#982608 - 12/17/17 12:40 PM
bye bye Cooke Aquaculture
|
Lord of the Chums
Registered: 03/29/14
Posts: 6829
|
_________________________
BLM IS A TERRORIST ORGANIZATION ANTIFA IS A TERRORIST ORGANIZATION
|
Top
|
|
|
|
#982609 - 12/17/17 01:24 PM
Re: bye bye Cooke Aquaculture
[Re: 5 * General Evo]
|
River Nutrients
Registered: 08/26/02
Posts: 4709
Loc: Sequim
|
Another environmental issue has, hopefully, been averted. The question I have is why did it take DNR so long to make the decision. It appears, from the article, that there have been issues at this facility and others for years and nothing was done.
|
Top
|
|
|
|
#982610 - 12/17/17 01:28 PM
Re: bye bye Cooke Aquaculture
[Re: 5 * General Evo]
|
River Nutrients
Registered: 11/21/07
Posts: 7428
Loc: Olema,California,Planet Earth
|
Look at the standards being asked of Cooke and then look at the enhancement facilities the State and Tribes run and what standards they are held to.
|
Top
|
|
|
|
#982611 - 12/17/17 05:02 PM
Re: bye bye Cooke Aquaculture
[Re: 5 * General Evo]
|
River Nutrients
Registered: 08/26/02
Posts: 4709
Loc: Sequim
|
Speaking from years of experience, when the Dept of Agriculture gets involved, the resource is often the loser.
|
Top
|
|
|
|
#982612 - 12/17/17 06:27 PM
Re: bye bye Cooke Aquaculture
[Re: 5 * General Evo]
|
River Nutrients
Registered: 11/21/07
Posts: 7428
Loc: Olema,California,Planet Earth
|
That is very true. There are still water quality regulations and shoreline regulations that other entities control.
What perturbs me about the situation is that the problem is not Atlantics, it is the operation of the pens to raise fish. That problem would have been significantly worse had they been raising one of the Pacific salmon species.
|
Top
|
|
|
|
#982617 - 12/18/17 06:45 AM
Re: bye bye Cooke Aquaculture
[Re: 5 * General Evo]
|
River Nutrients
Registered: 11/21/07
Posts: 7428
Loc: Olema,California,Planet Earth
|
If you're concern is purely AS, then yes there is just PA. If your concern is water quality, escapes, disease then that is just the tip of the iceburg.
|
Top
|
|
|
|
#982618 - 12/18/17 09:19 AM
Re: bye bye Cooke Aquaculture
[Re: 5 * General Evo]
|
Repeat Spawner
Registered: 04/20/09
Posts: 1270
Loc: WaRshington
|
What I would like to know is this. With all the anti-gillnet hate, and all of the commercial fishing hate, and all of the complaining about our seasons being closed due to low returns, and not enough fish to go around.... WHAT exactly do people propose to meet the market demand for fresh fish if we drastically curtain commercial fishing, which so many people seem to desperately want?
_________________________
When I grow up I want to be, One of the harvesters of the sea. I think before my days are done, I want to be a fisherman.
|
Top
|
|
|
|
#982619 - 12/18/17 09:48 AM
Re: bye bye Cooke Aquaculture
[Re: 5 * General Evo]
|
River Nutrients
Registered: 04/25/00
Posts: 5077
Loc: East of Aberdeen, West of Mont...
|
This has been a "on going problem". This did not JUST HAPPEN OVER NIGHT, my question is what Federal or State agency should be held directly responsible???? There must/should have been regular checking of this site and others......there has to be documents, on file that show/explain how bad this site was.
Maybe someone NOT doing their job????????
_________________________
"Worse day sport fishing, still better than the best day working"
"I thought growing older, would take longer"
|
Top
|
|
|
|
#982621 - 12/18/17 09:58 AM
Re: bye bye Cooke Aquaculture
[Re: GodLovesUgly]
|
River Nutrients
Registered: 04/25/00
Posts: 5077
Loc: East of Aberdeen, West of Mont...
|
What I would like to know is this. With all the anti-gillnet hate, and all of the commercial fishing hate, and all of the complaining about our seasons being closed due to low returns, and not enough fish to go around.... WHAT exactly do people propose to meet the market demand for fresh fish if we drastically curtain commercial fishing, which so many people seem to desperately want? NT gill net salmon fishing probably should be reduced.......as to your comment on people wanting "fresh fish", this is not PRE 1973, there are ways to get fresh fish. Right now, in Aberdeen, there is fresh salmon for sale.
