Skin Mount vs Replica?

No, I didn't do a search to see what the archives had on this subject. Thought I'd waste some more of Bob's server HD space.

Let's say you get that State Record Steelhead (hatchery of course), Fish of Lifetime. 53 pound hatchery fish, all perfect fins except the missing adipose fin, caught out of the Cantellya River.

Time to get it on the wall.

Do you get a skin mount or replica? What is better and why?

Bardo - you seem to actually go out and get fish, yet still have replicas made. Please explain to us why. Don't the replicat's just kinda "look fake"?

Do mounts wear out, look nasty, or what?

Just curious, that's all. I don't have any fish on my walls, so I don't know the answers to those quesitons.

Let's hear what you all think!

Also, for those with cameras, and scanners, if you've got replicas or mounts, take a peekture and post them on this thread. I'd like to see whats on your walls. Or, show us the handy work of your replicas!

Ok Bardo, let's see some of those bad boys!

I think the replicas look pretty cheesy to, but they last forever, I have heard the skin mounts do deteriorate, but they look way better. That 53lb brat would be skinned and on my wall without a second thought.

Ive seen crappy replicas and crapy skin mounts. But ive seen them where you cant tell the difference either.

The one at Thriftway In Forks is a replica and its one of the better ones I have seen.

One thing for sure No matter who does it or how good of job they do its never gonna look exactly like the fish you caught. That picture in you mind will never be matched.

Parker,skin mounts are the way to go when it won't hurt the resource.I have "done" fish for myself for 20 years and they still look good.They won't "fall-apart" if mounted properly.Every few years just dust 'em off and clearcoat.One thing to look for is the real head.Alot of taxidermists will cut it off and put some plastic job on there.It's criminal but easy.Replicas are fine for the C and R fish but skin mounts carry the soul of the trophy.

I have seen most of Bardos replicas, and they all look very good. I would say that a lot depends on the skill of the guy doing the job, skin mount or replica.

It all depends on who does the replica. If you get one from Rick Leach in Portland, museum grade, you have a magnificent trophy. World class artist. For you Seattle-area guys, you can see two of Rick's finest products at Doug's Boats in Woodinville. Just ask to see Tom's mounts.

Replicas are the best if you are thinking about showing your grandchildren down the road.
They will last forever. I have some skin mounts, that are almost 20 years old of bass (Dad's from the east coast) and some salmon from Sitka, and they look pretty shoddy. They are OK in the garage, but the mantle, no way. Maybe these days the process has improved and the preservatives are better. I dont know.
If you do your homework and find a good taxidermist, he can make a mold out of your fish (I think that is what Bardo is up to), or cut and hack an exisiting mold to match the specs of your fish.
Gary Wilgus from Marysville just did a 24" Brown for me that I released last summer on the Madison in Montana. It looks almost EXACTLY like the fish in my photo. Jaw hook, head shape, coloring, and he was able to shape the mold (not sure how) exactly like I wanted it. (Taking a fly off the surface), instead of just the normal straight on the wall mount.
Anyhow, look him up if thats what you are interested in. He does skin mounts also, but will recommend a replica.
By the way, he is doing my 42X23 buck steelie I RELEASED on a north sound river a couple years ago now. Pictures and measurements can be stored much better for future mounting (as opposed to freezer burn) when you can afford an 800 dollar mount!

Parker,

I had this same question awhile back. I am having a replica done of a big one I got in 96'. I'm going with an artist by the name of Luke Filmer. His company is called Blackwater Trading Co. and he does the most lifelike repro's I have ever seen. Attention to EVERY detail, hand-painted scales....absolutley beautiful work!. They will last indefinitely and look as good or better than skin mounts-at least his do.

Check out the chinook and steelhead in his photo gallery:

http://www.blackwatertrading.com/html/getflash.html

Ditto. Do not order a replica without giving Luke Filmer of Blackwater Trading Co. a call. His work is beautiful. He'll probably want you to visit his studio in Steilacoom where you can help compose the mount and pick out the driftwood pieces you want, decide exactly how fancy you want the wood finished, etc. He even has small river stones from most of Washington's rivers that he'll work into the arrangement, so you can have something of the river in which you caught the fish. That's a nice touch. You will be impressed.

