Check

 

Defiance Boats!

LURECHARGE!

THE PP OUTDOOR FORUMS

Kast Gear!

Power Pro Shimano Reels G Loomis Rods

  Willie boats! Puffballs!

 

Three Rivers Marine

 

 
Topic Options
Rate This Topic
#1003285 - 02/12/19 03:05 PM A Most Practical And Realistic Point Of View
Great Bender Offline
Juvenile at Sea

Registered: 01/03/17
Posts: 155
Loc: Hood Canal

Top
#1003287 - 02/12/19 03:38 PM Re: A Most Practical And Realistic Point Of View [Re: Great Bender]
Jake Dogfish Offline
Spawner

Registered: 06/24/00
Posts: 554
Loc: Des Moines
Why do people think that sportsmen will make the decisions on what is hatchery and what is wild?
These articles are preaching to the choir but the decisions will be made by people who could care less about sport fishing. So let’s start preparing for that and planting every species of fish in areas where fish are extirpated. That’s all we are going to have left.

Top
#1003333 - 02/12/19 10:44 PM Re: A Most Practical And Realistic Point Of View [Re: Great Bender]
eyeFISH Offline
Ornamental Rice Bowl

Registered: 11/24/03
Posts: 12766
Count me among the salmon RACISTS!
_________________________
"Let every angler who loves to fish think what it would mean to him to find the fish were gone." (Zane Grey)

"If you don't kill them, they will spawn." (Carcassman)


The Keen Eye MD
Long Live the Kings!

Top
#1003337 - 02/12/19 11:03 PM Re: A Most Practical And Realistic Point Of View [Re: Great Bender]
FleaFlickr02 Online   content
River Nutrients

Registered: 10/28/09
Posts: 3313
"Because the damage is already done" is BS justification for doing anything. That's all I will say.

Top
#1003389 - 02/13/19 11:08 AM Re: A Most Practical And Realistic Point Of View [Re: Great Bender]
Carcassman Online   content
River Nutrients

Registered: 11/21/07
Posts: 7410
Loc: Olema,California,Planet Earth
If you want wild salmon, if you want naturally spawning runs, just stop planting hatchery fish. Regardless of their genetic history, crossing, "genetic pollution", and whatever if you STOP putting any hatchery fish on the grounds and let the remaining spawners spawn you will end up with wild fish that are genetically adapted to the current situation. Anybody who thinks that if we could bring genetically pure salmon back from 5000 BCE and that these genetic super fish would quickly repopulate and outcompete existing fish simply down's understand evolution, geologic, and climate change.

Top
#1003429 - 02/13/19 06:58 PM Re: A Most Practical And Realistic Point Of View [Re: Great Bender]
eyeFISH Offline
Ornamental Rice Bowl

Registered: 11/24/03
Posts: 12766
Originally Posted By: Great Bender


To ALL participating in this thread.

The link above was posted yesterday to draw attention to John Beath's piece.... promoting the "fish is a fish is a fish" agenda.

To appreciate the full context of this issue, make sure to read each blog entry starting with Ron Garner's letter to the Senate Committee on Feb 11. The next piece on Feb 12 expounds on Beath's "a fish is a fish" position. The third piece today Feb 13 is Pat Patillo's rebuttal to Beath's blog entry.
_________________________
"Let every angler who loves to fish think what it would mean to him to find the fish were gone." (Zane Grey)

"If you don't kill them, they will spawn." (Carcassman)


The Keen Eye MD
Long Live the Kings!

Top
#1003435 - 02/13/19 07:32 PM Re: A Most Practical And Realistic Point Of View [Re: eyeFISH]
eyeFISH Offline
Ornamental Rice Bowl

Registered: 11/24/03
Posts: 12766
Count me among the supporters of the reasoned response delivered by Mr. Patillo.

Thanks, Pat!
_________________________
"Let every angler who loves to fish think what it would mean to him to find the fish were gone." (Zane Grey)

"If you don't kill them, they will spawn." (Carcassman)


The Keen Eye MD
Long Live the Kings!

Top
#1003463 - 02/14/19 07:55 AM Re: A Most Practical And Realistic Point Of View [Re: Great Bender]
Paul Smenis Offline
Repeat Spawner

Registered: 08/02/12
Posts: 1052
Loc: In a drift boat...
Not all hatchery fish are created equal.
King of the reach comes to mind...
_________________________
YOUR MOTHER IS A TULE!


