#1066621 - 10/22/25 02:06 PM
WDFW DUMPS ON STEELHEAD
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River Nutrients
Registered: 03/03/09
Posts: 4687
Loc: Somewhere on the planet,I hope
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Washington will close hatchery that produces thousands of steelhead
There will soon be fewer steelhead released into Washington’s waters due to the impending closure of Skamania Hatchery.
Located in Washougal, the hatchery produces summer and winter steelhead that are released into southwest Washington rivers for recreational fishing.
The hatchery produces 331,000 steelhead per year, according to the state Department of Fish and Wildlife.
Operations at Skamania Hatchery will begin to slow over the next year, as the state Department of Fish and Wildlife begins the threeyear process of closing the facility.
The Washougal and Beaver Creek hatcheries will take over some steelhead production.
The Department of Fish and Wildlife estimates that closure of the Skamania Hatchery will reduce the total production of steelhead in Washington by 161,000 per year after factoring in the increased fish from the other facilities.
The hatchery’s closure will most strongly affect southwest Washington recreational steelhead anglers, according to the Department of Fish and Wildlife.
The Department of Fish and Wildlife announced its decision to close Skamania Hatchery in June after not receiving its full twoyear budget request from the state Legislature.
The agency had asked the Legislature for $1.9 million to maintain operations at the North Toutle and Skamania hatcheries, but only received $750,000 as lawmakers worked earlier this year to resolve a budget deficit in the $12 billion to $16 billion range.
“This funding is far short of the amount needed to sustain current hatchery operations at both facilities,” the Department of Fish and Wildlife said in its budget request for next year.
The North Toutle Hatchery produces Tule Fall Chinook and coho salmon.
With only enough funding to support continued operations at one of the two hatcheries, the Department of Fish and Wildlife determined that the benefits of keeping the North Toutle Hatchery open outweighed the benefits of the Skamania Hatchery.
Rather than asking the Legislature to backfill its initial request amid declining revenue forecasts, the Department of Fish and Wildlife is asking for $432,000 in the 2026
A wild winter steelhead caught in a Washington coastal river on the Olympic Peninsula held in the water prior to release. CHASE GUNNELL / WDFW
supplemental budget to start closing Skamania Hatchery.
“The Department recognizes the necessity of exercising fiscal restraint this year considering falling revenue forecasts, rising caseload costs, shifting federal impacts, and increasing tort liabilities,” Department of Fish and Wildlife Director Kelly Susewind said in a letter to Office of Financial Management Director K.D. Chapman-See.
Two Skamania Hatchery staff will be reassigned to the Washougal Hatchery but stay onsite at the Skamania Hatchery to oversee the three-year closure process.
Those staff members will continue trapping and fish ladder operations for returning adult fish that were released from the hatchery as juveniles.
Staff will finish closing the hatchery and begin decommissioning it once there are no more adult fish returning.
Decommissioning the hatchery will involve removing any intake or other inwater structures, demolishing infrastructure and restoring habitat in the area.
That process may take an additional six years after the hatchery closes and cost roughly $8 million, which the Department of Fish and Wildlife said will need to come from a future capital budget.
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Dazed and confused.............the fog is closing in
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#1066622 - 10/22/25 02:20 PM
Re: WDFW DUMPS ON STEELHEAD
[Re: Rivrguy]
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Returning Adult
Registered: 03/16/00
Posts: 326
Loc: snohomish, wa
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Total BS. We are now paying license fees to shut down sport fishing. Just keep voting for evil and evil is what you will get.
_________________________
Where is the wise man? Where is the scholar? Where is the philosopher of this age? Has not God made foolish the wisdom of the world?
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#1066623 - 10/22/25 02:31 PM
Re: WDFW DUMPS ON STEELHEAD
[Re: Rivrguy]
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River Nutrients
Registered: 11/21/07
Posts: 7899
Loc: Olema,California,Planet Earth
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Note the choice WDFW made was Tules/coho vs. steelhead. Salmon rules.
