#978880 - 08/05/17 05:27 PM
Re: Tribal concerns over recreational crabbing
[Re: Carcassman]
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River Nutrients
Registered: 10/22/09
Posts: 3020
Loc: University Place and Whidbey I...
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But if there was oversight, Larry, there would have to be public accountability for expenditures. And seasons. And pre-season planning. I think your post warranted several very large sarcasm emojis. And I truly understand your frustrations.
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Remember to immediately record your catch or you may become the catch!
It's the person who has done nothing who is sure nothing can be done. (Ewing)
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#979000 - 08/10/17 04:28 PM
Re: Tribal concerns over recreational crabbing
[Re: bushbear]
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River Nutrients
Registered: 10/22/09
Posts: 3020
Loc: University Place and Whidbey I...
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Here is a link to the belated report on the results of the 2016 season: http://wdfw.wa.gov/commission/meetings/2017/08/aug0417_18_presentation.pdf.The first thing to note is that contrary to the assertion in the NWIFC's article the recreational harvest has not exceeded the NT commercial harvest in any of the years reported and I will go out on a limb and say it has NEVER exceeded the NT commercial harvest. Sorry NWIFC, the stats prove you wrong! Now, in 2015 there were 25 WDFW LE patrol days which yielded 1,099 recovered pots and 187 which were disabled and tagged. In 2016 there were 21 patrol days and 535 pots recovered and only 23 disabled and tagged. Not too hard to spin that data to conclude that recreational crabbers did a far better job in 2016. It also needs to be pointed out that not all recovered pots are recreational pots; see the picture on page 31. Deputy Chief Cenci's article in the current (Aug 2017) Reel News indicated that out of 518 pots recovered so far in 2017 sweeps the identifiable recreational pots accounted for 306.
_________________________
Remember to immediately record your catch or you may become the catch!
It's the person who has done nothing who is sure nothing can be done. (Ewing)
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#979001 - 08/10/17 04:32 PM
Re: Tribal concerns over recreational crabbing
[Re: Jake Dogfish]
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River Nutrients
Registered: 10/22/09
Posts: 3020
Loc: University Place and Whidbey I...
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I reported to wdfw 3 crab pots out in area 11 Tuesday. Those same pots are out this morning semi drifting in the same spot.
Its illegal to pull someone else's pot even on closed days.
So they create these weekly closures, we pay for audit because we are not allowed to police ourselves.
Derelict gear is free to roam. I may be in a gray area but on occasion I have pulled floaters into shallow water and then left them. If there was a telephone number on the buoy I have called the owner. In one instance the owner reported he had lost the pot several days earlier but was out on his boat when he took my call. Didn't take him long to show up.
_________________________
Remember to immediately record your catch or you may become the catch!
It's the person who has done nothing who is sure nothing can be done. (Ewing)
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#979003 - 08/10/17 05:08 PM
Re: Tribal concerns over recreational crabbing
[Re: bushbear]
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River Nutrients
Registered: 10/22/09
Posts: 3020
Loc: University Place and Whidbey I...
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And to update the WDFW LE versus creel check data for CRC compliance:
Year................Enforcement.................Creel Survey
2010.....................24%............................13%
2011.....................19%............................11%
2012.....................20%............................12%
2013.....................16%.............................9%
2014.....................17%............................. *
2015.....................17%..............................6%
2016.....................17%..............................2%
* No data reported.
And for 2016 the creel check data showed 100% of those checked had CRCs.
_________________________
Remember to immediately record your catch or you may become the catch!
It's the person who has done nothing who is sure nothing can be done. (Ewing)
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#979012 - 08/10/17 09:37 PM
Re: Tribal concerns over recreational crabbing
[Re: Jake Dogfish]
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River Nutrients
Registered: 10/22/09
Posts: 3020
Loc: University Place and Whidbey I...
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Those numbers don't seem too bad. I bet alot of those are non resident or first time crabbers.
It would take a good 10 minutes to kick down further to where those pots were so I did not check them out close up.(float tube)
I'm all for changing the law. If recreational crabbing is going to be closed on those days of the week, then clear red and white pots should be pulled or disabled by anyone. The violation receiving the most LEO violations is failure to IMMEDIATELY annotate ones CRC. To some that might indicate a serious under reporting.......but the experience of the creel survey folks at the ramps indicates a much better rate of compliance. Is LE being really good or are they being far too picky? The problems of pulling someone else's pots start with you potentially coming into conflict with the owner. Next would be with LE; "Honest Officer, its a lost pot and I am simply doing my part for resource conservation." At some point there was some talk about providing some non-LEOs authorization to retrieve pots but nothing on that lately. My big issue is with floaters or buoys that are only visible at extremely low tide. Those are prime candidates for becoming derelict gear. As I mentioned, I have pulled some of those to shallow water and left them for LE to retrieve.
