Ya know Alan, I think if they put up a vote to bring back slavery you'd spin it that a vote against would be an attack on the traditional right to own slaves.
You really are obsessed with gay issues though.

"But I know that doesn't probably count for much"

Doesn't count for squat Alan. It's their lives their "CHOICE". That whole freedom thing is amazing isn't it?

Harley said:
"Is that the value you put on your "traditional" marriage;....."

No the value I put on my traditional marriage is 36 years of married life and 40 years of dating the most wonderful, intelligent, beautiful woman in the world. I put the value of three children, with great spouses and five grandchildren on my "traditional" marriage. I could go on..........

Creed of the right "states rights".....oh wait you can't legalize pot, oh wait you can't allow marriage, oh wait you don't have a right to die.

I thought you were argueing for the piece of paper designating approval from the govt, and bringing certain legal/tax benefits..........not just the right to live together forever and do whatever they want to do in the sack.

The gay marriage issue is about the piece of paper...right ?

I really don't have a problem with gays. My son rents to a gay person, I've had a lot of social interaction with them and we've always come away friends.


Gay issues are just a microcosm of the left's intolerance for anything but their agenda.

Actually, now that you've brought up slavery, you've really hit a nerve with me. Frankly, I regard abortion as the civil rights issue of our time. If you look at the historical arguments to preserve slavery, they are almost word for word the same arguments used to preserve abortion rights. I would invite you to do some research on the language used to protect slavery and compare it to the language used to protect abortion.

"civil rights issue of our time"
Really? Civil rights itself wasn't a bigger issue? Or weren't you alive then?

"The gay marriage issue is about the piece of paper...right ?"

Don't know. Ask someone who is gay. I wouldn't ask the religious right though.

The only legal benefits I can think of are in lines with inheritance/retirement and medical decisions...again what do I care?

And there are no tax benefits. In fact until a few years ago you were penalized tax wise for marriage.

There now. If you truly had no problem with gay people, you would not mention that they are gay, just that they are people.

As far as abortion goes, it is a religious issue. If your faith does not allow it, so be it. Please refer to the legal notice attached:

Amendment 1 - Freedom of Religion, Press, Expression. Ratified 12/15/1791.

Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.

Ron Paul is anti-abortion, yet as a constitutionalist, he stated he would not interfere with states' rights to allow abortion. I appreciate his ability to set aside his personal beliefs to honor the constitution.

I heard some great history on the radio this morning positing that prohibition was repealed for financial reasons. The government was making $500 million per year on alcohol taxation in 1920 when prohibition started. When it was repealed in 1933 during the great depression, income tax revenues had fallen 46%. If the economy goes the way some are predicting, NORML might get their dream come true!

If that piece of paper guarantees them the same legal rights and privileges of hetero married couples, then yeah, I guess you could reduce it to that.

Why should two women, or two men get the right to marry?
Those same two men or women, can legally adopt children, so they should be afforded all rights and privileges given to a man and a women that get married, to say otherwise would punish the children.

Would it be okay for a man, or a woman, to marry a dog, or a horse ?

Mike,

Whats the proper terminology then.. People who have penises and like them too, Fairy, Cocksucker, WTF? How do you describe someone who has an alternative lifestyle without labeling?

Is there a dog or horse giving its consent for you to marry it, Oregonian, or are you just waving that red herring around to show it off?

Just wondering if there was a line or not...

I'm sure there IS a line...............just not sure where.

To my knowledge dogs and horses can't adopt children in Oregon, not sure about Wash.

In California the Gays right issue is just about a piece of paper, as they already have domestic partnership laws that give all the other rights. I really find it funny that most people who are argueing about the sanctity of Marriage really have no problem with no fault divorce, but that is another story. The truth is, the California conservatives do have a right to feel this is about making homosexuality acceptable, as there is no other reason for the issue to come be fought. Millions of dollars wasted on people trying to make a stupid point. The state should just stop issueing marriage licenses, switch strictly to domestic partnerships, leave marriage to the churches, and the issue goes away. But I guess that is too easy.

+1