I find it interesting that WDFW has the Wildlife Fund to tap, which is separate from GFS. They increased fees and yet they use the "We don't have money for highways/education/etc-which is true) to justify the cuts.
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#1066624 - 10/22/25 02:32 PM
Re: WDFW DUMPS ON STEELHEAD
[Re: Rivrguy]
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River Nutrients
Registered: 11/21/07
Posts: 7899
Loc: Olema,California,Planet Earth
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Unfortunately Skamania is too far down the Columbia to be given to the Tribes. I also wonder if it was at least at one time connected to Mitchell Act (Fed).
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#1066626 - 10/22/25 03:49 PM
Re: WDFW DUMPS ON STEELHEAD
[Re: Rivrguy]
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Repeat Spawner
Registered: 12/06/07
Posts: 1479
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Started a conversation about this on another site. This site on was off line at the time. Another nail in the coffin for steelhead in this state.
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#1066628 - 10/22/25 04:49 PM
Re: WDFW DUMPS ON STEELHEAD
[Re: Rivrguy]
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River Nutrients
Registered: 11/21/07
Posts: 7899
Loc: Olema,California,Planet Earth
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Not sure that the whole decision was based on cost per fish to the creel, which may have been high. But salmon contribute to AK, BC, OR, WA, and Columbia fisheries which are all way more important than steelhead. They probably, cumulatively, have more anglers and commercials chasing them. Those Skamania's probably didn't even go to any Tribal fishery, either.
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#1066629 - 10/22/25 06:03 PM
Re: WDFW DUMPS ON STEELHEAD
[Re: Rivrguy]
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Returning Adult
Registered: 03/16/00
Posts: 326
Loc: snohomish, wa
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This and the Largest Tax Increase in Washington State History !!! Get Rid of these Turds.
_________________________
Where is the wise man? Where is the scholar? Where is the philosopher of this age? Has not God made foolish the wisdom of the world?
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#1066630 - 10/23/25 08:13 AM
Re: WDFW DUMPS ON STEELHEAD
[Re: Rivrguy]
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Repeat Spawner
Registered: 12/06/07
Posts: 1479
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More info to add. In a September 2024 legal settlement, the Washington Department of Fish and Wildlife (WDFW) agreed with conservation groups to close the segregated winter steelhead hatchery program at the Washougal River. The agreement is part of a broader effort to reduce the impact of hatchery fish on wild salmon and steelhead populations in the Lower Columbia River. The settlement was reached after a lawsuit from the Wild Fish Conservancy and The Conservation Angler alleged that hatchery fish were spawning with wild fish at levels that violate federal Endangered Species Act (ESA) standards.
Key components of the settlement Hatchery closures and reductions: WDFW agreed to several actions that modify hatchery releases: Washougal Winter Steelhead Program: The segregated winter steelhead program in the Washougal River basin will be terminated. However, WDFW plans to pursue a new program using native steelhead stock. Deep River Coho Program: The coho salmon program at the Deep River net pens will be closed. Kalama River Chinook Program: Releases of fall Chinook salmon from the Fallert Creek hatchery on the Kalama River will be reduced. Protection from future litigation: In return for the changes, the conservation groups provided WDFW with protection from further lawsuits over the same alleged ESA violations for a specified period. Increased transparency: The settlement requires WDFW to make more information about its hatchery programs publicly available. Legal fee reimbursement: WDFW agreed to reimburse the conservation groups for their legal and expert witness fees.
Implications and context Impact on wild fish: Conservation groups argued that the genetic interbreeding of hatchery fish with native stocks was harming the survival and recovery of wild, endangered fish. The settlement is seen as a way to better protect wild fish genetics. Shift in management: The deal reflects a shift towards focusing on integrated hatchery programs that use a portion of native fish for broodstock, helping to preserve local genetics. Gap in fishing opportunity: The transition to a new native-stock program in the Washougal River will likely create a temporary reduction in hatchery steelhead returns, impacting recreational fisheries. Ongoing tensions: While the settlement resolves the immediate lawsuit, it does not fully end the long-running debate between those who view hatcheries as essential for conservation and harvest and those who see them as detrimental to wild fish populations.