_________________________
Remember to immediately record your catch or you may become the catch!
It's the person who has done nothing who is sure nothing can be done. (Ewing)
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#979014 - 08/11/17 12:01 AM
Re: Tribal concerns over recreational crabbing
[Re: bushbear]
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Piper
Unregistered
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quite a few years back my dad and I were fishing in lower hood canal and there was about 20' of floating poly rope on the surface with no bouy that was right in our trolling path. we pulled it to get it out of the way and it turned out to be connected to a shrimp pot full of fresh bait and a bunch of spots shrimp in it. we dumped the shrimp and threw the pot in the bushes, its probably still in the bushes to this day.
Since I'm usually a weekend warrior we never needed to worry about what days crab was open. but the family and I were out camping this week and everyone in the group was double checking when pots could be in and out of the water, i feel sorry for the old timers like my dad without smart phones... I hate these types of regulations. Keep it open all week and make it easy.
2 keeper dungees in (3) 3 hour soaks of 6 pots on monday with fresh salmon carcass as bait in an area that was productive last year... it wont be long and the only crab in PS will be red rocks...
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#979088 - 08/15/17 06:34 PM
Re: Tribal concerns over recreational crabbing
[Re: Jake Dogfish]
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River Nutrients
Registered: 10/22/09
Posts: 3020
Loc: University Place and Whidbey I...
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It's Tuesday again. Same three pots are in the same spot. Exactly to whom did you report those pots? That is, did you report them to the poaching hotline (1-877-933-9847) or via email REPORTINGPOACHING@DFW.WA.GOV? Me, I like email because then I have a record. Assuming you reported the same pots they are now into at least the second closure period and the emphasis patrols should have had plenty of time to pick them up given your position report. Please give them another notice of illegal pots and request a call back when they have been picked up.
_________________________
Remember to immediately record your catch or you may become the catch!
It's the person who has done nothing who is sure nothing can be done. (Ewing)
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#979171 - 08/22/17 02:09 PM
Re: Tribal concerns over recreational crabbing
[Re: Jake Dogfish]
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River Nutrients
Registered: 10/22/09
Posts: 3020
Loc: University Place and Whidbey I...
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Another week another email to wdfw enforcement.
6 pots between Des Moines marina and saltwater state park.
I looked at the ones by the marina and they are all painted the same pink and green flags with no names on them.
Anyone should be able to pull up pots on closed days.
Was lucky I didn't hook one trolling. I just sent a msg to a contact within WDFW LE with a link to this thread so let us know if they get back to you. At the least they should acknowledge your report and advise of what resulted.......that is, if they really want folks in the field to be their eyes and ears.
_________________________
Remember to immediately record your catch or you may become the catch!
It's the person who has done nothing who is sure nothing can be done. (Ewing)
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#979174 - 08/22/17 03:27 PM
Re: Tribal concerns over recreational crabbing
[Re: bushbear]
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Spawner
Registered: 06/24/00
Posts: 554
Loc: Des Moines
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#979185 - 08/23/17 08:46 AM
Re: Tribal concerns over recreational crabbing
[Re: bushbear]
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Repeat Spawner
Registered: 04/20/09
Posts: 1270
Loc: WaRshington
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I was out working around Mukilteo on Tuesday 8/15 and had a run in with WDFW enforcement. They were out picking up illegal/derelict gear from all over areas 8/9/10. They had a boat full of probably 50 pots or better.
Good to see them out.
_________________________
When I grow up I want to be,
One of the harvesters of the sea.
I think before my days are done,
I want to be a fisherman.
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#979196 - 08/23/17 05:04 PM
Re: Tribal concerns over recreational crabbing
[Re: bushbear]
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River Nutrients
Registered: 10/22/09
Posts: 3020
Loc: University Place and Whidbey I...
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I should have included these in one of my earlier posts: http://www.kiro7.com/news/tulalip-tribe-fish-and-wildlife-director-arrested-/28782032.And this: http://nwsportsmanmag.com/headlines/dishonor/2-tulalip-members-accused-poaching-crab/.And then there was the big case in Bellingham involving what I recall as Lummi tribal members. Sorry, can't seem to find a link for that one. Not to say that they are the only commercial level violators in the recent past (they weren't) but it is simply disingenuous for any of the tribes to be pointing the finger of guilt at recreational crabbers given their own culpability. Oh, and exactly what were the results of tribal court actions against those tribal members - if any? The silence is deafening.
