tipping your fishing guide

Posted by: escapee

tipping your fishing guide - 01/16/01 08:47 PM

how do you feel about tipping your fishing guide? what is an acceptable tip for a guide who is on his own compared to a guide working out of a lodge? for the sake of this conversation we will assume the guide has done a good job of guiding. if you reply, are or were you ever a guide? thanks for your input!
Posted by: drift boat

Re: tipping your fishing guide - 01/16/01 10:12 PM

Yes I am a part time guide but have been on more guide trips than most. I feel if they do a good job of trying to get you a fish and answer your questions then yes they should get a tip.If all they do is run you up and down the river and look at there watch then no. When my wife go's with me and we have a good guide we give around $40.00

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rip some lips
Posted by: R Gray

Re: tipping your fishing guide - 01/16/01 11:10 PM

as a full time guide and lodge owner I will try to give you some insight about the subject of tipping. The avarage tip for a guide is twenty dollars per person per day. That would be for both salt and fresh water.
My feeling on that is if the owner of the lodge or charter is guideing you, they are putting in the same effort or even more. so it is nice to see the tip too. some people tip a lot more than that. If you stay at a full service lodge the tipping usually works out to ten percent of the package price. The lodge staff gets taken care of, with the lions share going to the guide. If you are not happy with the service you recieve, make sure you tell the owners or the manager. If you don't, They may not even know there is a problem. I hope this helps.
Tight lines
R Gray
Posted by: JohnnyCoho

Re: tipping your fishing guide - 01/16/01 11:59 PM

escapee,
As a full time guide this is one of my least favorite subjects to talk about and one I never bring up, as a rule. I am quite often asked this question by clients as to how much or what is the norm on tiping. Makes Ya feel pretty uncomfortable when asked and is one of the reasons I put basic guide lines for Gratuities on my web site.
Basically in a nut shell what I put on my site is: "Gratuities are somewhat of a personal nature and should be gauged on your level of satisfaction. Over the years the average has been between 10-20% of your trip value. Again, this is only a guidline and know that whatever you leave will be greatly appreciated."
Posted by: STRIKE ZONE

Re: tipping your fishing guide - 01/17/01 11:54 AM

I've been on plenty of guided trips in the past six years and have developed some what of a pay scale to tip the guide.
If the guide greets you with a smile and or a joke,he puts you on your two fish,and was fun to be with for that 8-10 hr day and splits the eggs 50/50 then you should tip them around $40.00 to $50.00 bucks.I'm not rich!!!!.If the guide is an average guy,ok to be with for 8 hrs or so,gets ya a fish or two,then tip around $20.00 to $25.00 bucks.
If the guide has no personality,didn't seem to care to much about any thing,was done right at 7 1/2 to 8 hrs,managed to get one fish and demanded all the eggs,then I would
have a hard time giving him the $150.00 bucks,let a lone giving a tip or referring him out to any one else.I don't think there is to big of tip or to small of a tip.It's what you can afford considering the quality of the trip and how much it's already cost you to just get there.Good luck,
STRIKE ZONE
Posted by: JohnnyCoho

Re: tipping your fishing guide - 01/17/01 02:20 PM

StrikeZone,
Sorry Brah but I have to disagree with you on the egg thing. If legal to fish eggs I do so for pretty much 1/2 the day or more. If you were to catch a "hatchery" hen in my boat then I get the eggs, unless of coarse I already have enough of them to last me for a while then by all means you can have them all. I dont replentish my egg stock from buying them from the tribes and depend on getting them from fish caught while guiding. I hope you will understand this!
Now a question for you: If your guide busts his arse all day for you and does his absolute best to get you on fish but you dont come away with any heads, then what?
As many guys in here that have fished with me in the past can tell you I will work my arse off for fish but when its a hit or miss season like this ones turned out to be, you dont always come away with fish.
J----<")(\(\(\)>{
Posted by: Last Cast

Re: tipping your fishing guide - 01/17/01 03:09 PM

As far as tips go it is exactly that a tip if you want to give one fill free to do so and if not then do not.
Posted by: drift boat

Re: tipping your fishing guide - 01/17/01 04:14 PM

I myself think that if a person will do there home work and ask the right things before going out on a trip you will already know if the fishing is hot or cold. I also check with other people while going with a guide to see if they are worth the time and money. This way if I have a bad trip it is just as much on me as them. As for the eggs they always go to the guide.

