which boat to buy

i am looking to buy a new boat within the next couple of months i have always had the 16 &17 foot aluminum boats but now i want to buy a bigger saltwater boat and i cant decide if i should go with a fiberglass or aluminum the two boats that i am looking at are the trophy 2359 it is a 23 foot with a enclosed cabin and it has a 350 inboard the second boat is an almar which is aluminum it is also an enclosed cabin and it is 24 feet and it has a 225 four stroke yamaha outboard i will be using it mostly in the saltwater and it will be moored in the water during salmon season both boats are in the same 50,000 dollar range any input would be greatly appreciated thanks in advance

FOr my .02 opinion

Both those are good boats. But if you are going to fish almost all in saltwater and are planning to spend 50K then take a look at the 23 ft. Grady White. They are a little more but the resale value usually makes that back later. Doesn't get any better than a GW.

If you only can have one boat and want to do any boat fishing in the bigger rivers I think checking out the new 24 ft. Willie Raptor windshield with top model of vee sleds is a good idea. That hull has a little more vee in it than their Predator vee sled so it will ride the salt better, more than plenty good on inside Sound waters. With those new better outboard jet pumps on the outboard or with an inboard V8 with good jet pump unit, it would also allow you to use it up the Skagit Skykomish Cowlitz etc.

Many other good sled brands with good inboard or outboard vee sleds with windshields and tops. Having dual purpose makes them easier to sell later on in the northwest region. But they won't be as nice to sleep in but you can with the fold down seat options and full length top options.

My vote would be the almar with the outboard, I have had I/O and they are nothing but buckets of rust waiting to happen. And they weigh so much more than an Outboard, not counting the room they take up inside the boat.

I have a 22 foot walk-around that suits me and a couple buddies just fine. It is fiberglass though, used to use my 18 formula vee all the time in the salt and it was no worse for the wear. I have a brother who guides in Alaska and he has a 28 foot aluminum hull too.

Steve

I've been chartering in the Cape Flattery visinity for 10 years and fishing it for 20. One of my customers ended up in the water due to the hull seperation of a Bayliner of his. Another I know lost his buddy out there in a trophy. Same problem. Spend the extra $, especially in open or offshore waters or where conditions can possibly be unpredictable such as our coast. Many charter skippers here in the NW will have the same recomendation.
Check out Almar marine if aluminum is your choice in a saltwater vessel. If fiberglass, then Shamrock boats if inboard and Grady if outboard powered. My choice, 26' Almar sounder hull with center console inclosed pilothouse, w/twin four strokes. Honda 130s trim tabs and applicable electronics. The WDFWenforcment, just purchased a twin diesel 28' in the same configuration. Oh wait, our license fee's did. Our outfit runs a 37', but check out Topwater charter's 26' sounder out of Neah Bay. It's a 26 not a 22-24 as your looking for but some alaska outfits run Fleets of almar sounders. Topwater has a great website and is well regarded. Grady makes an exelent riding 22 and 24 and is as dry as any in that size range. Shamrock has the best ride with its full keel true inbord design. Tommycod chaters used to have one. Good Luck.

No Bayliners! Almar aluminum, GW in fiberglass. Without a doubt

I bought a 22 ft arima sea ledgend hard top this last summer with a 200 hp outboard nice stabile boat, high gunnels, lots of room, easy cleanup,nice big fish boxs, keep this in mind if you like fiberglass boats.

Dan

The Almar is a very well made and sturdy boat. I don't think all boating accidents happen on Bayliners. I think anyone could fall overboard on a boat be it a Shamrock, a Grady or anything else. The Almar would have the least maintenance of all the recommendations.

Almar

Out of your two options get the Almar. I had a 24' Bayliner that I bought brand new and the quality just isnt what it shoud be. If you want a glass boat do like the guys above posted get a Grady or Arima or maybe Sea Sport.

OK, I had to jump in on the Bayliner bashing thread. I agree tat there are issues on their older boats. They started a quality program a few years back that has greatly improved their structural integrity, fit, and finish. Their new products are well made. GW's are nice, but they also cost 1/3 more. If you are a hard core fisherman and can live without a few of the amenities go with the aluminum. No glass boat can take the abuse that a well made aluminum boat can. Seriously consider your requirements and buy a little bigger than you need. Boats depreciate and it's better to stretch a bit and get what you need. Trading up later can be expensive.