_________________________
Remember to immediately record your catch or you may become the catch!
It's the person who has done nothing who is sure nothing can be done. (Ewing)
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#979199 - 08/23/17 05:59 PM
Re: Tribal concerns over recreational crabbing
[Re: bushbear]
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Juvenile at Sea
Registered: 05/30/02
Posts: 211
Loc: Ravenden, AR
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If they use rec violations to shut us down or reduce our share, what would stop them from dropping a few rec style pots without names to "enhance" our violation rate? Not to be paranoid but I have feeling some of those unknown pots might be setups.
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Beware of the 3 inch Perch
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#979222 - 08/24/17 01:59 PM
Re: Tribal concerns over recreational crabbing
[Re: Jake Dogfish]
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River Nutrients
Registered: 10/22/09
Posts: 3020
Loc: University Place and Whidbey I...
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I received some interesting crab pot retrieval data from WDFW yesterday which may go to why they may have been slow in getting to your area. Yearly final reports for the period 2012 through 2016 had numbers of recovered pots ranging from 405 in 2013 over 28 days of sweeps to 1,099 in 2015 over 25 sweep days. Preliminary 2017 data for north Puget Sound only (King County north) is 1,500 for 16 days of sweeps. They have been busy!! That effort in the field, however, does not explain why you did not receive any acknowledgement/feedback to your several reports. That is not a new complaint. I am following up on that and hopefully will have more to report.
Edited by Larry B (08/24/17 02:03 PM)
_________________________
Remember to immediately record your catch or you may become the catch!
It's the person who has done nothing who is sure nothing can be done. (Ewing)
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#979231 - 08/24/17 09:36 PM
Re: Tribal concerns over recreational crabbing
[Re: bushbear]
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Fry
Registered: 06/17/04
Posts: 23
Loc: Marysville
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Wait wait wait...... So the dozen tribal boats out the 2 weeks before sport season wiping out northern 8-2 who wdfw claimed openly were just tribal boats contracted to do population size samples for wdfw pre sport season population estimates.... weren't doing that?
Then the 7! crab checkers at kayak point every single day, who when told about all the humpies I caught while salmon was closed on opening weekend of crab told me they "are not counting ANY species of fish nor would they record anything having to do with fish, they are only counting crab in all areas salmon is closed" ......
Weren't counting crab "in-season"?
I don't understand why tribes aren't getting blasted all over the news and social media as racists and have marches held against them. My children and I are getting treated negatively and our wellbeing and livelyhood is being held back by group of people 100% using race as the reason. I can't say black people aren't allowed to fish cause my ancestors were here first, so why can an Indian say the same to me. With all that this state is doing to make every person "equal" in so many different aspects of society, how is this giant one being overlooked?
(p.s I have many tribal family members)
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#979235 - 08/24/17 10:35 PM
Re: Tribal concerns over recreational crabbing
[Re: Half-Fast]
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River Nutrients
Registered: 10/22/09
Posts: 3020
Loc: University Place and Whidbey I...
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Wait wait wait...... So the dozen tribal boats out the 2 weeks before sport season wiping out northern 8-2 who wdfw claimed openly were just tribal boats contracted to do population size samples for wdfw pre sport season population estimates.... weren't doing that?
Then the 7! crab checkers at kayak point every single day, who when told about all the humpies I caught while salmon was closed on opening weekend of crab told me they "are not counting ANY species of fish nor would they record anything having to do with fish, they are only counting crab in all areas salmon is closed" ......
Weren't counting crab "in-season"?
I don't understand why tribes aren't getting blasted all over the news and social media as racists and have marches held against them. My children and I are getting treated negatively and our wellbeing and livelyhood is being held back by group of people 100% using race as the reason. I can't say black people aren't allowed to fish cause my ancestors were here first, so why can an Indian say the same to me. With all that this state is doing to make every person "equal" in so many different aspects of society, how is this giant one being overlooked?
(p.s I have many tribal family members) At least one tribe extended their season to the extent that it overlapped the recreational opener. Reason: they had not caught their 50% of the agreed upon harvestable poundage. That is a huge tipoff that the total agreed upon harvestable poundage was likely overestimated. I have no way of knowing if the dozen tribal boats to which you referred were fishing under that extension but I would really like to know from whom at WDFW you received information that the tribal boats you mentioned were doing population studies for WDFW at that time.
_________________________
Remember to immediately record your catch or you may become the catch!
It's the person who has done nothing who is sure nothing can be done. (Ewing)
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