smolts, etc.

I'll be on the rivers next week putting the hurt to some fish without bait. I only like using a sand shrimp tail as it gives Bob something to do, not as a crutch to hook fish.

Oh wait, I'm bringing Delbert along. Never mind. Bob will be plenty busy undoing birds nests, retying lost gear, pulling hooks out of his head, etc.

When I started fly fishing salmon and steelhead mid 90s it was 10 gear to one fly where I fished. Now it is pretty much the opposite. Amazingly, the same thing is happening on the coast now. I see more fly guys than gear guys out there which was unthinkable in the 90. My point is that is a lot of fapping.

The eastside vs. westside pheasant hunting is a great analogy, there will never be a self sustaining population of pheasants on the westside, even if there once was. The WDFW could provide much better fishing opportunity on the PS rivers, through increased smolts plants, recycling of hatchery fish downstream, and lengthened seasons at the possible expense of the few wild fish that return to those streams, and therefore reducing the angler pressure on the Peninsula.

That would fix any moist wader problems.

The good old days.

"The eastside vs. westside pheasant hunting is a great analogy, there will never be a self sustaining population of pheasants on the westside, even if there once was."

Smitch sold the Eastside pheasant mitigation program down the road in one check cashing move.
Amazingly painful.

Meanwhile the Army Core of morons is mowing cattails at an alarming rate.