Almar
Good luck,
STRIKE ZONE

Given those two choices for the same money, I'd go with the Almar. No brainer. Don't even have to think about it :-) That 4-stroke 225 Yamaha clinches the deal for me. True, the I/O is a rust-pile, waiting to happen. It's impossible to keep a cast iron block rust-free when it sits 6" from sea water (the bilge) 24/7.

The Bayliner is a nice boat. It's just that they got expensive when they improved their quality. The Trophys now are right up there price-wise with Pursuit, Seaswirl, and Wellcraft. Grady White is still crazy-expensive, IMO.

Regards.

Finegrain
Woodinville

Of the two, I would go with the almar. I would also take a look at the Hewescraft alaska series. The company is in eastern washington and has been making some very fine boats for a long time. Another fine boat is the Wooldridge deep water plus. Made in Seattle they are top of the line boats.
I have a 17ft Arima that I like very much, but if I had 50,000 to spend on a boat I am not sure I would choose the 22 foot Arima. The Arima design is great for most water, very stable and very fuel efficient, but if I were buying something for mostly offshore use I would go with something with a little more V in the back of the boat. I think the Arima 15, 17, and 19 footers are top of the line in their size class, but the boat to dollar ratio slips alittle when you get to the 21 and 22 footers.
The trophy is better than it used to be, but I still think you can get more bang for your buck. I don't think that the trophy has improved to the point that justifies the price.

Here are a couple of links

hewescraft boat

Wooldridge boats

Have fun shopping (nothing better than picking out boats or trucks with someone elses money!!)

I bought a grady last year and could not be happier. Check out some of your options before you do anything. Jacobsens gets alot of consignment boats 2-10 years old from people who upgraded or are getting out of boating.

Personally, I looked at Trophys, nice features but I don't like to swim in the salt! I looked at Seaswirls and they seem to be nice boats with good features, i just could not get the info I needed to make this big purchase.

I would do the grady all over again in a heartbeat.

22' or 24' SeaSport for the NorthWest. Step inside & shut the door...

IMO Bayliners are like dating a woman that looks like a strong 8 on a scale of 1 to 10. Only to find out when the make up comes off that what you really have is a 4 to 5.

Boston Whaler looks to me to be as good if not better than the GW. Anybody own a Woolridge Deepwater 21 or 24 aluminum?

Slabquest
Sea Sport is a great choice, but if you find one for 50,000 let me know!

Even used they run way more than that.

Found this used Sea Sport that dosnt look to bad.
http://adcache.boattraderonline.com/6/1/2/59047512.htm

Fish –N- Chicks,

I am in full agreement get_my_drift and jaydee and the other members of the board who are telling you to ditch the idea of the Bayliner. The Almars' are good boats, but being a Grady owner myself, I am biased and lean towards the Grady white. 50 grand is a good chunk of coin, and there are a lot of good boats out there for under that amount of money that will perform, hold up well, keep you afloat when you accidentally find yourself at sea and in a compromising position; and most importantly ARE NOT BAYLINERS!

Best of luck to you!

JW

Oh you dont want a boat that big,, What about the rivers.. This is the boat for you.. I can even deliver it today
WOOLDRIDGE SPORT

I'd go with the almar.... I've seen topwater's boat and it is sweet! He's on the board occasionaly, but has his own website if you search"flyfishing neah bay" then locate topwater charters. He'll have some pix there.

I have a 20' hewescraft searunner which i use out there all the time. If I had 50k to spend would have ot the almar.

I know a guy who just bought a GW about 25', upgrading from a 22'. The new(used) one he bought in florida, saving a ton af $$. Just a thought.

GRADY WHITE!!! Just as nice as a Whaler if not better and not as much $$$.

I'm glad to see that most pretty much agree with me. However one thing to keep in mind. Pros and cons of fiberglass and aluminum. Overall weight of an aluminum hull proportion to size is obviously lighter than fg. But weight has its pros and cons. Weight affects your ride, fuel consumption, engine options, wear to your tow vehicle, ect. Alum has more durbility but usually hull failure in one is at the welds themselfs. Seen it in a Woolridge.
FG is molded in a jig but tell that to a guy who hits the dead-head @30+ knots. My old man hit one in the straits years back, accually in his sounder, and didn't even have it inspected by almar. It probably would have been a good idea, anyway but if he had hit it with a fiberglass boat, who knows what kinda damage it would have sustained. One of the reasons FG outshines Alum is the quietness of the ride and Alum's get hot to the touch in direct sunlight with warm weater. Also the nicks that Alum inevetably gets really does a number on fish lines. The maintenance of an Alum is so much less than FG and the riliability of that tow rig is gonna be increased.
Merry X-mas. Stay far away from BL's and don't fall out of any boat, good or not.

thanks for all the tips i think i am going to go with the almar !!!!