_________________________
"Worse day sport fishing, still better than the best day working"
"I thought growing older, would take longer"
|
Top
|
|
|
|
#982622 - 12/18/17 11:14 AM
Re: bye bye Cooke Aquaculture
[Re: 5 * General Evo]
|
River Nutrients
Registered: 11/21/07
Posts: 7428
Loc: Olema,California,Planet Earth
|
Department of Ecology managed the water quality, WDFW managed the fish health, WDFW and WADNR managed the site, Clallam County managed the shorelines concerns/operating issues.
It is a rather large fuster cluck as the buck can easily be passed to somebody else.
It is easy to say that PS can't produce fish to "feed the world" but as human populations grows they need food from somewhere whether it be salmon, crab, shrimp, clams, oysters, mussels. People gotta eat. Even if "we" decide not to feed them, somebody else will have to which compromises their environment.
|
Top
|
|
|
|
#982624 - 12/18/17 12:01 PM
Re: bye bye Cooke Aquaculture
[Re: GodLovesUgly]
|
River Nutrients
Registered: 10/28/09
Posts: 3314
|
What I would like to know is this. With all the anti-gillnet hate, and all of the commercial fishing hate, and all of the complaining about our seasons being closed due to low returns, and not enough fish to go around.... WHAT exactly do people propose to meet the market demand for fresh fish if we drastically curtain commercial fishing, which so many people seem to desperately want? That is the classic argument for overfishing. There is more than enough salmon in the marketplace. Don't you see it in every major grocery store? Indeed, a lot of it goes to waste when it doesn't sell before the pull date. I wish the commercial market would diversify more, focusing on niche markets that deliver maximum value to fishermen for top quality product. There is some of that going on, but so far, it's only been on top of the usual trawl and gillnet impacts. As resources become scarce, their value increases. If salmon are to remain a sustainable resource, we need to recognize and capitalize on their true value in commercial markets. The other argument is to compare commercial fishing to commercial hunting. The later ceased to be legal once it became clear that the wildlife couldn't sustain it. At what point will the former reach the tipping point? It's a sure thing with mammals, but will people ever make tough decisions to save a bunch of cold, slimy fish?
|
Top
|
|
|
|
#982625 - 12/18/17 01:10 PM
Re: bye bye Cooke Aquaculture
[Re: 5 * General Evo]
|
River Nutrients
Registered: 01/17/04
Posts: 3742
Loc: Sheltona Beach
|
US/Canada treaty should be challenged due to impacts on Salish Sea Orcas. IMHO hungry whales lead to this event.
So, who will provide food for the Orcas? I thought at the Commission meeting, the WDFW Director said it would be 3-4 years before increased hatchery production levels to sustain the Orcas?
_________________________
When we are forgotten, we cease to exist . Share your outdoor skills.
|
Top
|
|
|
|
#982626 - 12/18/17 01:33 PM
Re: bye bye Cooke Aquaculture
[Re: 5 * General Evo]
|
River Nutrients
Registered: 11/21/07
Posts: 7428
Loc: Olema,California,Planet Earth
|
Slab, that is the reason why the only short term solution to the whales is closing the fisheries that intercept the food. Takes time for the increased hatchery production to be collected as eggs, hatched, grown, released, and then survive those selfsame fisheries to return.
Habitat fixes are the exactly the same. Say you could get the Congress and WA Leg to fully fund habitat fixes so that all the impediments are fixed by July 1 of 2019. Hey, we got the Big Dude in the WH who can make 'Murica Great. Anyway, it is all fixed so that everything that spawns after 1/1/19 has ideal habitat. It is still 4 more years before the first big push pop adult chi book come back. 2023. Until then, the whales can starve.
|
Top
|
|
|
|
#982628 - 12/18/17 01:53 PM
Re: bye bye Cooke Aquaculture
[Re: GodLovesUgly]
|
Spawner
Registered: 06/24/00
Posts: 554
Loc: Des Moines
|
What I would like to know is this. With all the anti-gillnet hate, and all of the commercial fishing hate, and all of the complaining about our seasons being closed due to low returns, and not enough fish to go around.... WHAT exactly do people propose to meet the market demand for fresh fish if we drastically curtain commercial fishing, which so many people seem to desperately want? There are plenty of fish, they can and will still raise them here. Just not in Puget Sound. Fish farms are not concerned about market demand. They want there farms where Pacific Salmon live. This is about market share. Farmed Atlantic Salmon now outnumber Wild Atlantic Salmon 99 to 1. If they can decrease the amount of wild Pacific Salmon, They can raise the price exponentially for there inferior product. What is the easier way to make more money? Double there output and watch the price go into the toilet? Or replace 10-20% of Pacific salmon with farms and the price for farmed Atlantic Salmon goes way up.