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rip some lips
Posted by: B. Gray

Re: tipping your fishing guide - 01/17/01 04:25 PM

The first guided trip I took was on the hump for fall Kings. The place was a madhouse full of boats, it rained sideways a good part of the day and the fishing stunk. I tipped the guide I think $25-$35. He was enthusiastic, worked his arse off on the sticks, jumped on top of a submerged log to try to get a wrapped fish off and was willing to answer all my stupid questions. It's like any service industry - good service gets rewarded.

If the guide is a sourpuss, complains of being tired and working too much and blasts you down the river then use your own judgement.

The best thing you can do is some reasearch beforehand on who might be a good guide for a given river. I've fished with some guides only to wish I'd known more about them and their tactics before booking the trip.

Bruce
Posted by: Hugh Heffner

Re: tipping your fishing guide - 01/17/01 05:03 PM

I think that a guide deserves a tip based on effort put into the trip. There is a lot more work to be done on a fishless venture than there is when it's push button and quick-limits are in order. If nobody on the river is catching fish because the run is poor, then don't blame the guide if he busts his tail for you and you still come up blank. I have had the pleasure to fish with some of the best guides around, Bob Ball to follow this spring and summer . I always try to tip something, even if I come in fishless just as long as I get a full day. At least $20 per person and up to $50 if you do a CNR thing and you and your guide have to wear a belt by the end of the day to keep your pants up because you've been fishing your ass off!! You are paying for the local knowledge of the guide, if you want fish, buy 'em. It's a lot cheaper but that wouldn't be any fun now, would it?
Posted by: STRIKE ZONE

Re: tipping your fishing guide - 01/17/01 05:45 PM

JohnnyCoho,
If the eggs aren't a 50/50 deal,then I wouldn't be going with you, period.If the guide busts his arse off all day for 8-10 hrs
and there wasn't any heads to come home and was pleasant to be around then yes,a $20.00 to $25.00 tip would come from my pocket.I talk to all the guides I've hired prior to the trip so that there isn't a surprise when it comes to splitting the eggs up.Most trips I've been on I use approx. a half to one whole skein.There are two in a fish,I'm not supplying the next client with eggs it's the guides job.Say there was two clients,My buddy and myself,we caught four nice hens between 20 & 30 pounds Chinook,we probly
only used one whole large chinook skein,your saying no way guide gets all the eggs,"NOT".Good luck,
STRIKE ZONE
Posted by: Salmo g.

Re: tipping your fishing guide - 01/17/01 05:51 PM

I must confess complete ignorance on this one. Tipping seems commonplace to some sectors of the service industry and unknown in others. I thought tips were common to mainly minimum wage service industry jobs like waitresses, the gal that cuts hair in a chain shop, and baggage handlers, and so forth.

I thought a fishing guide was like an independant businessman who sets his rates according to his costs and what the market will bear, much as a plumber, electrician, and the like. I didn't tip the carpenter who built my deck. It never occurred to me to do so. The plumber charges time and a half or double for after hours work, so a kind of a tip is built in. Do you folks tip these service workers?

Then there's the thing about the eggs. I don't fish with eggs, and I haven't hired a guide to fish in fresh water. When fishing the ocean, the guide/skipper provides herring or other bait for fishing. That bait is obtained through purchase, not from prior clients. It cracked me up to read that a guide would expect to keep the eggs from his client's catch. That seems rather cheeky to me and a sure way to discourage repeat business. If I used eggs, I would want to keep them along with the fish they came in. But I guess it's a case of whatever the market will bear.