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#1066635 - 10/23/25 10:50 AM
Re: WDFW DUMPS ON STEELHEAD
[Re: Salmo g.]
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Three Time Spawner
Registered: 01/29/19
Posts: 1594
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I wonder when the Wild Fish Conservancy will take notice that its efforts have not resulted in any increases in wild steelhead productivity. i dont think they will salmmy. They were duped or already knew. Probably both.
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#1066636 - 10/23/25 11:24 AM
Re: WDFW DUMPS ON STEELHEAD
[Re: Rivrguy]
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Returning Adult
Registered: 02/15/21
Posts: 470
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Too late for y’all to wake up now, y’all got what you voted for.
Raise the taxes, kill the state’s fish, save your whale, and send this to the tribe to fix w more federal $$$.
Progress.....
Edited by 28 Gage (10/23/25 11:27 AM)
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Making Puget Sound Great Again - 2027 - Year of the Pinks! South Sound’s Super Humpy Promotional Director.
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#1066639 - 10/23/25 12:55 PM
Re: WDFW DUMPS ON STEELHEAD
[Re: Rivrguy]
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River Nutrients
Registered: 11/21/07
Posts: 7899
Loc: Olema,California,Planet Earth
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Just my opinion but I think WDFW would be overjoyed if steelhead just more or less disappeared. They are too difficult to manage, the stakeholders aren't pliable enough, they are expensive. And, recovery in real terms will require significant increases in marine derived nutrients delivered to the streams and we know that ain't gonna happen.
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#1066642 - 10/23/25 02:44 PM
Re: WDFW DUMPS ON STEELHEAD
[Re: Rivrguy]
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Returning Adult
Registered: 02/15/21
Posts: 470
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The old school F & G folks had no problem liking, promoting, and rearing Steelhead on behalf of the state’s fisherfolk . It wasn’t until the mid 70s thru the early 80s, activisim, politicks and saving the wild like it was before the new age folks , now in charge , came into the departments only to suck the life and money outta everything Steelhead.
Great State fish that it was...
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Making Puget Sound Great Again - 2027 - Year of the Pinks! South Sound’s Super Humpy Promotional Director.
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#1066644 - 10/23/25 07:02 PM
Re: WDFW DUMPS ON STEELHEAD
[Re: Rivrguy]
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King of the Beach
Registered: 12/11/02
Posts: 5223
Loc: Carkeek Park
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Maybe it’s time to rethink what the state fish is. We do have “Bass Week” now. SF
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Go Dawgs! Founding Member - 2025 Pink Plague Opposition Party #coholivesmatter
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#1066645 - 10/23/25 07:08 PM
Re: WDFW DUMPS ON STEELHEAD
[Re: Salmo g.]
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Repeat Spawner
Registered: 12/06/07
Posts: 1479
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I wonder when the Wild Fish Conservancy will take notice that its efforts have not resulted in any increases in wild steelhead productivity. The only thing there lawsuit efforts have ever achieved is less opportunity to fish for steelhead anywhere. For what? To never see a Steelhead beached on the shore? Or in a net to be released ever again? You can't enjoy Steelhead visually without hooking and landing one. Baffles my mind a little, that I like to swing flys for them. Don't those WFC guys like to do the same? Bastards! Dirty bastards for those that have demonized Steelhead fishing in this state. I say open everything everywhere year round for catch and release, regardless of hatchery smolt planting! That's done! What does it really matter? Actually I'm fed up. I'm brave talking after a couple of bourbon's tonight. This season I'm going to fish for steelhead where I want, when I want, regardless of regulations. I will pay the fines if caught, and go to jail if that what it comes to. You past dept. guys will struggle with this. In reality, my days are numbered anyway. If in jail for sportfishing catch and release, maybe Trump will pardon me for the Steelhead bshit thats' going on here in this state.
