Propagada

Once again, the rule in the current reg book is WSR statewide, year around with WDFW being able to make exceptions to the rule. The Commission decided that the 2 year moritorium was needed to protect steelhead stocks. So if WDFW choose then to have a CNR season (remember that the Wild Steelhead Coalition didn't request CNR) how would Bruce and others feel about that decision.

Leland,

I am going to have to disagree with you. The Forks powers that be obviously don't want the CNR folks coming out to their town if they are going to fight it that hard. I guess they don't want our money either so they won't get it. We will see how much they keep fighting this. I was going to go out and fish in April out there but, they don't want us because of this I think I will cancell my trip.

JJ

That makes two of us JJ. I won't be going either, but for the opposite reasons as you.

This new policy kinda looks like it could be a lose lose situation for the people of Forks.

Only got one record huh

skip skip skip

Bruce, Micro, and anyone else who has concerns about the moratorium:

I don't get it. I am in no way, shape, or form going to get in to an argument about what this 2 year moratorium will do to your fish. I'm not going to get in to the debate about the nets, because I have my opinion, but I'm not going to single handedly reverse a decision made by Judge Boldt. All I can do is speak from experience in regards to a steelhead fanatic (Big old dumb ugly me!), who has been through this same scenario. We love the fish you sent us. Growing up as a kid on Lake Superior in the 70's, the steelhead was the elusive fish of choice. Most of the locals that hit the rivers were die hards and hit em awful hard. There weren't many that were ever let go. I was part of that crowd. Unfortunately it took me a few years to get good at it, until I could bonk my fare share too. When I became proficient, I clubbed the hell out of them too. Low and behold a few years went by, and the word started migrating shout to Minneapolis/St Paul about the North Shore steelies and all of a sudden our rivers started getting pounded by a substantially larger population of anglers. Most of these rivers don't run a half mile till the first un-passable fish barrier (waterfalls). Technology improved (graphite rods, reels, gear, etc), people started sharing some of the "sacred mysteries" of hooking steelies, and we suddenly started to see our fish dissapear. The sterile conditions, steep gradients, and low production rates of these rivers in conjunction with the brutal conditions in Lake Superior were to much to allow for the fish to keep pace with the numbers of fishermen. A very difficult decision had to be made. As a member of the Lake Superior Steelhead association, we asked for a mandate that all wild fish be released. We saw it as the only way to save the fish. We also told the DNR that we were in favor of shutting down the fishery, if our impact was too harmful to the fish. A study was conducted, whcih showed a C & R fishery could co-exist with a relatively low number of fish in our rivers. It took our fish almost 10 years to come back to levels they were in the late 70's. The crowds didn't diminish, but the opportunity to hook fish increased drastically. It is now almost 14 years since this went in to effect, and our fish continue to be back in numbers like they were years ago. We STILL have catch and release fishing on wild steelheads and it's just fine. If a guy wants one to eat, he ends up killing one of the slug kamloops that they planted for that very purpose. I'm pleased as hell that the DNR took the hard road to preserve a fishery that is pretty special to alot of people. I can still take my kid down to the river and fish in the same spot I did 28 years ago and catch those same goofy little Lake Superior steelies. I do not see fishing presure diminishing in my life time, so it looks like C & R is here to stay. Fine with me!

I am a steelhead freak, and save my money to travel everywhere I can to catch steelies. I'm not a SIms fashion model for Sims, Sage, or anyone else. Just a grown up version of a kid who never got past the feeling of going toe to toe with steelheads. Ironically, I don't intentionally kill any fish. Have I killed fish through catch and realease? I can guarantee that I absolutely have. A hell of a lot more of them are swimming, because they din't get kissed by the Hawk stick. It's enough for me to get a pic and let em go. I actually prefer fish like halibut, crappies, walleyes, and yellow perch over steelhead or salmon for the table. If I was fishing for food, I'd be screwed. It's a hell of a lot cheaper to buy a side of beef than it is to fly to Alaska and fish in a catch and release river, but I go there anyway. I plan on saving some more coin and heading to a few other locations that are specifically set up as C & R, because I am familiar with the quality of the fish that can be caught. Our crowds in Minn, Wash, Oregon, Alaska, Ohio, Indiana, Wisconsin, Ontario, New York, Pennsylvania, BC, Kamchatka aren't going to decrease any time soon. If I have to let my fish go in order to support my addiction, then okey dokey. If I have to quit fishing for a while to let them come back, so be it. It all starts with us. Take care and peace. I'm done preaching for now. Peace

Hawk,

Nice post. Love the commone sense, that is what the majority of fisherman out here have been saying for awhile. We face a few different situations, challenges and circumstances out here but the basics are the same.

And never stop fishing with your son. As a son my favorite days on the river are with my dad and I am 30 now and Still love doing it.

Bruce, how about an answer to my question.