|
Top
|
|
|
|
#982629 - 12/18/17 01:56 PM
Re: bye bye Cooke Aquaculture
[Re: 5 * General Evo]
|
River Nutrients
Registered: 01/17/04
Posts: 3742
Loc: Sheltona Beach
|
Northern, AK & DC interceptions decrease the biomass needed to sustain the Southern pods.
_________________________
When we are forgotten, we cease to exist . Share your outdoor skills.
|
Top
|
|
|
|
#982631 - 12/18/17 02:12 PM
Re: bye bye Cooke Aquaculture
[Re: Carcassman]
|
River Nutrients
Registered: 01/17/04
Posts: 3742
Loc: Sheltona Beach
|
The Northern fisheries should be limited. We are left below escapement?
Whiskey Tango Foxtrot!
_________________________
When we are forgotten, we cease to exist . Share your outdoor skills.
|
Top
|
|
|
|
#982632 - 12/18/17 02:21 PM
Re: bye bye Cooke Aquaculture
[Re: 5 * General Evo]
|
River Nutrients
Registered: 11/21/07
Posts: 7428
Loc: Olema,California,Planet Earth
|
The Northern folks could say the same thing. Leave us alone and you cut back.
Why is their fishery less "legitimate" than ours? I could say that they are fishing on juveniles, mixed stocks, and such but so do we. By the way, I don't support the northern fisheries at all.
|
Top
|
|
|
|
#982667 - 12/19/17 12:19 PM
Re: bye bye Cooke Aquaculture
[Re: Carcassman]
|
River Nutrients
Registered: 10/28/09
Posts: 3314
|
The Northern folks could say the same thing. Leave us alone and you cut back.
Why is their fishery less "legitimate" than ours? I could say that they are fishing on juveniles, mixed stocks, and such but so do we. By the way, I don't support the northern fisheries at all. I would say theirs is less legitimate because it exploits a huge percentage of OUR fish. Our fish, plus Canada's, plus Alaska's puts very nearly every Pacific Salmon at risk if being caught in their fishery. One more outstanding argument for terminal fisheries, if you ask me. Everybody gets to fish over what their own conservation management yields, and nothing more. Good management rewarded with good returns, as it should be.
|
Top
|
|
|
|
#982684 - 12/19/17 09:33 PM
Re: bye bye Cooke Aquaculture
[Re: 5 * General Evo]
|
River Nutrients
Registered: 11/21/07
Posts: 7428
Loc: Olema,California,Planet Earth
|
Alaska will never go with a "catch only your own fish" paradigm. Nobody else catches AK salmon, at least not in any sort of numbers. They would give up BC, WA, OR, CA fish for what?
|
Top
|
|
|
|
#982686 - 12/20/17 06:07 AM
Re: bye bye Cooke Aquaculture
[Re: Carcassman]
|
Juvenile at Sea
Registered: 01/30/13
Posts: 233
Loc: Skagit
|
They would give up BC, WA, OR, CA fish for what? Hows about cash? As in not having to defend themselves in a protracted court battle from a combined lawsuit from BC, CA, OR, WA, ID. This has got to be a law firms dream. Years of high paid employment. Think of the billable hours?
_________________________
Catch & Release Is Not A Crime
|
Top
|
|
|
|
#982687 - 12/20/17 06:21 AM
Re: bye bye Cooke Aquaculture
[Re: 5 * General Evo]
|
River Nutrients
Registered: 11/21/07
Posts: 7428
Loc: Olema,California,Planet Earth
|
And the justification for the lawsuit is???
We produced the fish, we get them? Apply that one to , say, ducks and geese.
AK has already made the argument (remember Jeff Koenings?) that they deserve a share of southern fish because AK protects and manages the oceanic habitat they grow in.