Edited by RUNnGUN (10/23/25 07:37 PM)
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#1066646 - 10/23/25 07:09 PM
Re: WDFW DUMPS ON STEELHEAD
[Re: stonefish]
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River Nutrients
Registered: 03/03/09
Posts: 4687
Loc: Somewhere on the planet,I hope
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I vote for "Salish Sucker" for state fish!
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Dazed and confused.............the fog is closing in
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#1066647 - 10/24/25 07:40 AM
Re: WDFW DUMPS ON STEELHEAD
[Re: Rivrguy]
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Three Time Spawner
Registered: 01/29/19
Posts: 1594
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I vote for "Salish Sucker" for state fish! lol. No way. Its gonna have to be the planter troot or grass carp.
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#1066648 - 10/24/25 08:28 AM
Re: WDFW DUMPS ON STEELHEAD
[Re: Rivrguy]
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Fallen Off The Deep End
Registered: 08/16/21
Posts: 608
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They sure have the money to do all these culvert projects that do not produce any fish...
about 95% of all the funds go to pay salaries and benefits...
back before the 2000's there were lots of private fish farms that were stocking steelhead,, people were raising their own fish and releasing them... I know of several,, Union River,, Sheerwood creek and others... Some just had rearing ponds connected to the creeks and some one they knew would deliver fry and some did the whole process themselves...
I think that's what we need to get back to,, fish farming as a hobby,, farming fish is not rocket science,, especially when its for recreation and not profit...
The government creates the problems,, if the government is not operating there are no problems...
As an example we have a government shutdown and nobody notices,, meaning we don't need them... We need to defund the state and all the agencies and take matters into our own hands regarding everything... The government regulates us,, tells us what we can and cant do,,, the government is not useful...
Edited by I'm Still RichG (10/24/25 08:31 AM)
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"The Koolaid has poison in it"
"The Bait is fake Nothing Is Tru"
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#1066649 - 10/24/25 08:36 AM
Re: WDFW DUMPS ON STEELHEAD
[Re: Rivrguy]
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Fallen Off The Deep End
Registered: 08/16/21
Posts: 608
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Several old concrete rearing pens on the canal near the beach where people raised their own chum for fun,, some even did it in garbage cans... When I was a cop I talked to several people who were doing or or had done it... The state went around and shut them all down by the late 90's mostly...
The state and tribes run the MAFIA racket on fish and wildlife and cannot let anyone get in on their money machine,, they regulate in the name of safety and science but its only about money and extortion...
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"The Koolaid has poison in it"
"The Bait is fake Nothing Is Tru"
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#1066650 - 10/24/25 08:38 AM
Re: WDFW DUMPS ON STEELHEAD
[Re: Rivrguy]
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Fallen Off The Deep End
Registered: 08/16/21
Posts: 608
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one can raise steelhead in a plastic swimming pool fed with a garden hose,, you just need the trout food and the fry,, its not even that hard to spawn your own fish and incubate your own eggs... Seen several fish farms in operation when I was a kid,, "Trout Farms",, they yousto be all over the place...
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"The Koolaid has poison in it"
"The Bait is fake Nothing Is Tru"
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#1066651 - 10/24/25 08:40 AM
Re: WDFW DUMPS ON STEELHEAD
[Re: Rivrguy]
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Fallen Off The Deep End
Registered: 08/16/21
Posts: 608
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chit,, most of the high schools that had creeks on their property had a fish hatchery back in the day,, there was one on Chimicum creek for years,, I remember releasing smolt when I was in 1st grade...
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"The Koolaid has poison in it"
"The Bait is fake Nothing Is Tru"
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#1066654 - 10/24/25 12:06 PM
Re: WDFW DUMPS ON STEELHEAD
[Re: Rivrguy]
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River Nutrients
Registered: 04/25/00
Posts: 5032
Loc: East of Aberdeen, West of Mont...