Sincerely,

Salmo g.
Posted by: Coho

Re: tipping your fishing guide - 01/17/01 06:19 PM

Here's a tip... Tip your guide. Even if a waitress spilled my brew-I still oblige and tip. My guide may not look as good as that waitress(especially Bob or JohnnyC)-but I appreciate his efforts, and tipping with money or whatever of value you trade-is appreciated. Much prep work is done to make a trip successful-ex. bait,tying leaders, quality equipment. I did guide when I was out of college and my goal was clients having a great experience-Pays off. Not that a guide is going to make your return trip good or bad based on -"Did this guy tip me last time-nope-fishing the frog water today". But, his efforts will probably increase knowing that you appreciated his work. How can a guide encourage tipping without ill effect? "I like Tips" hat.
Posted by: Anonymous

Re: tipping your fishing guide - 01/17/01 06:47 PM

Yes I am a guide as you all may or may not know. As far as the tips are concerned tips are welcome they should not be expected. How I look at it is if you hire a guide to take fishing you are looking to learn from the guide so that maybe you might get a few secrets that you may not know already. Whether it be technique, different rivers, or just pumbing him for general knowledge. Also to have a good time. How much is up to you. Generally I will recieve anywhere from $20 to $30 per person. I have recieved more and less but it doesn't matter it's a tip. Normally a guide will put you into fish if there are fish in the river. Sometimes though fishing just isn't easy and we will work are arses off to try and make it happen, but it sometime doesn't. That's must be why they call it fishing! I look at it like this you are out to have a good time with your friend, family, or maybe just by yourself that is what is most important catching fish is a bonus.

As far as the eggs issue goes. How do you think us guides get our eggs? I know that I myself will and do not buy them from the indians. Normally I don't get the opportunity to go fishing for myself very often to acquire enough eggs to last all year. So we relie on the eggs that we catch with our clients. If I have plenty of eggs in stock I will be happy to split them up. You have to remember though Spring Chinook and summer run Steelhead do not have any eggs or should I say fully developed eggs. So we relie on the eggs from our Fall Salmon and winter run Steelhead to supply enough eggs for the rest of the year. Just something to think about. I hope everyone has good experiences with the guides you choose because that is why we are in business for you to have a great time and to put you into some fish.



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Presentation is the key to Success and change can make the difference.www.ChasenADream.com

[This message has been edited by Chasen A Dream (edited 01-17-2001).]
Posted by: Hugh Heffner

Re: tipping your fishing guide - 01/17/01 07:12 PM

Salmo g., I am not one to question your reasoning on most fishing-related issues, but I think you are "missing the boat" on this tipping the guide issue. You stated that you don't tip the carpenter, plumber, electrician, and the like, but how often does somebody spend a full day with their plumber exchanging plumbing stories and lauging it up while the plumber is hard at work? "Hey, bubba, that's a pertay funnay story about how ya got that Pee-vee-cee stuck in yer arse underneath that crawl space last time ya worked here. Remember the time th' wife and I hired ya to fix that leaky faucet and we had doubles when you fixed the shower too! That suuurre waz a good day with ya, Bubba."

Please do not categorize fishing guides with service workers. Most guides fish with clients as a labor of love on a part time basis and have other means of income. Guides often specify that clients get 8 hours of guided fishing, but how often do they prorate it when it runs to 9, 10, or even 12 hours. That's where the tip comes in. Full time guides in Washington, like our beloved Bob, have to do more than just the labor on the water in a given day to succeed as full time guides. It takes research and years of experience, skill, and personality to keep clients coming back. There are not many full-time guides left in Washington as there are not many full-time fish.

Herring and eggs are two separate entities. Eggs are not dime-a-dozen like herring or readily available in the marina. How many time have you told the Charter skipper out on the salt "Hey, captain. Would you mind if I keep any herring that you happen to find in the gullet of this big king I got here?".
Posted by: RichH

Re: tipping your fishing guide - 01/17/01 07:28 PM

I think tips are very much a personal issue. I know that when I was guiding if I got a tip it was considered a bonus, not an expectation. As far as the eggs go, same rules apply now as then: eggs go to the boat.
Everybody that fishes with me knows going in that I plan to use those eggs for the next person that fishes with me. I do give some of those eggs to my buddies and share them with other fishermen as well. I just consider it my bonus for taking them fishing and working my arse off to get them into fish, even though I no longer guide. If someone doesn't want to do that, fine, fish from the bank