Wow. That's some fine looking art. Blackwater has me sold!

Now, more of a personal question. How much would a 42" steelhead replica cost me?

Parker

Museum Quality: 42*18= 756$
Competition Quality : 42*12= 504$

It *pays* to catch runts as far a wall mounts go.
I'll stick with pictures for the time being.

Edit: just wondering how much that 78" sturge I picked up last fall would cost to replicate:

78x18= $1404... thats more than my truck is worth.

I have to agree with you on this one Rich G. "Save" that fish if it is a"wild native one", but if it's just a record "hatchery fish", well maybe you will still want to just"take that picture" anyway!

I caught a 4lb state record Brook Trout for that year (to long ago to say exactly when) in California. It took both the "Sports Afield" and the "Field & Streams" State Awards for that year, for its size, and its species. It was caught in "the back county lakes" and I packed it out on my 65 lb "back pack" (that was when I was 35 years younger then).

I paid the going price then to have a "skin mounted" fish and it was very costly! Catching a 4lb "Brook trout" in those days, and those "back lake areas", was like catching a 38 lb steelhead here now! It does NOT happen very often.

At that time, it cost me more money to have a skin mount than I will ever tell (that was wife #1). But I still have that same 4lb Brookie hanging on my wall. And other then a little bit of dust, it still looks just as good as the day that I wrapped it up in put it into my backpack.

Now,unless I catch another record class fish, it's going to be the "good old picture" thing from here on out for me. For me personally, it will be either the real thing, or the "real picture"! That special fish was also mounted on a piece of driftwood that I packed out from the same back country lake.

Pictures are so much, much, much, much, much, more cheaper!!! And besides that, you can always have that "mount" made from that same picture.

Cowlitzfisherman

Is the taste of the bait worth the sting of the hook????

i really like those replicas. done properly, they look great. a skin mount requires a lot of care. as long as you dont subject it to heat or moisture it will be ok. i like to collect trophy fish. if i catch a record i dont have to kill the fish. ive got several mounts that are larger than the current world records. some people collect cars, i collect big fish.

OK, I don't kill them anymore but here is a couple of skin mounts and a replica. The skins fade after awhile but the replica seems to stay the same.

I have several skins and a couple of replicas and would go with the replicas if you can.

fp

My best friend just paid a deposit to get a mount three weeks ago, from one of the best fish tax's in the business. Another friend has a fish at Campbell's in Steilacoomb.
The only difference between a skin mount and a replica (when done by the really good guys) is the fins. Skin mounts are more transluscent and flexible. Cost was the same both ways, approx. $22.00 per inch, plus base costs. Generally speaking, for a one-side wall mount, I would plan on about $1000.
The fish we looked at (that were waiting to be picked-up by clients, not "show pieces") were all incredible. If they were'nt side-by-side, and you did'nt know exactly what to look for, most people couldn't tell the difference between a replica and a skin mount.
I'm glad I went with someone else, and learned what I did BEFORE I caught the "big one" and had to decide who..how.. and what kind.

The most important consideration when deciding whether to go with a skin mount or repro is which artist will do the work. Either type of mount can be very good or very bad. Done right, there's not alot of difference visible to the eye.

A fiberglass repro will last simply because it's fiberglass. A skin mount that's done RIGHT (that's the key) will last too. We've all seen shoddy skin mounts that are yellowing (improperly degreased), have raised scales (poor mounting techniques), or have unnatural shrunken areas (poor finishing techniques). ALL the top fish taxidermists will use cast heads on all coldwater fish. DON'T accept the use of the real head. If the taxidermist you are considering insists on using the real head, find another taxidermist. That's not just my opinion, it's the industry-wide standard. Real heads will shrink and must be built up with epoxies, furthermore, it's not possible to completely remove all grease and oils which will eventually bleed through the finish. To see this for yourself, look on the underside of the head (in the throat area) of virtually any salmon or steelhead mount which has the real head and has been around for a few years. Chances are you'll see what I'm talking about.