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10/24/2025
The "hand writing was on the wall" when State Combined, the 2 State agencies that made decisions on any fish in WA State, and then made most of the Top management personnel from the Salmon agency.
It's been a "down hill spiral", for Steelhead since then.....
1994 - Legislature merges Department of Wildlife and Department of Fisheries, creating the Washington Department of Fish and Wildlife, with a nine-member commission and a director appointed by the Commission.
Grrrrrrrrrrr
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"Worse day sport fishing, still better than the best day working"
"I thought growing older, would take longer"
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#1066657 - 10/24/25 03:30 PM
Re: WDFW DUMPS ON STEELHEAD
[Re: Rivrguy]
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River Nutrients
Registered: 11/21/07
Posts: 7899
Loc: Olema,California,Planet Earth
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While I agree with Drifter on the result of merger I believed at the time that it was good idea. It was supposed to remove day to day politics from management. It put the WDG/WDW management paradigm (Commission/Commission appointed Director) in place. Having worked in both agencies I supported that.
From the inside one thing that I noticed in the merger was that WDW did no preparation, no planning for how the future agency would look. It's like "if you don't vote don't complain about the results". But it was glaringly obvious that salmon won and every other fish lost.
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#1066658 - 10/24/25 04:50 PM
Re: WDFW DUMPS ON STEELHEAD
[Re: Rivrguy]
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River Nutrients
Registered: 11/21/07
Posts: 7899
Loc: Olema,California,Planet Earth
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When merger occurred, I was in the Hatcheries part of WDF. That integration was done by throwing out the organization plans of both agencies and coming up with a whole new form. It also included significant restructuring of pay levels and such. I know that a lot of the workers weren't happy with the new form but I think it ws the way to go. Whole new organization, whole new way of doing business, etc. Not forcing one side to adopt the other's ways.
It was also noted, though, that these agency mergers finally succeed when all the pre-merger staff has retired or otherwise left the building.
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#1066661 - 10/25/25 08:53 AM
Re: WDFW DUMPS ON STEELHEAD
[Re: Rivrguy]
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Repeat Spawner
Registered: 12/06/07
Posts: 1479
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Ya, the whole new way of business that screwed the steelhead and steelhead angling. I remember they started to combine salmon and steelhead at the same hatcheries after the merger. Prior, all were separate. I thought that was biologically not possible? They moved steelhead rearing on the Puy Carbon, from the Clark's creek facility, to Voights creek salmon hatchery. The hatchery returns were never the same after that, and got to a point where hardly any came back at all. Led to the elimination of the steelhead program and closure for winter steelhead. I often wondered if it was a coincidence/conspiracy, or just the beginning of survival issues state wide, West coast wide? Very very sad.
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#1066662 - 10/25/25 10:23 AM
Re: WDFW DUMPS ON STEELHEAD
[Re: Rivrguy]
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Fallen Off The Deep End
Registered: 08/16/21
Posts: 608
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And you all will just take it,, accept it while you keep participating in rigged elections that install the same cocksuckers that screwed you,, and you wonder how this keeps happening?
It keeps happening because you are lazy and refuse to accept responsibility,, refuse to take matters into your own hands.. Slaves ruled by idiots who are taking orders/instructions from a higher level of idiots...
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"The Koolaid has poison in it"
"The Bait is fake Nothing Is Tru"
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#1066666 - 10/25/25 12:07 PM
Re: WDFW DUMPS ON STEELHEAD
[Re: RUNnGUN]
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River Nutrients
Registered: 11/21/07
Posts: 7899
Loc: Olema,California,Planet Earth
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You can rear them together. In fact, there was a program (clandestine) that reared summers and coho in the same raceways. Worked very well.