As for cash, WA (among other gubmints) won't pay for education, infrastructure, public safety, mental health, and a long list of other things that voters probably support before fish.
|
Top
|
|
|
|
#982695 - 12/20/17 10:17 AM
Re: bye bye Cooke Aquaculture
[Re: Carcassman]
|
Juvenile at Sea
Registered: 01/30/13
Posts: 233
Loc: Skagit
|
And the justification for the lawsuit is???
We produced the fish, we get them? Apply that one to , say, ducks and geese.
AK has already made the argument (remember Jeff Koenings?) that they deserve a share of southern fish because AK protects and manages the oceanic habitat they grow in.
As for cash, WA (among other gubmints) won't pay for education, infrastructure, public safety, mental health, and a long list of other things that voters probably support before fish. I think any first year law student knows enough to holler OBJECTION! when ducks and geese get mentioned in a fish lawsuit. Remind me again, how much of a share do they deserve?
_________________________
Catch & Release Is Not A Crime
|
Top
|
|
|
|
#982696 - 12/20/17 11:11 AM
Re: bye bye Cooke Aquaculture
[Re: 5 * General Evo]
|
River Nutrients
Registered: 11/21/07
Posts: 7428
Loc: Olema,California,Planet Earth
|
Not saying they deserve but AK and Canada produce (spawn, incubate, rear) most of the NA waterfowl. It then migrates to the south where we shoot them. Same concept as the fish.
Since fish are a "common" resource I don't think the deserve argument will get very far.
|
Top
|
|
|
|
#982709 - 12/20/17 02:22 PM
Re: bye bye Cooke Aquaculture
[Re: 5 * General Evo]
|
River Nutrients
Registered: 11/21/07
Posts: 7428
Loc: Olema,California,Planet Earth
|
They don't selectively harvest our salmon. They do, other other hand, specifically target some Canadian stocks.
|
Top
|
|
|
|
#982715 - 12/20/17 03:53 PM
Re: bye bye Cooke Aquaculture
[Re: Carcassman]
|
River Nutrients
Registered: 01/17/04
Posts: 3742
Loc: Sheltona Beach
|
And in turn Canada harvests WA and OR fishes to compensate for the allowed take by Alaska... We are basicly fishing out of escapement. The co-management harvest is 50% of returns to WA waters since the Boldt decision. WDFW Staff at Harvest Management is limiting any chance of recovery by ensuring the take North of the border..
_________________________
When we are forgotten, we cease to exist . Share your outdoor skills.
|
Top
|
|
|
|
#982717 - 12/20/17 04:49 PM
Re: bye bye Cooke Aquaculture
[Re: 5 * General Evo]
|
River Nutrients
Registered: 11/21/07
Posts: 7428
Loc: Olema,California,Planet Earth
|
The co-management shares are 50:50 of the harvestable fish returning to WA waters. Legally, even according to Boldt, they can't fish into the MSY goal, which mis sort of enshrined in the Orders. What is taken up north has nothing to do with the sharing, although the Tribes have threatened to sue to include AK catches of Case Area fish.
Recovery could occur without including AK and BC but it would mean WE cut back and that is not possible politically. The politics of the fish will end up killing them off.
|
Top
|
|
|
|
#982719 - 12/20/17 04:57 PM
Re: bye bye Cooke Aquaculture
[Re: Carcassman]
|
Spawner
Registered: 06/24/00
Posts: 554
Loc: Des Moines
|
They don't selectively harvest our salmon. They do, other other hand, specifically target some Canadian stocks. Not only can they use acoustic technology to target marked fish, they also can tell where they are from before they get them aboard in some cases. Since the majority of mass marked fish are from south stocks, why would they not use this to target our hatchery fish? If our wild fish hang out with our hatchery fish, they get caught also. The only way we have any way of knowing about this is getting the wanded heads to the dock... I doubt they all make it.
|
Top
|
|
|
|
#982754 - 12/21/17 07:48 PM
Re: bye bye Cooke Aquaculture
[Re: 5 * General Evo]
|
April Fool
Registered: 06/18/01
Posts: 16138
|
Good ! Those are eyesores.
_________________________
He who joyfully marches in rank and file has already earned my contempt. He has been given a large brain by mistake, since for him the spinal cord would suffice.
- Albert Einstein.
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
0 registered (),
982
Guests and
3
Spiders online. |
Key:
Admin,
Global Mod,
Mod
|
|
11498 Members
16 Forums
63778 Topics
645368 Posts
Max Online: 3001 @ 01/28/20 02:48 PM
|
|
|