Poachin'

Just left Bob Heirman park on the Snohomish. Unless I'm reading the regs wrong, its closed to all fishing until Nov 1. Saw one guy leaving the river and a couple others looking for a spot to fish it. I told one guy it was closed until Nov 1 but he insisted it was open. Said he just talked to a guy who just talked to the warden, who said it was open. Also said he got a couple coho the other day. I didn't argue with him, but I did call the WDFW hotine. Unfortunately it appears you can't report poaching on a holiday unless you call 911.

So call 911? Judging from my past experiences with the Snohomish county police they wouldn't show up.

Didn't seem like a 911-worthy situation to me, especially since the guy I talked to was leaving. I do think it would be worthwhile for WDFW to post some notices at the really popular fishing spots.

Agree they should put up notices.

It would be best to check with WDFW, but it is my understanding that the Sky is open for Cutthroat and Dolly Varden and possibly resident rainbows, but not Salmon. I doubt we will have a Silver fishery this Fall based on current predictions. We could possibly have a complete shutdown, but will have to wait and see.

I will check with Mill Creek on Tuesday on the current regs.

Sorry Sebastes that is incorrect. Anywhere there could be salmon it is closed to all fishing. Last season the sky was closed to salmon and open to game fish. This year the WDFW caved even further and closed it to all fishing.

Rumor has it there has been lots of people up at Reiter enjoying closed waters as well.

Im not advocating poaching, but at this point you have to understand peoples "I don't give a sh!t attitude".

Its hard for me drive down to Aberdeen and see the nets in killing adult fish, when all we get is jacks. I wonder how well those hatchery chinooks did that took my hooks down their throats because I was fishing for jacks.

It must be harder for you pugetropolis guys, with no fishing period. Again, poaching isn't ok, but I feel for everyone who is getting shafted. 50/50 my a$$. Close it all down or open for all.

I talked to a guy who took a fish a hatchery chinook on the Chehalis the yesterday. Told him it was closed to adults, his answer was "nets are in, I'm keeping fish". He asked if I was going to call WDFW. I said, "no I won't keep em until its legal, but share your sentiment."

JG your post is 1000% USDA BS. First the QIN ( or Chehalis tribe ) had zero and I mean zero to do with the Chinook season for non treaty it was rules on the state side with a glitch in the GHMP the agency and Commission have refused to address. ( it is called 3/5 ) As for releasing we have jack fishing early on with release adult to protect the straggler Springers and most with half a brain just reach down and cut the leader and unless you get the gills good to go. Regardless our 5% impacts of the wild run size will be in release numbers as other than a few hatchery fish with Coho and Chinook it is a full C&R fishery pretty much similar to Steelhead. After September 16 you can keep clipped adults.

As for the fool you talked to ................... laws prevent the thinning of the gene pool on the human side of the species thing.

1. I understand it was the state who made the no adult rule until the 16th.
2. Do you really think our "Co-managers" didn't have anything to do with that decision.
3. I do cut the hook when deep hooked, I'm not an idiot. Im not going to use a 3/0 or bigger hook for jacks, so occasionally the 1/0 goes a little deeper.
4. I feel for the guy who kept that fish, the fish he should have the right to keep. It was a clipped chinook. Explain, right or not, why its fair for the nets to gobble up adult fish, while we are left clambering for the scraps that are jacks. Doesn't make much sense to me. The guys who were poaching on the Snohomish are probably pissed about the rec closures the same way this guy was. I won't risk the ticket. At least not at this point.

At some point its going to have to take more than meetings and rallies to change how we set seasons and regain our rights as sports fisherman.
The CO-Manager thing does not work. The Qin, the tulips, the Pukes and the state all have their heads so far up each others butt they are cleaning each others teeth.

It has to end sometime. At this point, it might take something less civil to get it done. Ive been saying for a few years now, lets hold a "fish in". No permits, on a "Closed" river. All fishing, regardless of technique, to show our fortitude and what we are willing to do. If 1000 fisherman would have showed up and fished on the Skokomish after that closure, things would have changed.

jgreen:

Must be young???? The battles have all been fought since the Bolt Decision. I went to all the meeting, did the hay and blackberries above the nets.....did no good.

I enjoy jack fishing, hate the idea of having to waste a punch on a fish that will be of limited use at any hatcheries. Was great a few years back when you got a extra punch card free.

I'm the person that asked if the Chehalis could be opened 8/1 - 9/15 for jacks......option was NO FISHING UNTIL 9/16. I'll take a open river any time over closed river......I'm still pissed about WDFW closing of local rivers, 10/15, and then the openings in the upper reaches where the fish should have been "more protected"...