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Posted by: Hammer Bob

Re: tipping your fishing guide - 01/18/01 02:47 AM

I am not a guide but have gone on several guided trips...some good (fish or no fish) and some very very bad. Guided trips are in my opinion priced to what the market will bear. When I pay for a guided trip I do so fully recognizing this and also believe that for that particular day I have hired this guy/gal to give me my best shot at fish and to supply quality equipment...I tie my own leaders and knots...this is his/her job. As far as tipping goes I find it very hard to tip after a trip simply because I feel that the guide has made a very fair wage off of me that day. I certainly don't feel obligated to tip because the guide has a good personality or can tell good stories. I expect the former and appreciate the latter. If I tell some good stories or have a good personality do I get a discount? Without me he/she may have made nothing at all that day. I can understand why the guides and former guides like tips who wouldn't in their postition. I do agree somewhat with the postion that guiding is not really a service industry and tipping should not really be expected. In my book $30-40 per hour is a pretty fair wage. I fully expect a guide to work his arse off to put me into fish and if the day runs long and fishless so be it and after all I had to work my arse off to earn the money I am paying him/her.

As far as eggs go the roe stays with the boat....this applies even in my boat when I am taking friends out fishing as I explain to them how much bait we will be using. If they don't like it they can run flatfish all day! If at the end of the fishing we have made back the bait we used I am inclined to split the roe with someone who will use it....but I am not running a business either.
Posted by: Hooter

Re: tipping your fishing guide - 02/05/02 10:14 PM

Forgive me if I missed it but my main reason for expecting the eggs at the end of the day is because it is the best way to provide a QUALITY bait for the guys in the front of the boat to fish with all day. If they would rather fish with guides choice fresh out of the GI Joes cooler then they can have what they catch. If they want to fish with a primo egg, I expect back a fresh egg that I can provide the next guy with. Does that sound like too much to ask? confused
Posted by: Fish Jesus

Re: tipping your fishing guide - 02/05/02 11:12 PM

A business colleague treated my brother and I to a guided trip on the Cow (his choice) with the owner of a local camground. We learned alot about plug fishing and select holes to focus on...and for that we tipped him $25.00...and all was good until this...I needed a small part for one of my Ambassador reels...OK he finds one and proceeds to charge me just under a buck? Not that my tip should have covered the part but my thinking would have been to just give the part away to maybe keep someone coming back...petty as it may seem that sub dollar part sends me Fish Countries way every time!

FJ...out.
Posted by: TW

Re: tipping your fishing guide - 02/06/02 12:38 AM

If I have a good trip with a friendly guide I always leave a tip. Sometimes the fishing is just tough, so a hard working guide will earn a tip from me even if I get blanked. As for the eggs, I always let the guide have them. The eggs we used during the day came from another day, so it seems only right. The day a guide gets a lot of eggs has to cover for the days when he gets few if any. Plus every guide I have ever fished with cleaned and bagged the fish in order to get the eggs.
Just my .02
Tom
Posted by: Periwinkle

Re: tipping your fishing guide - 02/06/02 02:25 AM

I'm retired, and not well off, so a guided trip is a luxury. Therefore I'm in agreement w/ Salmo G. If the guide thinks his service is above and beyond then he should charge more or write it off as return engagements. Why don't the guides buy eggs from hatcheries like Ammerman does? rolleyes
Posted by: Straydog

Re: tipping your fishing guide - 02/06/02 09:52 AM

Good thread.....

I am not a guide and have never hired a guide but admit upfront I have a problem tipping, even in restaurants although I do usually tip the waitresses unless they are totally incompetent.

Guides are a different issue. I figure I work my arse off for my customers, can tell stories with best of em and am available to them almost 24-7 when they have questions or issues.

I go the extra mile to insure they have the right product at the right time and a fair price. The way the last year has gone I have spent many, many extra hours accomplishing this for my customers. With the outstanding runs we have had this last year, sourcing product has been a nightmare and I will warn everyone, it is looking like this season is going to be as bad or worse.

I figure I this is what I get paid to do and a tip is not expected. That is how I look at guides. They get paid to work their arses off (remember boys, it IS a job and I don't imagine anyone is forcing you to make this your carreer... eek )

The egg issue is a tricky one..... it is pretty well understood down here that eggs stay with the boat. My thoughts are it should be negotiated up front and a 50-50 split makes sense unless a client uses more eggs than usual.
Posted by: Dave Jackson

Re: tipping your fishing guide - 02/06/02 11:29 AM

If the guide is spending roughly $12 an hour on expenses then he needs to get out of the business.