The problem, I believe, when they started to rear steelhead at surface water stations (salmon) is thatchy water is colder, lots colder. Prior to merger, steelhead were spawned, incubated, and often reared on ground water which is warmer. They evolved, genetically, to function in warmer water. Put them into the much colder surface water and the enzyme systems don't work so they don't perform well. Taken long enough, they can evolve back to the colder water.
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#1066669 - 10/30/25 04:49 PM
Re: WDFW DUMPS ON STEELHEAD
[Re: Rivrguy]
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Repeat Spawner
Registered: 12/06/07
Posts: 1479
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RG. I'm going rouge. How about you? Interesting about the cooler water rearing issue? Could that be a smolt survival issue on top of all the other obstacles to get steelhead to return?
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#1066670 - 10/30/25 06:46 PM
Re: WDFW DUMPS ON STEELHEAD
[Re: Rivrguy]
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My Area code makes me cooler than you
Registered: 01/27/15
Posts: 4585
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What else would you expect from a democrat run state. They have ruined Seattle and Olympia as well.
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#1066677 - 10/31/25 08:50 AM
Re: WDFW DUMPS ON STEELHEAD
[Re: Rivrguy]
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River Nutrients
Registered: 11/21/07
Posts: 7899
Loc: Olema,California,Planet Earth
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While I won't belittle the ocean mortality issue I think a bigger one is that steelhead have very poor R/S for survival to first time spawners, I have never seen a compete data set (count escapement, age for all adults) where the R/S even averaged 1.0. Repeat s[pawners are required.
That means that any steelhead killed on their first return fisheries are also not returning in subsequent years.
Data from both BC and WA showed that as the smolt age lowers you get a better R/S. The =1.0 is about at a mean smolt age of 1.5. To get age 1 smolts, as BC showed, you need the nutrients in the streams. They did it with fertilizers and then pinks. You also got more smolts when the smolts are younger. Finally, the experiments showed that they got sustainable returns in the fertilized stream even in years of poor ocean survival in neighboring streams.
This data has been around for 30 years or more; but since the easiest solution to nutrient delivery is spawning salmon it is DOA.
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#1066679 - 10/31/25 04:09 PM
Re: WDFW DUMPS ON STEELHEAD
[Re: Rivrguy]
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Repeat Spawner
Registered: 12/06/07
Posts: 1479
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The pink runs state wide the past 10 yrs have been over the top! You would think stream nutrient delivery would be at it's peak. Repeat spawners should be available more than ever inside Puget Sound, with all the closures. Predators must be the smoking gun! Get rid of cormorants and pinnipeds and watch what happens. But! That will never happen for the poor old steelhead. Nobody cares enough to do anything other than close hatcheries, because steelhead cost to much all the way around. Proud to have them be our state fish.
Edited by RUNnGUN (10/31/25 04:12 PM)
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#1066680 - 10/31/25 06:50 PM
Re: WDFW DUMPS ON STEELHEAD
[Re: Rivrguy]
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Fallen Off The Deep End
Registered: 08/16/21
Posts: 608
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You know another problem is the creeks are full of [Bleeeeep!] these days and the fish cannot get above the obstacles.. For instance the creek I live on,, we have not had Coho or Cutthroat for about 5 years,,, the valley below me is now full of beaver ponds and willows and the fish can no longer make it up... So most of the habitat is not being used... Farmers and private land owners yousto clean out the creek and the fish could make it all the way to the headwaters,, not anymore,, its totally blocked and the cutthroat cant even make it...
_________________________
"The Koolaid has poison in it"
"The Bait is fake Nothing Is Tru"
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#1066682 - 10/31/25 09:03 PM
Re: WDFW DUMPS ON STEELHEAD
[Re: Rivrguy]
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Returning Adult
Registered: 02/15/21
Posts: 470
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Sounds like my place and the little creek running through !