Hawk,

I know you said you didn't want to get in the debate about netting but it's impossible to leave out. I'm posting this message under the assumption that the rivers you fished near Lake Superior did not have the heavy netting that goes on here. I guarantee that your rivers would not have recovered like they did with nearly non stop netting. Imagine a river that has 81 nets near its mouth for several days a week. That is a regular situation here in Washington.

Maybe the Forks politicos should arrange a junket to Smithers, Hazelton, Terrace or any of the other small towns in the Skeena watershed that make millions off of sport anglers from around the world who travel there to catch and release wild steelhead.

And by the way, these systems also see sometimes heavy pressure from native (first nations) and commercial netting.

Jerry, if I'm understanding you correctly. Your asking how I would feel about WDFW having a CnR season on one or more of the healthy rivers on the OP. Right?

Yes Bruce

AuntyM,

Nice, Very nice. Great post.

JJ

That is not the argument I am making. I don't want to kill wild fish. My argument is that by doing this, the state will now make no other efforfts in wild steelhead recovery. They will treat this as the magic bullet. As wild steelhead runs continue to decline even after WSR is in effect, the state's next step will be closures. Meanwhile netting will continue.

The sportsmen need to tell the state to address the real problem(s). Some of you act like the wild steelhead situation is an isolated issue. It's not. Does anyone remember when you could actually catch true cod in Puget Sound? Because sportsmen as a whole (yeah, some small groups fought), chose to sit by, accept restrictions on bottom fishing while the draggers turned the floor of Puget Sound into a desert. Decreasing our fishing opportunities will do nothing to improve fish conditions taken alone. Imagine if every sportsmen who bought a fishing liscense said that we would accept no more restrictions or limitations until real problems were acknowledged and addressed. If sportsmen would donate money (yeah right) and time and work with our dollars and votes, we could really change things for the better. During this year's governor's race, I hope every single person here votes for Dino Rossi. I doubt very much that if Ron Simms or Phil Talmudge gets elected, much will change. Hell, Simms hates sportsmen and is owned by the tribes.

That is really a perfect example of over simplification Marsha. There is a lot on the line and a lot of folks are going to have their lives impacted by this ruling in one way or the another. It is much more complicated that you try to make it out to be. If you don't like these discussions then don't waste your time reading them. I've personally found them both enlightening and somewhat enjoyable and I appreciate that Bob has allowed a lot of freedom on his board for the topics and opinions. Theres a lot of people reading these discussions and a lot of good information and ideas have been tossed around how could that possibly be a bad thing, regardless of what side of the issue your on.

Jerry that is a good question and one that I have already asked myself.

If the management decisions were made on a river by river basis, I'd probably be ok with it, but there are a lot of variables. I'm not against CnR seasons when needed. I don't like CnR seasons on runs that barely meet escapement goals. My issue is with the blanket ban.

Thanks for you input Marsha.

Talk about Mis-information!

BTW ~ Jerry asked me a question and I'm trying to give him an answer, if you don't like that too bad.

Blah Blah Blah...

It's obvious that your trying to start some crap.

Next..

Come on boys and girls....go in the corner for a time out

Jacob: In answer to your question, No. We di not have the heaavy netting pressure. We did have heavy bonking pressure from a population of anglers who were not previously impacting the resource. It all has to start SOMEWHERE.

If the local hard core steelheaders North of Duluth would have said" We aren't going to catch and release, because the Cityots are going to kill them" we would be standing on the banks of empty rivers. Lake Superior is a pretty unfriendly "biatch" when it comes to being fish friendly. The rivers dump down to pee trickles shortly after the fish spawn and the smolts become fodder for cormorants and mergansers. If they make it past them, they have a jillion hungry lake trout waiting for them in the lake.

By moving forward with your moratorium, I truly believe it puts you in the position to start focusing the attention on the senseless netting of your fish. How about trying the "Fish Ins" that seemed to get peoples attention for your salmon last year. Win, lose, or draw, you're doing the right thing for the fish. We do have sections of rivers that are closed to steelheading during spawning. Dead fish don't reproduce.

I hope that some day you can get your fish back to the levels where the guys who want to keep a fish to mount or eat have that alternative. In the meantime, I think WSR is a good option for people who want to share the sport of steelheading and have as little impact as possible.

We have learned a lot from you guys. I hope you can learn something from us before it is too damn late!

Give it up.... It's the same conversations there with many of the same folks. Your just trying to get something started and the only thing you've managed to accomplish is trashing this thread.

Aunty..why are you jumping on me now? geez

It's to bad it has to come down to this.. If the sportspeople could find some common ground we could probley get something done . To think if all of Bob's member's. And all of Bruce's and Marty's got together, Got something going as far as what's right and wrong for the native americans, the rest of us, The enviroment, etc etc. march into Olympia and lay it all on the table. They would HAVE to listen.. Just a thought..

Would anyone like to try this again without the mudslinging please?