Please explain to me how a guide would be spending $12/hr on expenses. Quality rods and reels should last awhile and therefore the initial cost would be spread out over a long period of time. Boat costs? Same. Not to mention all of these items fall under business expenses and get written off. Of course, I am not a tax consultant so please contact yours to find out more information.

That $18.75 figure also only accounts for the days when the guide takes just one person in their boat. How about the 2, 3, maybe 4 person days? Yeah, they're humping out there getting all of them rigged, baited, etc. but multiply that out (click Start->Run and then type Calc and press Enter) and that's damned good money.

If they're losing $12 in expenses an hour then maybe they need to start buying Vision Hooks . laugh
Posted by: Slab Quest

Re: tipping your fishing guide - 02/06/02 12:10 PM

I would think that with all the preparation and transportation, a guide would probably have invested at least 12 hours in order to provide 8 hours of fishing - that's a long day. I love to fish, but after doing that day after day, it would start to feel like work.
Posted by: Seacat

Re: tipping your fishing guide - 02/06/02 01:34 PM

I ALWAYS tip, appropriately of course. I've been out enough times on charters and with guides to know how to let them know that I'm not just a guy who doesn't really fish and just wants to see what it's all about, versus a corporate schmuck kind of guy that would rather be golfing.

I think that guides appreciate sharing tips with those that are truly interested. Those that do share are tipped accordingly. Those that don't, are tipped too. It's up to you, but I like to feel descent when I walk away, and know that if I call to book another trip, I'll be remembered and appreciated.

Some guides just don't have customer appreciation skills and they won't get any future business from me, but I still tip anyway.

I've tipped anywhere from $5 to $50 bucks depending...you make the call.
Posted by: Seacat

Re: tipping your fishing guide - 02/06/02 01:37 PM

I ALWAYS tip, appropriately of course. I've been out enough times on charters and with guides to know how to let them know that I'm not just a guy who doesn't really fish and just wants to see what it's all about, versus a corporate schmuck kind of guy that would rather be golfing.

I think that guides appreciate sharing tips with those that are truly interested. Those that do share are tipped accordingly. Those that don't, are tipped too. It's up to you, but I like to feel descent when I walk away, and know that if I call to book another trip, I'll be remembered and appreciated.

Some guides just don't have customer appreciation skills and they won't get any future business from me, but I still tip anyway.

I've tipped anywhere from $5 to $50 bucks depending...you make the call.
Posted by: PhishPhreak

Re: tipping your fishing guide - 02/06/02 01:46 PM

I'm not a guide - but I've hired guides about 5 times (not counting 2 charter fishing trips).

Worst trip - Jet sled 1 mile down the Sky, anchor the boat, drop some plugs, and sit and BS all day trying to keep warm in front of the propane heater. Occassionally jumping up (if it's your turn) to crank in a chum on that 25lb cable. Woohoo. I think we moved about 20ft all day. My dad had fun, and 2 out of 3 clients got their 2 chum limmit - but I would never do that again.
I don't think I tipped - but it was my first trip, and I didn't really think about it (plus I was paying my dad's way as well).

Best trips - fly fishing for salmon/steelhead on the NF Stilly, Sky, and an OP zipperlip. We floated in personal pontoon boats (awesome way to go), and learned a heck of a lot about reading the water, fishing under differnt conditions, choosing the right equimpment, and tons more. 2 trips I ended up with sore arms from all the fish, 2 trips we got skunked. He worked hard each time, shared 'secret' guide tricks/locations/flies etc, made us laugh, and taught us a lot. He got a tip every time.

If you can afford it, and he wasn't a complete looser - a little tip seems pretty reasonable to me.
Posted by: wryan

Re: tipping your fishing guide - 02/06/02 02:13 PM

why do people deem tipping necessary. I have a job, i picked that job, its my choice to go to work every day and when i do a good job, bust my butt and don't even take a break sometimes nobody feels the need to tip me. if i'm quoted a price for the services someone is willing to provide then why do i need to give more? if they thought their services were so much better than the next guys then maybe they should have charged more.
When you go to the store and the cashier hurries to get you through the line do tip her?
Here's a tip "Don't eat yellow snow"
Posted by: Seacat

Re: tipping your fishing guide - 02/06/02 04:40 PM

Why?