I currently am a Trophy owner and love the boat. When I do upgrade though I will be getting the 25sailfish. That is one sweet machine. Like a few above said look around a little and try Florida, you can save some big$$ by going down there.

Trophy is a good boat, still one of the most popluar/best Bayliners on the market. Pretty funny listening to all the bashing of them. I would love to see everyones picks of there old trophys that they thought were such junk... Years/modles etc. Think it could be how you take care of what you have? If ya treat something like sh!t that's what your gonna end up with... The new 2359 is a nice machine also, wouldn't hurt my feelings to have either one.

To answer glass or alum??? I personally like glass. I am out in all kinds of weather with the wife and daughter so the glass is a little more comfy for them.

Good luck.

Question for you guys, where did you find reasonable shipping to get a boat up here to Wa, I have done cars at about 1000.00 to 1500.00 from coast to coast, but have not found anyone that wants to mess with a boat on a trailer...??????

Thnx Bud.

Seing a tophy split like eggshell tied off to a coast guard rollover gave me chills. Finding out that one died and another was lucky enough to be saved give me chills evertime I see a trophy in the ocean or making a bar crossing. They are popular and so are ford trucks, but not because they're the safest. Saftey is #1 on the water. We don't have gills, them pea-brained things we spend all that money pursuing do. I don't deny that Bayliners have improved over the years. But their reputation speaks wonders, being that in my boat purchasing and operating experience, you basicly pay for what you get. 50k for a 2359 or 50k something else that is used by basically most ever govermental agency in our country. WDFW, NOAA, and numerous county Police departments in our state alone. I never have seen a fleet of bayliner charterboats either, no less one being used as a ceritified tow vessel. Heck, Idaho fish and game uses at least one Almar in Hell's Canyon on the Snake River.
By the way, any model of sailfish (GW) is without any doubts an impressive boat of any size or material in this opinionated guy's opinion. But that's just mine. I'm glad to see the choice is anything but a bayliner. Call it a vandetta. I've got more to say about them things. And I'm not the only one.
I hope any one who has read these posts and is considering buying or selling a bayliner takes into account what has been said here. I have never been so serious about posting any thing on the internet. I wish I had some photos of busted, and in one case, a flaming, and partially burnt trophy, and other bayliners. My biggest spite tward all balyliners though is the big express models. The only hard top I've seen flex due to hull stress. The only hull I've seen break in a sling launch.
Ford may have blamed firesomething tires for killing its consumers (of Explorers), but why did they recomend 26psi in those same tires anyway?
I haven't a clue. I do know all my tires got more psi than 26 on the freeway.
I've never had a blowout that caused a rollover and I've never been abord any vessel when a hull split like an eggshell, from sea conditions or otherwise.
At least shop around before you make decision on a boat purchase and I hope all of this influences at least someone else from risking themselves and others in a Bayliner, including a trophy. For my money, the odds are better in most anything else.

So, because you saw one trophy split they are all bad? Would you be saying the same of GW if you saw that? I guess the charter owner in OR who got a bunch of people killed last year has a POS boat too? If we go along with you analogy and I see a Land Rover Roll is a POS also?

You don't like Trophy's that's you deal. I've taken mine out in some big stuff and have felt very safe in them. There are more trophys out there then there are most other boats so just going by plain odds you will see more of them with issue. Now if you look at percentages I will put money down that they are in line with other manufactureers...


Now if you really want some usefull info check this review site out boat safety

AS far as your bashing Trophy I can also bet that every single boat has a story just as the one you are so heated about. But crucifying the thing because of your incident is not a accurate representation on the boat. BTW, how long did you own your trophy when this happened?

I probably have as much if not more time in an Almar then anyone here, all I can say is, AWESOME boats, I run them hard 10 hrs a day for 90-100 days every summer in conditions from mill pond to 6-8 ft seas, they take alot of abuse and just keep going, there are only a handful of glass boats that I would put to this kind of test and expect them to pass, Bayliner (new or old) is not 1 of them.

I think each boater needs to consider what kind of water am I going to be fishing in most of the time. If you almost exclusively go in lakes and the Sound, which is an inland waterway, I would think that the Bayliner Trophy is more than adequate, especially given the improvements to their boats. If you're a charter boat captain going out over the Bar at Westport or going out in the open ocean at Neah Bay, then you may want to spend a few more $$'s on your boat. At the end of the day, $$'s drive most boat purchasing decisions for most boaters anyway.