Gear down, light line, small bait of eggs......silver jacks can be fun and for those that hook a Chinook jack in fast water, on light gear, can be a challenge.

What I don't agree on, 3 groups allowed to gillnet 1 river, that is decline of native fish.....time to eliminate 1 of these groups!!!!!!

Better fish while you can.....don't think it looks very good from what I see, grrrrrrrrrr

I don't blame people for being pissed either.

The WDFW sells lip service.

Looks to me like the Sky is in the same boat as the Snohomish (other than the upper North Fork): no fishing between Aug 31 and Nov 1.

As far as sympathy goes, I'm more sympathetic to those who don't know or understand that it's closed than those who simply disagree with the regs or think that others' (e.g., tribal) misdeeds somehow justify their own poaching.

jgreen,

I agree that "At some point its going to have to take more than meetings and rallies to change how we set seasons." and I believe that it will take some kind of a "crisis" to result in any positive change for the sportsman.
Some kind of a large scale fish in could be part of the strategy, but one and done wouldn't do it. The Tribes engaged in civil disobediance for years before their strategy produced positive results.

I assume we can all read so from the GHMP:

1) Annual Fishery Management Review. The Department shall annually evaluate fishery management tools and parameters and identify improvements as necessary to accurately predict fishery performance and escapement.

As a component of the annual fishery management review, the Department shall assess if spawner goals were achieved for Chehalis spring Chinook, Chehalis fall Chinook, Humptulips fall Chinook, Chehalis coho, Humptulips coho, and Grays Harbor chum salmon. If the number of natural-origin spawners was less than the goal in 3 out of the last 5 years (beginning in 2009), the Department shall implement the following measures:
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a) The predicted fishery impact for that stock in WDFW-managed fisheries in the Grays Harbor Basin will not exceed 5% of the adult return to Grays Harbor; and
b) If a spawner goal for fall Chinook salmon is not achieved, the Grays Harbor control zone2 off of the mouth of Grays Harbor will be implemented no later than the second Monday in August and continue until the end of September.1) Annual Fishery Management Review. The Department shall annually evaluate fishery management tools and parameters and identify improvements as necessary to accurately predict fishery performance and escapement.

As a component of the annual fishery management review, the Department shall assess if spawner goals were achieved for Chehalis spring Chinook, Chehalis fall Chinook, Humptulips fall Chinook, Chehalis coho, Humptulips coho, and Grays Harbor chum salmon. If the number of natural-origin spawners was less than the goal in 3 out of the last 5 years (beginning in 2009), the Department shall implement the following measures:
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a) The predicted fishery impact for that stock in WDFW-managed fisheries in the Grays Harbor Basin will not exceed 5% of the adult return to Grays Harbor; and
b) If a spawner goal for fall Chinook salmon is not achieved, the Grays Harbor control zone2 off of the mouth of Grays Harbor will be implemented no later than the second Monday in August and continue until the end of September.




The QIN had zip to do with the state no retention of Chinook period. We had 13,579 paper Chinook for harvest but the clause above directed a state 5% impact. Coho were in short supply so if one went straight catch and kill the season was almost DOR so C&R. In fact the bay fishery in the South channel is primarily a C&R Chinook fishery as Coho mostly travel North side. C&R is what the state uses to expand or maintain opportunity.

The QIN in recent years have been aggressive about Chinook ( we had substantial returns ) but backed off maxing Coho. Besides guys if you look at Willapa it was managed just the same as GH as to harvest with % to commercial ( QIN is commercial ) vs Rec. Bottom line is the co managers go to MSY but it has only been due to the GHMP & Willapa policies that any restraint was imposed.

That's great and I appreciate your efforts in this fight.

Now if we could only catch words.............We would have plenty to fish for.

That's the hell of it. The only people who suffer when a sacrifice needs to be made are the citizens who pay the lion's share of the costs to produce fish they can't retain. I think it's pretty damned admirable for us sport anglers to be so generous as to pay to produce fish for other people to catch for a profit.

I'm glad the fish have the GHMP and WBMP to protect them; they most assuredly need them. I just wish the sacrifices were shared a little farther up the fisheries totem pole. THAT would result in better fishing in every river where salmon swim, and it would guarantee higher escapements, since we all know anglers can't catch them all, no matter how many are there. As long as we have hatchery fish that MUST be caught, wild runs will continue their downward slide. We need to realize that a spawned-out carcass in a river has infinitely more value to the future of fisheries (and the families that depend on them) than a pair of fillets at the market. That's the restraint that is sorely needed.