What goes around comes around dude...think about it. It's part of that business. I don't get tipped for my work, but I'm not in a tipping business.

If you don't want to don't. Simple as that.
Posted by: Hooter

Re: tipping your fishing guide - 02/06/02 09:47 PM

Dave Jackson, figure in cancelled trips (usually half a days wage) and blown out rivers. A lost anchor, 30 to 50 bucks. An accidental broken rod, reel, and heaven forbid your boats main powerplant takes a dive. Does this stuff happen all the time? No. But it does seem like it's always something...
Posted by: Dave Jackson

Re: tipping your fishing guide - 02/07/02 12:15 AM

But again, those items will be prorated over their lifetime. And as long as you're buying quality stuff with a good warranty then that's not a problem. Especially since it's all written off at the end of the year (please see my previous "IANATA" comment).

Cancelled trips happen. It's part of the business. But when you have 3+ trips a week of 3+ anglers in the boat, that tends to make up for it.

If it wasn't such good work that paid respectably well there wouldn't be so damned many of them.
Posted by: Salmo g.

Re: tipping your fishing guide - 02/07/02 01:34 AM

Some things never change. Some of us don't understand why tipping is common in the fishing guide industry, and some of us think it's natural as can be. Some claim that guiding isn't a "service industry." I don't get that. By definition, it's a service industry because the product is a service, not a commodity. Or maybe like computer software, it's "intellectual property." (LOL)

Although I haven't ever hired a guide for freshwater fishing, I know a little about it because I did it in a lifetime long ago. A tip was nice, but I didn't understand it any better then than I do now. We set our own rates to cover the cost of our direct and indirect expenses and our perceived value for our time. It was very hard work, as we did multi-day float trips, setting up new camps every night, so work days were from 7 am to 10 or 11 pm. But if I had thought I wasn't being paid enough for my time or expenses, I would have charged more. Since we were fly fishing, nobody was interested in eggs.

That was my point in this thread last year. Guides are independent businessmen who set their own rates, just as the carpenter and plumber does who work on my house. I don't tip them because of their personality or the good jokes they tell. A key difference tho, is I don't spend the entire day with them, either.

I think it comes down to traditional practices that vary from one society to the next. Here we tip waiters and waitresses, haircutters, baggage handlers, taxi drivers, baristas and fishing guides. And apparently we don't tip carpenters, plumbers, grocery clerks, dentists, or investment bankers. Almost random?

Sincerely,

Salmo g.
Posted by: headshaker

Re: tipping your fishing guide - 02/07/02 05:59 AM

Salmo g. .. I enjoy all of your posts whether I agree with them or not. This time I do but also understand the guides need for eggs(and my own- but not completly necessary).
Your posts are very to the point and succinct. Keep on posting!! [email]greenwaters[/email]
Posted by: FishinFinatic

Re: tipping your fishing guide - 02/07/02 03:04 PM

I have no problem tipping. But with some of the comments made, that if its in there boat, its their eggs at the end of the day. Maybe us clients should just give back what we used. If i use 1 skien of eggs then i keep the other 3. Or maybe the eggs should be the tip. Since it will cost us money to buy eggs. You don't want us to buy eggs from the indians do ya.
Just my .02. You don't like it I'll invest my money in another guide. theres plenty of good ones out there.
Posted by: thefishnfool

Re: tipping your fishing guide - 02/07/02 03:26 PM

Ok.......for all of you that say you don't know why they should get tipped because you don't get tipped??? What about all your year end bonus's and for a most companies nowaday's profit sharing. You say you aren't rewarded for working your arse off but think about next time you get a 2 or 3 hundred dollar bonus for profit sharing. I personally know a few guides, Johnny Coho, having worked for him in AK this last summer, and Dennis Dickson, and I know how much work behind the scenes goes into it all. Whenever I am over at Dennis's house he is always tying up flies, every time I am over there he's either at the bench or emailing clients. And for the gear guides, start adding up the costs of 25,000 dollar sleds, 7 or 8K drift boats, 10 rod and reel combos @300 each, and it starts adding up. Heck.........take the cost of corkies and slinkies. A jar or shot cost 8-10 bucks and granted they buy corkies in bulk, but start adding up losing 30-50 a day which is commin when side drifting and it starts to add up.
Yes if they weren't covering costs they would raise there rates, but wouldn't you rather them charge a little less, and give you the option of tipping than raise there raits. I know these guys and the industry fairly well and lets just say that these guys are in it for the love of the game and to see that smile on the person's face as they land their first steelhead. They are not going to retire rich anytime soon.
Posted by: Straydog

