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#446594 - 08/02/08 05:11 PM Re: Wolves in Washington [Re: cast this]
dcrzfitter Offline
Spawner

Registered: 04/10/99
Posts: 913
Loc: Tenino, wa U.S.A.
Cast this,

Maybe B-Run will know more about the wolves bothering people. The people I know in Idaho have told me the wolves havn't bothered anybody yet. the few times they did get circled were when they were cow talking and the wolves came in and thought they were elk. I would be curius to know if they have infact had anyreports of people getting chewed on by a wolf. I know when I am gutting my deer I allways have my handgun out and no more than 2' from me. probably still wouldn't do much good if a pack wanted me. Just makes me feel better.

As for the deer populations in WA. I think you nailed the resons right on the head!!! When I went through the CORT class the wdfw officer told us something like 3 or 4 deer are poached for every 1 taken legally. that is a staggering thought!!


Kris

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#446612 - 08/02/08 07:27 PM Re: Wolves in Washington [Re: dcrzfitter]
Pugnacious Offline
Spawner

Registered: 12/16/07
Posts: 891
Loc: It's funny to me!
I started huntiing Idaho when I was a kid. About 10 or 11. I can remeber seeing herds of elk that would put to shame any sort of herd today. Same goes for the amount of deer you see. Having smaller numbers is not necissarily the problem. The amount of wolves that are showing up are the problem. Ten years ago there were only maybe one or two sightings that I can recall within a couple years of reintroduction to the wild. About five years later that number rocketed. Soon after that you started to see the pictures of them showing up. That is when things started to get disturbing. The problem with the wolves is not that they prey on the animals that we all like to hunt. The biggest problem is the fact that they have a tendency to chase and kill animals for fun. Some of you may be thinking this is absurd, but that is the facts. It is widely known that these guys do this. It has been witnessed and documented the killing of does that are pregnant. The wolves just run them into exhaustion. They dont eat them, they dont even bother with the fawn that is born too soon as a result of the body stress imposed. Basically a natural abortion. Thereby killing two deer in one shot that is wasted.

Hunting the elk is another story. It has become extremely difficult to hunt them and calling is even tougher. They seem to have resorted to short locator sessions. And then you do not here them for days. This is mostly due to the fact the wolves show up. Last year my family and I were hunting an area that we had scouted and cased out a couple of bulls that were more than acceptable shooters. We came in on the day after opening knowing exactly what their habits were and that evening set in and made out calls. We got one bull in and that was it. The next day nothing. No cows, calves, bulls to speak of. Wouldn't you know it. The next night a guy from another camp was in an area about a mile away from where we called and headed back for the night when he crossed paths with a female and a cub. We did not see or here another elk or call for a week before we finally moved to another area completely.

The wolves did nothing to the man. We were never circled up that we know of. And the wolves were happy to get along their way. I have yet to hear of any aggresive behavior towards humans yet. But like anything else in nature, it is only a matter of time. Ranchers have already started to take things into their hands though.

I think what the main problem here is that the wolves that were reintroduced were Canadian wolves. They were introduced into an area that, to the best of my knowledge, was always timber wolf country. A smaller and less invasive wolf than the previously mentioned. With no other predators to keep them and the young in check, they have a seemingly endless boundry to territory they can claim. That coupled with the over abundant prey species, i.e. deer, elk, coyote, and anything else that moves, and you have a infestation. They need to be there. They take care of the things like the half dead zombie deer and elk walking around infected with CWD. And any other weaker of the species. But they do need some sort of regulation. And with nothing left to keep them in check that has to be us.
_________________________
To everybody else, YOU are the other guy.

Don't sweat the petty things, pet the sweaty things.

Boise State- National title, here we come!

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#446633 - 08/03/08 12:37 AM Re: Wolves in Washington [Re: Pugnacious]
Carcassman Offline
River Nutrients

Registered: 11/21/07
Posts: 5972
Loc: Olema,California,Planet Earth
What kept the wolves "in check" before? Predators are generally controlled by the available food. I was unaware of wolves having something regualary eating them.

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#446669 - 08/03/08 03:55 PM Re: Wolves in Washington [Re: Carcassman]
Pugnacious Offline
Spawner

Registered: 12/16/07
Posts: 891
Loc: It's funny to me!
Nope, noone is eating them. Sorry if that is what I seemed to say. The thing I was getting at was competition. There is no competition for them. So they are free to roam wherever to get to the overabundance of food that is available everywhere. Where as before, there were other wolves that kept the populations in check, which in turn would give no reason to the other species to spread beyond their normal range of inhabitance. I am not a biologist. I just know what I have seen happening over the last 15 or so years.
_________________________
To everybody else, YOU are the other guy.

Don't sweat the petty things, pet the sweaty things.

Boise State- National title, here we come!

