there were some fish caught and transferred above though



and yeah, i doubt they were getting fish for brood stocking... guts on the ground suggest otherwise.

Checked it out on Sunday coming back from the Duc, looks pretty frickin awesome. I too am definitely looking forward to one day being able to wet a line for the amazing Wild Fish of the Elwah.

Cheers, Todd

[img]http://www.peninsuladailynews.com/apps/p...580&title=1[/img]

hard to imagine a fish traveling up that, Doc.

looks like the Chehalis after the last hard rain

Beach front property

From the personal observations I have made once the river gets silted up its takes a good 2 months of little to no rain to get it to start clearing. The heavy rains we had in Sept silted it right back up. Hope we get some record rains this winter and spring to help blow all that junk down and out.

Agreed. What we need is huge rain on snow event. Get a couple feet of snow at sea level and then clean of the slopes up to about 3,000' in one afternoon.

This will take years for us to realize the level of success. I only wish they'd truly leave the river/fish be and not fish it at all (anyone), not introduce any outside influences (Chambers, hatchery, etc.) and let nature take it's course. She's pretty crafty if you let her be.

The fisheries that will do the most damage to the recovery of Chinook and coho are the marine mixed stock hook and line fisheries in BC, AK, and the coast.

If recovery of the wild fish was truly the goal then those would be the eliminated fisheries.

As usual, Carcassman is correct. The folks that will get hurt by a closure of the fishery will be the Elwha Tribe, and the local recreational anglers. Those folks who harvest in SE AK, along the BC coast, and in places like Sieku and the Strait will continue to take fish that will return to the Elwha.

In fact, it's been my view that these offshore fisheries will be the reason that really big Chinook salmon will never return to the Elwha, regardless of the lack of dams. It's very likely the fishing pressure in the near shore areas (SE AK, BC, and WA) is high enough such that Chinook salmon will never live long enough to get to 80+lbs. Nobody C&R's a 50lb Chinook in the ocean hoping it will grow to 80lbs. Those 50lbers get bonked.

Indeed, that is what has really changed in the years since the Elwha dams were constructed. When those dams went in (100+ years ago), there was no high seas fishery. All fishing was done close to shore. Once those juvenile salmon cleared the near shore areas, they had all the forage and all the time they needed to grow to whatever size they wanted. Now, they have neither unlimited time nor forage. Millions of pounds of forage (herring, smelt, anchovy) is scooped up by purse sieners. And commercial and recreational anglers ply the waters of their feeding grounds 24/7, all summer long. The longer those fish stay on the feeding grounds, the more likely it is they will get bonked.

But don't get me wrong. I'm really glad to see the Elwha dams removed. Indeed it is a reason for hopeful optimisum and a sense of renewal. However, I don't believe we will ever see really large Chinook again. Not in the Elwha and not in the Columbia. And the reasons have nothing to do with dams.

Tonight at 7:30 on channel 9, Quest show will have a little footage or program on this. That's the direct TV PBS channel (KCTS).

Amen

I agree with Carcassman and coho angler.

The most recent data that I have seen (2002 to 2006) showed that the overall exploitation rate on Elwha Chinook was approximately 35% of which more than 85% were caught in Alaskan and BC waters.

Curt

The link that Doc posted, looks very similar to the Toutle River, after Mt. St. Helens blew in May of 1980.

The Toutle river ran gray colored for many years afterward, not sure its even the color it was before the eruption.

Time tells all!!!!!

And long before the Toutle cleared up the wild steelhead returned...don't be too worried about the dirty water, the fish will be able to make do long before it looks like good fishing water ;-)

Fish on...

Todd

returning and successfully reproducing are two different matters

That's what the wild steelhead did, along with salmon and trout, too.

Fish on...

Todd

Shouldn't the tributaries and all the water above where the former upper dam provide plenty of good spawning habitat?

Yes. All the tribs should be fine, the mainstem above Mills should be pretty good.

All they will need is spawners in good numbers.