Re: tipping your fishing guide - 02/07/02 03:47 PM

One important element that seems to be missing and keeps coming to mind when I read all the reasons such as high boat and gear costs and the hours these guys have to put in as justification for needing to be tipped.

No one is making them be guides. If it is so cost prohibative and over work/under pay, why are so many doing it? Is there someone we don't know about forcing them to enter or stay in this line of work???? confused
Posted by: TW

Re: tipping your fishing guide - 02/07/02 05:05 PM

Straydog,

I think the point people are making about Guides costs are that they aren't getting rich. A good guide can make a good living though. And you are right that they can certainly do something else. A good guide loves his/her job.(Or at least most of the time)
One note that I mentioned earlier and some other people have also mentioned is a guide making an extra effort. For example I have a good friend who guides up in Hells Canyon in a jetboat. On slow days I have seen him burn over twice the normal fuel running around working his butt off hitting every little spot he knows to get a few fish. At the same time I have seen some of his competitors working the same tired old spot all day and saving fuel and not catching fish. Now my friend doesn't expect a tip because of this, he works hard at it because he wants to get his clients into fish. However, to me that extra effort sets him apart and in my mind as a client he has earned a tip from me. People have used the example of not tipping the plumber etc, but that is not always true. I go to college and do electrial work on the side. When I do work for these people I make a point of doing very nice work and as fast as I can. The last three jobs I have did, when I got paid my customer had added an extra $50 or so because of the "great job" I had did. Do I expect it? No, but I am always appreciative. And as someone mentioned above in most businesses extra effort results in bonuses and promotions.
One last note, people always talk about guides fishing all the time. In reality, most guides help other people catch fish all the time. Spend all day running a tiller while watching people miss strikes, foul up gear, and treat high dollar equipment like garbage. Yes it's all part of the job, but seeing it gave me an appreciation of the effort it takes sometimes.
Sorry such a long post.
Tom
Posted by: PhishPhreak

Re: tipping your fishing guide - 02/07/02 05:26 PM

I agree with the what has been stated several times. If you don't want to tip - don't.
For most of us, we've saved up some extra money for our trip, and tipping is not in the budget. No one will mind.

As for me, I like to be a 'good customer', especially if I ever plan on using their services again. When you care about the little details - fresh eggs, the best fly, finding the best 'taking' water, getting feedback on your presentation, a nice streamside lunch, and going the extra mile in general - you want them to consider you a good customer. If you are an a$$ at Denny's, you can expect a loogie (sp?) in your hamburger. If you are a bad customer on the river (tipping is definately not the only factor here, mainly it's your overall attitude), then you'll get what you paid for - probably nothing more.
I tip the lady who deep cleans our house once a month, and you can tell she appreciates by the effort she gives it every time. I tipped a guy who washed the outside of our windows and skylights because he was meticulous and didn't let a single streak go un-noticed. And I don't mind tipping a guide if I think he deserves it.

Another point - guides need to keep their base rate competivive to attract new clients. Cleary some guides are worth way more than others who charge roughly the same rates. When you find the good one, and you plan to use him again, I would advise becoming one of his 'good customers' - whether it's just being friendly and sharing some jokes, helping take down the equimpment at the end of the day, not being pi$$ed because you may have gotten skunked, or maybe you leave a small tip...
Posted by: scottguides

Re: tipping your fishing guide - 02/07/02 07:10 PM

i am a south west wa.fishing guide.tipping to me is not at all expected but greatly appreciated.a few examples of a day on the river.you go out with your clients have a great day,get your limits early,the clients think your great,give you a generous tip,easy day for me and got a nice tip.then theirs the days when the fish aren,t co-operating,you fish for hours without a strike,clients are wondering whats the matter with this guy eekand your fishing your arse off. somtimes,but not often you get skunked.some clients leave dissapointed no tip given.worked twice as hard as the other example,but we all know thats fishing.i will keep fishing till dark or they tell me to go home if nesesary to get my clients some fish,not because i want a tip but i want them too come back.that is far more important to me than a tip.most of the time my day runs about 12 to 14 hrs.i also enjoy it very much,enjoy meeting new people, and if i was in it for the money i would try something else. wink scott
http://www.scottguides.com
Posted by: cowlitzfisherman