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#447647 - 08/08/08 09:07 PM Re: Wolves in Washington [Re: Pugnacious]
Achewter Offline


Registered: 02/02/04
Posts: 2276
Loc: N of Seattle
If you run into a wolf while hunting it isnt that big of a deal. You dont need to call all your friends or post it on the net. Just take a deep breath. relax, enjoy nature and all that it offers. Then reload and continue hunting..........
_________________________
When Ma Nature decides to make ya her bitch, aint nothin your gonna do about it

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#447713 - 08/09/08 09:20 PM Re: Wolves in Washington [Re: B-RUN STEELY]
Irie Offline
River Nutrients

Registered: 11/26/06
Posts: 4358
Loc: South Sound
Originally Posted By: B-RUN STEELY
The wolf thing is a complex deal. I live in Idaho and its been a hot topic. A couple of facts.

1> Elk harvest numbers are actually up
2> Elk herds have actually seen an increase in numbers
3> Certain units have seen a serious decline in elk numbers while others have not followed that trend. The Salmon river and Selway have been hit pretty hard by wolf related losses while the southern units, Boise and Payette for example have seen gains and have the same number of wolves around.

Why ??? they don't know why. Its pretty strange.

True story.. the biggest problem the anti wolf crowd has is the dip sticks they let do the talking for them. Its always some freaking rancher. This dude is crying about losing money, and appealing to hunters to help him out. However, he is the same rancher who has thousands and thousands of acres of land locked up and has zero intention of letting any " hunters" on his land. Never has, and never will. But he wants your help.

A couple of years ago, a Grangeville guy was out chasing bears with hounds. Bad deal.. a pack of wolves killed his pack of hounds. So this gets national attention. Here is how the nation viewed it. " There I was beating up a Mexican, and a car full of Niggers stopped and beat my ass !!! can you believe it !!"..

So then you get some bubbas blabbing away on T.V about how wolfs should all be killed and whatever. The Peta types just pick them apart because rednecks are so freaking stupid. They have a valid point but they have to say a bunch of other ignorant crap to go along with it. The avg sportsman gets lost in the wash.

Same deal with the freaking NRA.. and the whole fruit cake gun nut crowd. I love guns. So why do I always have to have some douche bag with a AK 47 talking about how we should all carry guns to work and bla bla bla.. out front doing the talking for me.

I forgot what the topic was



agreeX100

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#447757 - 08/10/08 03:21 PM Re: Wolves in Washington [Re: dcrzfitter]
Pugnacious Offline
Spawner

Registered: 12/16/07
Posts: 891
Loc: It's funny to me!
Originally Posted By: dcrzfitter
Back in the late 80's my dad use to hunt the St. Hellens erea allot. they seen wolves now and then. He found out that weyhauser had planted some timber wolves to try and control the deer population.


Funny you should mention that. I was returning from elk hunting for two weeks up in the St. Helens area about three years ago, while driving along the river a wolf ran across the road. I nearly hit it. At first I was thinking to myself, "God damn that was the biggest damn coyote I have ever seen." Then I thought about it a little more trying to talk myself out of what it really was.


B-RUN

Gotta agree with you on that one. We have a huge problem as sportsmen. We all want our own hunting but have absoloutely no organization worth a damn to put up a good enough fight.


Edited by Pugnacious (08/10/08 03:23 PM)
_________________________
To everybody else, YOU are the other guy.

Don't sweat the petty things, pet the sweaty things.

Boise State- National title, here we come!

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#452488 - 09/10/08 11:53 AM Re: Wolves in Washington [Re: Pugnacious]
Todd Offline
Bumpin the 6X9's

Registered: 03/08/99
Posts: 26548
Loc: Seattle, Washington USA
You could take out "wolf" in all the above posts and put in any number of animals or fish, and the conversation would sound just the same...

The biggest problem with conversations like this is that usually the two sides of the debate are talking apples and oranges...some folks have a real, real hard time discerning the difference between "good for the animals" and "good for my hunting opportunities"...they are not the same thing, and often times are exactly the opposite thing.

I don't have much of an opinion either way on this one...I'm just struck by the parallels between this conversation and conversations surrounding fish management and artificial propogation, and the oftentimes mystifying argument that if I can't hit it in the head with a rock or shoot it dead, then what's the point of it even being there?

Fish on...

Todd

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#452860 - 09/11/08 09:04 PM Re: Wolves in Washington [Re: Todd]
Carcassman Offline
River Nutrients

Registered: 11/21/07
Posts: 5972
Loc: Olema,California,Planet Earth
Todd hit that nail on the head. Too often, and not just in conservation, the matra is "I want mine" but you can't have yours. Whether it be housing, roads, water, view lots, or whatever it seems that humans, as a species, can't (or more likely, won't) see beyond their own immediate needs.

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