“ fish can no longer make it up... So most of the habitat is not being used... Farmers and private land owners yousto clean out the creek and the fish could make it all the way to the headwaters,, not anymore,, its totally bblocked and the cutthroat cant even make it “
Same stupid story, same stupid results. And that’s after we restored and preserved our creek’s run thru the property, While the state and county let the rest of the creek above and below, including state and county property go to reed grass, siltation, blackberry, drug camps, and the end of the creek.”
Now , Wild Coho, Chum, Cutthroat, and the Rainbow are nearly all gone, and it only took 20 years, the last twenty...
Edited by 28 Gage (10/31/25 10:18 PM)
_________________________
Making Puget Sound Great Again - 2027 - Year of the Pinks! South Sound’s Super Humpy Promotional Director.
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#1066683 - 10/31/25 09:42 PM
Re: WDFW DUMPS ON STEELHEAD
[Re: Rivrguy]
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River Nutrients
Registered: 11/21/07
Posts: 7899
Loc: Olema,California,Planet Earth
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The numbers of pinks we get, only ever other year, are really nowhere near what is needed. Researchers have seen pretty good results with 0.6 Kg of spawners per square metre of stream. The benefit climbed steeply to about 1.9 and then the benefits slow, but don't stop.
Although I know it's bigger, let's say the Skagit is 100km long and averages 30m wide. I know this is a significant underestimate but that gives 3 million square metres. At 2kg per pink that would be 1.5 million spawners to half hit the need. Now calculate this for the other salmon species. We're nowhere close.
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#1066684 - 11/01/25 07:24 AM
Re: WDFW DUMPS ON STEELHEAD
[Re: Rivrguy]
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Fallen Off The Deep End
Registered: 08/16/21
Posts: 608
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Carcassman,,
Natural abundance,, carrying capacity means,, especially for pinks,, sockey and chum that there are so many fish they are digging up each others reds to spawn,, that they are pushing each other out onto the bank while moving upstream...
Imagine how many steelhead stayed resident when the rivers were producing natural abundance,, so much food,, we must have had 30 inch resident rainbows/steelhead in all our rivers... Also we must have had tidewater steelhead/rainbows that never went far from the mouth of the river..
_________________________
"The Koolaid has poison in it"
"The Bait is fake Nothing Is Tru"
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#1066685 - 11/01/25 07:29 AM
Re: WDFW DUMPS ON STEELHEAD
[Re: Rivrguy]
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Fallen Off The Deep End
Registered: 08/16/21
Posts: 608
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Our rivers in Washington have the potential to support salmon/steelhead/trout runs 12 months of the year,, much better river conditions than Alaska...
Imagine what it was like prior to 1870? I bet there were so many fish that the whole of puget sound stunk like rotten salmon for 9 months of the year... Every creek and river plugged with several species and mass trout populations to feed off the aftermath...
I bet it was several times over what Kamchatka or the west side of Kodiak can produce...
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"The Koolaid has poison in it"
"The Bait is fake Nothing Is Tru"
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#1066686 - 11/01/25 07:36 AM
Re: WDFW DUMPS ON STEELHEAD
[Re: Rivrguy]
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Fallen Off The Deep End
Registered: 08/16/21
Posts: 608
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Puget Sound was a Salmon/Steelhead/trout factory prior to 1870... Indians had killed off all the brown bears 10 thousand years earlier... Imagine how big those bears were,, way bigger than Kodiak bears or plains bears,,, mass food year round and no hibernation....
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"The Koolaid has poison in it"
"The Bait is fake Nothing Is Tru"
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#1066694 - 11/01/25 05:25 PM
Re: WDFW DUMPS ON STEELHEAD
[Re: Rivrguy]
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River Nutrients
Registered: 11/21/07
Posts: 7899
Loc: Olema,California,Planet Earth
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I doubt the Indians had killed off the grizzlies 10K YBP because the glaciers were still retreating from the Sound. But, yeah, I am pretty sure the number of fish was astounding.
Some bottom sampling was done on Karluk Lake, on Kodiak I. in AK. They were able to reconstruct sockeye escapements from about 0CE. The lowest runs were in the fist millennium (about 400,000 escapement) and around the 15-1600s I think the hit 4 million. Now, managers tell us the lake capacity is 1-2 million spawners.