Re: tipping your fishing guide - 02/07/02 07:28 PM

Salmo;

Since you have given your opinion on tipping, I'll jump in and tell our board my fillings concerning this issue, and few others. As you know Salmo, I too was a guide for about tens years. When I was guiding, I did not expect any other payment other then my original service fee. At that time, I charged $100 per person. If I took 3 people out, I made pretty good money that day.

My operating cost at that time for licenses and insurance ran about $1800 yearly. I spent about another twenty five to three thousand dollars on fishing tackle each year. The fuel for my truck and boat costs me about another $3000 each year (and I mainly fished the Cowlitz). So that's about $7,800 each year just for normal expenses right off the top. That also meant that I had to take at lease 78 people out fishing just to break even. Now that doesn't cover any motor, truck or other tackle repairs. Drift boat guides may get by a little bit cheaper because they don't have to feed the jet sled and its associated costs to keep it running, but if you have both, raise the costs even more (trailer and other license taxes, etc.).

So are most guides getting rich from fishing? No. A tip was always appreciated, but never expected. The only time that I felt that a tip was expected, was when I stayed out fishing for another 2 or 3 hours longer then the normal eight hour fishing trip (8 hours). I always told my clients that my $100 fee was for eight hours of fishing, or until they caught their legal limits of fish. Legally, they could not continue fishing after they had caught their limits.

As far as the egg thing goes, I always told my clients before fishing "the eggs were going to stay with the boat", before we went fishing". I explained to them that the bait that they are using today was the bait caught from the fish the day before. If I was not using "eggs" for that days fishing, I didn't mind giving them the eggs that were caught during that day fishing. Either way, if they really wanted the eggs I would let them have them. I just tried to let them know that their eggs would be used to help the next clients enjoy their tip, just as they have done. Almost never did my clients bark about the eggs after explaining why I needed their eggs.

Moral of this story; if you're not a full time guide willing to fight and put up with all the elements of nature, day in and day out, and you don't have the patience to deal with all types of personalities, seasons closers, and all the other "crap" that the average fishermen never sees or has to deal with, don't do it!

You will save yourself a lot of money, and enjoy your fishing much, much more. Just remember this, when fishing becomes work, fishing is no longer "the fun thing" that we all love to do. If you feel that your guide gave you more then what you had paid for, then by all means, tip him what ever you think it is worth. There is no set price for tipping a guide! There are lots of want-to-b's guides out there, but when you fish with a professional, you will know it.

Well, that's my 2 cents worth!

Cowlitzfisherman

Is the taste of the bait worth the sting of the hook????
Posted by: Straydog

Re: tipping your fishing guide - 02/07/02 09:55 PM

TW,

I agree that guides aren't getting rich and have often wondered why anyone would want to do it. confused

I guess it is the notion some have that it is expected that bothers me.

If someone puts out extra effort for me I certainly acknowledge it financialy and verbaly.

I do not however, tip someone because the tools of their trade are expensive, the nature of their job is demanding or it is expected. smile
Posted by: BigShark

Re: tipping your fishing guide - 02/09/02 03:19 AM

I have never been a guide just a client. The subject of tipping is a good one for us all to express our feelings on. I don't tip my doctor and he has lots of expensive gear in his office. When I get the bill for $90 to $120 for 15 to 30
min. of his time I don't feel like giving a tip if it were the custom. When a guide puts in 6 to 10 hours for say $130 per man and puts his body through hell rowing I have a different feeling. This guy may well have made me more money than anybody in my business on that specific day. I got the order, or I got the guy to come to work for us, etc. When it's business, tip like you mean to say thanks for what the guide did for you. A $100 per man tip can be very reasonable. If it's not business, then a 15% to 20% tip per day seems reasonable to me. Being a really good guide should bring you the really good clients.
Seems fair to me anyway.