You are correct. The precentages are when you see way more of one particular type of machinery you will most likely see it fail just as way often. Maybe you misunderstood me. I wasn't refering to just one instance, but multiple. And on the water saftey is definately not just your epuipment, it begins with common sense and so on. I am not judging or criticizing people in particular, but I said what I said, not because I own fine vehicles that score high as status symbols, but because I know what has happened again and again.
I'm glad you or anyone feels safe it whatever boat the own especially in rugged sea conditions. And the person who just posted previously is probably a competent boat owner and operator. If you don't have confidence on the water that you don't belong there. I just simply want to be clear on my one point which is the numbers or percentages... Accually the ratio of structual hull failure to the whatever the number of which ever kind of popular vessel that leaves my home port, astoundingly, lead me to post what I posted. Some, if not most of us have been in Big stuff. Even in canoes, ferries whatever. Experience tells us each to form on opinion, and there's probably a considerable amount of bayliner owners who have read my posts on this topic. Some might be offended and I apoligize, honestly. My opinion is and will stay unchanged until those things track record changes in the future.
The coast guard has the stats, the exact numbers. Ask them their opinion. Write the seattle office for a request for info and you'll get it. Or simply ask an experienced crewmember who serves aboard a rollover or any of the resue boats at any of our coastal ports. I already know the jist of their response, because I've asked a few of them myself. Ask them if they'd own a BL if there was something else at the same price and size and suited the same needs. Keep your confidence on the water. Bayliner, Almar, Grady, or surfboard. Common sense too.
As for the Tacky Too, and her crew,tragedy, and in my opinion, over loaded for the bar conditions.
I was on the water that day off La Push and I heard about it over the phone on the water as it hit us through the media. And that was a pretty rugged day up here. But bar crossing with a rapid ebb and ouside sea conditions made it too much for that 32' vessel with that large crew. I don't know all the details but with the info I got, I think it was ultimately human error. I don't get much exposure to media on the peninsula, Internet and a cell phone and two VHF's, a single side band and a CB. No TV or paper, and minimal time in the summer to use any of those accept the radios. Leaving Tillimook bay is tricky some times and that Skipper could of probably done it blind folded. To my understanding he was very experienced.
(Pmartin. Never have owned, and I can't ever see owning one dispite the modest price of the used ones.)

I agree with you AkK. If I were fishing the conditions you are fishing I think (I know) I'd go with a different boat myself. But, As to what the original post was about and like Jeff'd said Trophy is a good quality option for the sound.

I guess I took some exception to someone commin' in and slamin' my baby when I love her so... Gotta stand up for my girl!! She's been so good to me

Nope, not anybody's baby. I know the feeling. I know the feeling a boat being like your baby. Only my favorite centimental boat was not ever owned by me. It's my old man's 18 footer. Its a workhorse tin can and in that little thing is were I realized I'll chase fish forever. Been in too big of water and probably way too far offshore but with the four stroke on it now, he can run chelan from south to north and back and have 3 quaters of his 50+ gallon fuel reserve left. And if anybody ever talked down on the good ol' "Paid 4" than they'd seem pretty ignorant to me. Good luck fishing.

I just have to jump on the Bayliner Bashing Bandwagon. I know of 2 boats that sank during halibut season this year, one at Neah and one at PA. They were both Bayliners. Listen to the distress calls to the Coast Guard. Its almost always a Bayliner. You can also ask the owner of "Fecal Matter" aka Piece of [Bleeeeep!]. He has a small Trophy and I see him at Neah every year. If it walks like a duck, and talks like at duck........

My humble 20' Formula Vee has given me 9 super years on the water; from water skiing in central Oregon, to springers on the Columbia, blackmouth in the Sound, to lings, butts, and salmon off the coast. The boat will take a lot more abuse than I am willing to tolerate, and most folks think we fish in some ugly conditions. I am not willing to put my life at risk in a boat that is known to fail. I'll stick with the Alumaweld until I can upgrade to the Seasport, but I would also take an Almar, Grady, or Arima.

Good Luck

My grandpa bought a deep water wooldridge this year and that boat is awesome. It is a jem out in the swell. He has the platform off the back with a 150 outboard and it is plenty of power. Its the 21' model and it fishes four of us great. I would imagine that with your higher budget you could get into the bigger model and be even more exstatic.

Good luck
Glow