For those who like steelhead fishing look at Kamchatka and then look at the salmon runs there, Even with occasional poaching problems the Russians are intentionally targeting some pretty sweet ecological levels of escapement for all species.
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#1066695 - 11/01/25 05:49 PM
Re: WDFW DUMPS ON STEELHEAD
[Re: Rivrguy]
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Fallen Off The Deep End
Registered: 08/16/21
Posts: 608
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I fished the Karluk in Sept 2000,, Flew in on a Helicopter and stayed a week in a tent camp... There were so many fish you were sick of catching them by the 3rd day... We were there to catch Steelhead probably only caught 15 or so the whole trip... But it was non stop catching Char and Sockeye.. Very aggressive Sockeye in there,, they actually look like a cross between Sockeye and Chum... The Silvers were just starting to come in,, big Silvers that are orange like a pumpkin and covered in sea lice... I actually did not land any Silvers but I had some on,,, they just would bust you off,, over 20 pounds is common... Using a 7 weight with a floating line/split shot bouncing egg patterns with a tinny nymph dropper so essentially drift fishing... Its a shallow river bout the size of the Dungeness,, too shallow and slow for drift fishing,, probably could fish spinners and spoons a little...
It was unreal,, never saw anything like it regarding the volume of fish...
_________________________
"The Koolaid has poison in it"
"The Bait is fake Nothing Is Tru"
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#1066696 - 11/01/25 05:56 PM
Re: WDFW DUMPS ON STEELHEAD
[Re: Rivrguy]
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Fallen Off The Deep End
Registered: 08/16/21
Posts: 608
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I don't know about the Puget Sound but the Quileutes told me that they killed off all the brown bears when they first colonized because they were in direct competition,, that was on the Coast/OlyPen... I was guessing about 10,000 years ago,, but could have been longer or shorter...
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"The Koolaid has poison in it"
"The Bait is fake Nothing Is Tru"
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#1066699 - 11/01/25 07:09 PM
Re: WDFW DUMPS ON STEELHEAD
[Re: Rivrguy]
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River Nutrients
Registered: 11/21/07
Posts: 7899
Loc: Olema,California,Planet Earth
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I believe I read somewhere that there weren't any "historical" (read white) records for grizzlies on the OP. So, the could have wiped them out. Seems odd that no other tribes seemed to extirpate them but given that the area opened up so recently they might have had only a few to remove.
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#1066703 - 11/03/25 07:16 AM
Re: WDFW DUMPS ON STEELHEAD
[Re: Rivrguy]
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Repeat Spawner
Registered: 12/06/07
Posts: 1479
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I just read the State Dept. of Ecology is supplying a $25 million grant to convert municipal diesel engines to electric. Why can't it be shared to keep rec fishing and hatcheries open for now? I have written my reps with my disgust. More of you that care to fish for Steelhead should do the same. Priorities are fd up.
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#1066704 - 11/03/25 07:56 AM
Re: WDFW DUMPS ON STEELHEAD
[Re: Rivrguy]
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River Nutrients
Registered: 11/21/07
Posts: 7899
Loc: Olema,California,Planet Earth
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Your legislators already increased license costs and at the same time reduced the GFS to WDFW by the same amount. That's their priorities. Also, I suspect that the grant monies DOE gives, or any agency, are directly tied to specific legislation and goals.
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#1066705 - 11/03/25 09:02 AM
Re: WDFW DUMPS ON STEELHEAD
[Re: Rivrguy]
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Returning Adult
Registered: 12/01/18
Posts: 438
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Off subject a but but did anyone attend the zoom meeting for coastal steelhead on Oct. 30? I missed it and wanted to know what, if any information was provided on the chances of having a winter steelhead season in Grays Harbor this winter. I see that a second meeting is scheduled in November. Thanks.
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