Back when Jerry Brown's (CA current gov) Dad was governor he was in favor of sending water from NorCal to SoCal. Why? It would keep them down there rather than have them move north to where the water was.

The problem is more and more people. If we are unwilling to deal with that, then we can at least move forward on paying for the infrastructure to move that water.

One of my all time favorite sayings:

[Bleeeeep!] 'em and take their water."

Been around long enough that you hear all sorts of weird ideas. Heard somebody propose to dam the Carquinez Straits (a narrow passageway for the Sacramento and San Juoquin rivers. Convert it all to freshwater and ship it south. Lots of folks believe that any freshwater allowed to flow unused to the sea is wasted.

Which suggests that we are going to see lower flows in the Green and Cedar and Tolt as populations continue to grow.

I agree. There is technology, although expensive, that is being used in SoCal that converts sea water to fresh water. It's not enough at this point to sustain a large population but when does it stop? More people more freshwater needed. Does that mean eventually we use up the oceans when there are too many people. Scientists have said for years the perfect maximum population for earth is 500,000,000. If that's true we wrote earth's obituary a long time ago. This is another reason why I have problems with the Republican's slash and burn mantra. Total disregard for the earth (and people) in the name of money. (They call it progress.) We are already seeing some crazy sh!t with Trump lifting a ban on certain pesticides proven bad for the earth and bad for people because Monsanto put big cash in his campaign. Then of course his intention of opening National Forests, monuments and even some National Parks to private companies for mining, mineral rights, logging, and who knows what else. If we let that happen those private enterprises will have the authority to keep us out. No fishing or hunting. (Except for their wealthy CEO's and their buddies.) OR, they will charge an arm and a leg for use of the land they are leasing. I wonder if we are at a point of no return. Can/will we be able to reverse the damage that has been done and continues to be done? Do we just not give a sh!t and think it doesn't matter because by the time the sh!t hits the fan (as that genius Rich G says) we won't be here anyway? Or, do we think about our kids and their kids etc.? Unfortunately I was born with a conscience and do have kids and grand kids and that's why I rail on the party of evil. Because they simply do not give a sh!t and/or have no long term insight all in the name of greed. I will quote the famous philosopher Rich G again, "It's just getting wronger and wronger."

Man's greed will fuuck up this rock.
Book it!!

So much for an open and shut Bundy case.

Earth's total water carrying capacity has remained more or less the same since the early days of the planet. Water never really goes away. It just goes through chemical reactions - back and forth between states. Beer in...pee out. Evaporate. Condense. Liquid water. Beer again. The cycle repeats.

Drinkable fresh water is another story. Desalination plants are in their technological "infancy" and are still much too expensive to be market stable and competitive. Besides massive costs, the next problem is what to do with all the leftover salt. You can't put it back into the ocean or you increase the overall salinity & kill PH levels. There are mountains of salt stacked up in the desert out on the Baja peninsula from Mexican desalination plants. That in turn, kills the ground, flora and fauna all around it permanently. The actual water tastes like crap too (think Florida tap water nasty).

The good news is that we are probably headed back into a mini ice-age. On-ground rainfall and snowpack is going WAY up in certain areas. Alaska has seen more snow in the last 200 years than since the days of the last mini ice-age (1300 - 1500 AD give or take). Of course, some areas are the opposite. The Sahara is getting drier and bigger by the day. It'll eventually push the entire north African population straight into the Med.

So where in North America will have good climate, water, farming and minimal demand in the future? The Montana & southern Alberta zone. Montana now has a climate like Wyoming used to have and Colorado had before that. Colorado is the new New Mexico. Drier than hell and it never used to be that way. The food belt is moving north. But as we all know, not too far north because the climate is not conducive to growing crops (unless the Earth axis tilts bigtime and then we wouldn't care anyway). Eventually there be only a very small band of optimal growing area running along the 45th parallel. Everywhere else is gonna be chit for humans. But in the end, none of this matters because it will take geological ages to occur. We won't be around for that long. We have like 200 years to get off the planet or that will be that. I for one think we'll tear ourselves apart within the next 200. It's gonna be a show!

fkn bundy...

Yeah. The **cking things up has been a group effort by most, if not all of us.

so wait.... Rich was right?

AGAIN?

It isn't that Rich was right. Massive incompetence on the part of the federal attorneys for withholding evidence. Stupid move.

Did you guys hear about the gold-backed yuan?

Juan has some gold? Hell yeah - that guy can stay then.

Salmo - exactly. Rich doesn't get credit for this one. The default assumption is that the Government will find a way to screw it up (they ALWAYS find a way, hence being the auto-default).

Getting credit for this would be like getting credit for calling your shot on the morning sun coming up in the east.

There you go, that could be your New Years resolution. Starting with your obsession of .GOV workers. Beats sniffing M.E.K products for 30 years. Have a great Christmas and a happy New Year Pam.

It simply doesn't fit your 'reality' for Rich to be correct.

So the outcome obviously proves the government and it's employees are "the low information types".

Salmo was 100% correct once again.

Cheers to 2018.

Ryan Bundy looks like he has cocksuckers cramp.

He has really bad Bell's Palsy.

My stepdad had it and to "cure it", they cut off one side of his face, stretched it up tight over the top of his head and stapled that sucker down tight. Good as new....sorta.