Top
#1003483 - 02/14/19 10:10 AM Re: A Most Practical And Realistic Point Of View [Re: Great Bender]
Salmo g. Offline
River Nutrients

Registered: 03/08/99
Posts: 13520
Nice article by Patillo.

Top
#1003484 - 02/14/19 10:13 AM Re: A Most Practical And Realistic Point Of View [Re: Great Bender]
OncyT Offline
Spawner

Registered: 02/06/08
Posts: 506
I agree with Salmo g.

Top
#1003488 - 02/14/19 10:59 AM Re: A Most Practical And Realistic Point Of View [Re: Great Bender]
darth baiter Offline
Juvenile at Sea

Registered: 04/04/10
Posts: 199
Loc: United States
Interesting that John Beath, who worked at Rivers Inlet and holds a line class record for a 51 lb Chinook on 6 lb test, has a "fish is a fish is a fish" attitude.

Top
#1003551 - 02/14/19 05:23 PM Re: A Most Practical And Realistic Point Of View [Re: Great Bender]
eyeFISH Offline
Ornamental Rice Bowl

Registered: 11/24/03
Posts: 12766
The "Fish is a fish is a fish" war cry is promoted only by those who stand to profit from maximally exploiting the resource REGARDLESS of the perilous consequences it may pose for wild fish populations.
_________________________
"Let every angler who loves to fish think what it would mean to him to find the fish were gone." (Zane Grey)

"If you don't kill them, they will spawn." (Carcassman)


The Keen Eye MD
Long Live the Kings!

Top
#1003571 - 02/15/19 07:02 AM Re: A Most Practical And Realistic Point Of View [Re: Great Bender]
Carcassman Online   content
River Nutrients

Registered: 11/21/07
Posts: 7410
Loc: Olema,California,Planet Earth
I know from experience that the thinking in the 70s was just that, a fish was a fish and they were reasonably interchangeable. Research has proven that wrong.

What i think most folks don't get, or don't want to get, is that our ability to exploit fish (and other naturally-produced resources) exceeds the ability of the system to produce them.

For argument's sake, let's say that the only thing holding down Chinook recovery in PS is habitat. But, in order to maximize our rate of recovery we simultaneously close all fisheries on Chinook and fully fund all the habitat restoration so that in 4 years we have fully "restored" habitat. How many Chinook will that fully functional habitat produce? We have that number. How many can we all catch? We have that number too. Is that catch number of purely wild fish as large as the mixed, primarily hatchery number we have today?

On one PS river, the goal of the tribe there was an annual harvest of 20K hatchery Chinook. Personally, I believe that at ecosystem-based goals, wild fish could support this but who would put 200K Chinook on the grounds? Anyway, the "best" models suggest a much lower sustainable harvest of wild fish.

If we want to insist on killing a lot of fish, and living in the PNW, and letting the human population grow, then hatchery production is the only viable answer.

And we haven't even talked about the fact that the North Pacific, right now, can't support the Chinook and coho going out there.

Top

Search

Site Links
Home
Our Washington Fishing
Our Alaska Fishing
Reports
Rates
Contact Us
About Us
Recipes
Photos / Videos
Visit us on Facebook
Today's Birthdays
3Gonads, herm
Recent Gallery Pix
hatchery steelhead
Hatchery Releases into the Pacific and Harvest
Who's Online
0 registered (), 1083 Guests and 2 Spiders online.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Newest Members
John Boob, Lawrence, I'm Still RichG, feyt, Freezeout
11498 Registered Users
Top Posters
Todd 28170
Dan S. 17149
Sol Duc 16138
The Moderator 14486
Salmo g. 13520
eyeFISH 12766
STRIKE ZONE 12107
Dogfish 10979
ParaLeaks 10513
Jerry Garcia 9160
Forum Stats
11498 Members
16 Forums
63773 Topics
645290 Posts

Max Online: 3001 @ 01/28/20 02:48 PM

Join the PP forums.

It's quick, easy, and always free!

Working for the fish and our future fishing opportunities:

The Wild Steelhead Coalition

The Photo & Video Gallery. Nearly 1200 images from our fishing trips! Tips, techniques, live weight calculator & more in the Fishing Resource Center. The time is now to get prime dates for 2018 Olympic Peninsula Winter Steelhead , don't miss out!.

| HOME | ALASKA FISHING | WASHINGTON FISHING | RIVER REPORTS | FORUMS | FISHING RESOURCE CENTER | CHARTER RATES | CONTACT US | WHAT ABOUT BOB? | PHOTO & VIDEO GALLERY | LEARN ABOUT THE FISH | RECIPES | SITE HELP & FAQ |