Some info about repros; the taxidermist usually does not make a mold of your individual specimen (not possible if you released it), instead a "blank" is used that matches your measurements as closely as possible. Sometimes a custom mold can be made of your fish, if you have it, but expect to pay more in most cases. In order to be able to cast a "blank" of your dimensions, at some point a mold had to have been made of an actual fish the same size as yours. If you do someday catch a 50 lb steelhead it's going to cost a pretty penny to have a repro done because a fish of that size has never been killed and molded. An existing blank could be modified, which is difficult and very time consuming (expensive) or a carving could be made then molded to produce your repro (more expensive).

Commercially produced repro blanks vary greatly when it comes to quality. Some are very good but even more are junk. Look for yourself at the taxidermist's repros and see if they look natural and lifelike. I'm not talking paint here, but anatomy and pose.

Painting repros is a struggle for some taxidermists because there are absolutely no natural markings to start with. This is where we really separate the good from the not so good. Each artist has his own style and the results vary but the bottom line is- does it look like a steelhead? (or salmon, or whatever) Sounds simple, I know, but unfortunately it isn't. Anyone can spray on some airbrush paint but the best guys can make them look alive.

Prices vary alot too. The reason the best are more expensive is the amount of time put into each mount. Many more hours are required to do the job right and not cut corners. Of course, putting all that fine detail into the paint job takes more hours too. Don't ever forget, you plan to have that mount on the wall for decades. Saving a few bucks now could cost you in the future if the finished product is of poor quality. Price is always a consideration of course but if at all possible it shouldn't be the only reason for choosing one taxidermist over another. Quality is the most important factor.

Sorry to make this post so long, but I HATE to see a trophy fish that ends up looking like a piece of junk hanging on someone's wall. It doesn't have to be that way.

Take a look at the photos on the page below. Each photo is labled whether it's a skin or repro but try to disregard this. You decide if repros look unnatural.

http://www.twinriverstaxidermy.com/photo_gallery.htm

Another alternative I have seen is where they paint the fish and press in on canvas. The one I have seen was about a 35# king. Believe it was done somewhere in Alaska. Very classy looking, this one was in an office. With a nice frame believe my wife would even allow it in the living room.

M.M. I have to disagree with your advice.First of all your work looks very impressive but a piece of plastic is just that.Removing the head is the easy way out.Sure the last fish I mounted was a Tillimok King and it took 5 weeks to properly bleed the head.And no since it was done properly it didn't shrink or bleed.Sorry but you can't reproduce certain aspects of a fish especially in the head area(ie. teeth)The most important piece in any mount is the finish work/airbrushing.That will make or break any job.

mm, as far as your advice i'd have to say that you are right on. painting is the real key to a good job. my taxidermist does do all of his own molds, and the price is in line with the rest of the industry. it is possible to have a 50 lb. steelhead done,as i have access to a mold of that size.( it was taken from a 42 pound quinault steelhead and made longer and wider.)if someone was lucky enough to catch a fish that big,they could release it and still have something besides a picture to show off.

Slugfish, I'm not trying to criticize your methods. Certainly many thousands of fish have been mounted over the years using the real head. I do disagree that the details cannot be captured in molds. Repro heads are not taking the easy way out. They are the better way. If you are happy with the results you've had using the real head then by all means continue to use that method.

Anyone reading this doesn't have to take my word for it. Simply go to the website www.taxidermy.net

Click on "forums" then go to the "fish" category. Here you will find some of the biggest names in the business. Post this question to them and see what they tell you.

Bardo, I didn't see your post when I was posting the above message. Sometimes individual taxidermists have molds that they don't make available to other taxidermists. That could be the case with your taxidermist. Would you please send me an e-mail with his name and number? I'd like to see if he's willing to sell blanks from this mold.
doug@twinriverstaxidermy.com

M.M.I certainly don't mind criticism after all I am married I was taught taxidermy 20 years ago and I'm sure alot has changed.I guess I'm "old school"BTW I always take as much time as I want since I only mount fish for myself.Out of curiousity can you really get a narly head such as a Chum or Red in full battle dress now-adays

Parker, I've heard nothing but good things about Luke Filmer!

FJ...out

Bardo, take some photos of your mounts and show them what a good job Skinhead does

DW

Slugfish,
I can relate to the married comment!LOL. Yeah very accurate heads can be made. You're right about the teeth though, but it's a pretty easy process to put them in after everything else is done.