The nation is a representative republic, but the drafters of the state constitution decided to allow direct citizen participartion through initiatives when they thought representation wasn't getting the job done. Initiatives have done more good than harm over WA's legislative history. Eyeman's a short negative blip over the long haul. I do think the initiative process is better if paid signature gatherers are prohibited.

Rivrguy,

The initiative process is part of the WA Constitution, predating any WA state legislature, corrupt or otherwise. So it couldn't have come into being as a result of a corrupt state legislature.

Sg

Riverguy loves to beat the 'all politicians are corrupt' drum rather incessantly.

What I believe that he fails to realize is that it isn't so much the individual politicians themselves... as it is the system that they operate within.

Hi Honey

Figured you run out of songs and dances pretty quick.

4Salt: It was legislators who made the laws that define the system to which you refer. Do you suggest the fact that the resulting system is corrupt stems from them making misguided decisions? I think not.

OK. Maybe they aren't all corrupt, but judging from some of the crap that gets passed in those hallowed halls (I'm talking the inexplicable stuff that benefits only the very few whilst screwing over the vast majority), at least a 2/3 majority of them would seem to be.

I haven't had anyone flame this thought process yet, so I thought I'd give you guys another chance. The reason I think at least most politicians must be corrupt is that they all leave profitable jobs and businesses (show me a middle class worker who can afford to run a campaign) to run for elected positions that (on the books) pay considerably less. The way I understand it, this is not normal Capitalistic behavior, so unless they're Communists (even I didn't accuse them of that) or very stupid, there must be something more to the job than the general sense of satisfaction that comes from holding a position of influence. Some say it's the power, but we all know that money and power are one and the same, so I think that only strengthens my argument.

I don't take pleasure from making such claims, so I am sincerely hoping somebody who knows better (and can make a convincing argument to that end) will grab me by the ascot and knock some sense into me. I don't hate America. I want to believe in my government. Show me the light....

pot, meet kettle.

What if you could get an initiative on the ballot just for making a donation to the state government? Would that be something people would find acceptable?

Say like $1M cash, you're on the ballot.

Well that's what we've got, only it's cheaper than that. You need about 250K signatures to get on the ballot. Paid signature gatherers get between $1 and $3 per signature (so I read) so let's make it $4, just to account for inflation and needing some extras to cover fraud.

That's a cool $1M and you've got your initiative on the ballot. The Liquor guys are disorganized enough they got TWO initiatives in the same year.

America. The best representative republic that money can buy.

Correct I think. What I should have said was the process came into it's own with the Grange and the battle it fought with corruption in the legislature and the relationship to railroads and tax kick backs. Things we take for granted came from the Grange activist and reforms driven by citizen activist.

Help?


Just caught up. KK you came back to life? Need to practice a bit though as your verbiage is a bit lame and lacks the defined character you are so well know for!

"normal Capitalistic behavior" = corrupt as well.

Yes, tax the rich. Don't like it? Don't be rich.

IR,

Good point. Paid signature gatherers has made the initiative process part of the "best government money can buy." Must be why I like the initiative process of old, when volunteers who believed in the initiative gathered the signatures.

KK,

Nice to see you back in form, even if I get no special "dispensation" for being liberal and a fly chucker. Dispensation; you sure that's the right word?

Sg

Welcome back Pillow Biter

Taking time off from polishing knobs on the campaign trail or just throwing in the towel with the full knowledge your efforts are utterly worthless?

Spending your days as a demoncrat aparatchik must be physically taxing for a goat lover as long in the tooth as you.

Take some time off, relax. Hell, maybe you and Castro can trade notes

NOW THAT IS TRUE KK !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

(Yawn)

Don't see any "defined character" there.

Flacid and unoriginal. Must be growing complacent in his old age.

fixed it for ya

We need an initiative to do away with paid petition signature gathers.

I think that's something we can all agree on, except the Neocon nitwits that would like to privatize even the electoral process.