Good one FF2 but one thing was a little off. Not correcting here but sorta sorting local fact vs state wide. We do NOT have to remove the hatchery fish in the Chehalis basin prior to returning to the facility. Unlike many places here we have weirs that stop the run and allow for the removal of the clipped fish & unclipped CWT HOR adults. ( they CWT but do not clip to do blind test to the harvest model assumptions ) The loss if one did not fish at all is simply the investment in producing them for catch nothing genetic. The HOR recruits will be removed be it by catch or at the hatchery.

Now the Hump is another matter and that one can and likely could drive one to take up drinking. Different river different circumstances.

I wonder what Marlin Brando would have thought about this development. I suppose we could just ask Sean Penn.

People are fed up with the [Bleeeeep!] that's happening with the tribes and the WDFW poor management practices. I'd expect to see more of it as time goes on. Right or wrong.

I don't see what the problem is. Just go spend 100k on a boat, 60k on a truck, and follow the runs up and down the coast.

As Tony Floor reminded us (while channeling Trump), "It'll be great. Just wonderful fishing opportunities. Everybody will catch fish!"

For whatever reason, WA caters to the boat-based angler. Probably because it can be very mobile and (maybe) it brings in a lot more tax dollars than a walk-and-wade.

It may be because the boating industry lobby has a few more lobbying dollars than the hiking boot lobby does

Fish on...

Todd

I'll certainly miss fishing the beaches for coho over the next few months.

I really feels sorry for places like John's and Ted's. They must be losing a lot of sales with no Edmonds or Everett coho derbies this year, or any coho fishing for that matter.
SF

They did.
WFDW.com
It's your job as a fisher person to know the rules and regs. of the area that you intend to fish.

No I don't.
Isn't that kind of thinking what got us in this mess to begin with?

Everyone should read and understand the regs. Sure. But an ever changing pamphlet that can only be understood to mean a river is closed if you read multiple pages in conjunction with each other is simply not as effective as a sign at the access point saying "river closed to all fishing until November 1."

I doubt there is enough staff to not only post the closures but to take them down when it changes.

Plus, WDFW tries (at least used to) to keep waters open for something. The pamphlet is so thick and complicated because they are trying to maximize the chance to fish. Since most of PS and its tributaries have some sort of ESA-listed fish the easiest thing to do is close it all down. Open only of there are no listed fish in that water.

Makes the pamphlet pretty small, saves a lot on printing costs too.

Writing regs is not easy. Or should I say writings regs that are enforceable, offer opportunity, offer needed protections, and are easily understood by the public are hard to write.

Writing regs is not easy. Or should I say writings regs that are enforceable, offer opportunity, offer needed protections, and are easily understood by the public are hard to write.

Agreed, it's not easy - but it is doable. Finding the right 2 or 3 people to write the regs will make it easier on thousands of other people, fishermen, wardens, judges, etc.

And when they're done with that, they need to rewrite our tax codes. {;>)

Haven't you guy's heard??

.... The flounder game is off the charts this time of year.

Grab some nightcrawlers and get afterit.

"I doubt there is enough staff to not only post the closures but to take them down when it changes."

Good God.
They must all be in the break room then.
The Olympia office alone has more people then required to perform ALL the states duties if they would work.

Throw in all the regional offices/manpower and it's a Chit Show at best.

That amount of people could build a river a day!!!

Considering wdfw.com is an available domain and goes nowhere I will assume you yourself have no clue what the reg book says.

wdfw.wa.gov

Call 911, ask for the WSP dispatch... They're the ones that dispatch the gamewardens anyways which is why they want you to call 911.

As someone who drafts legal language all the time, I am sympathetic to the people writing the regs. But I'm even more sympathetic to the people with no legal training who are trying to figure out when/where they can fish. Fishing shouldn't just be for people with high verbal IQ.

Anyway, you could post a notice on every major access point on the Snoho/Sky/Snoqualmie system in a day (although I have no idea what kind of red tape you would have to go through to get the wording of the notice approved). You could probably just quote the particular portions of the alread-approved regs that apply to the section in question.

There are actually a few guys out there, flip-phone/no phone type guys who never were/neverwanttobe on a computer, who could give a rats azz about any of that "dot com bs". A few less and less each year I suppose. I wonder how many old gents will pass this year without being able to catch a fish in their usual and accustomed way for the past 70+ years. Like one of my older (83!) buddies says, "it's these guys' plan to make all of us poachers."

If I was in that age range I'd probably be trying to find a place to plunk for silvers now.