A less dark topic, and as far as I know, neither liberal nor conservative, but currently vexing for me. My lot was mostly logged when I bought it so the seller could extract more money for it, and part of it needed to be cleared so a buyer could build on it. Fast forward a couple years, and a few braken ferns were growing down the hill in back of the house, and I was OK with that. They're green, until they turn brown in the fall, that is. But it's like they're an invasive fern and last year and this year are popping up all over. Twice this spring I've gone out and pulled up every one I could find, and the other day I noticed that there must be between 100 and 200 again already.

Is pulling them up not gonna' control them? Is chemical warfare necessary to control these buggers? I've pretty much decided they are about as welcome as scotch broom in the yard or on the property. What do ya' know about this stuff?

Sg

Crossbow (2-4-D) and Roundup mixed together will torch anything...

the problem with ferns is the spores, and the roots, you have to really kill the roots before you go waving them around (after pulling them) as the spores will spread all over the place creating new sets...

if you cant find Crossbow, Lily Miller Weed Be Gone has 2-4-D in it as well, mix it with concentrate Roundup (per directions), and spray the plants not dripping, but cover them, and they should be close to dead in 2 days, you can yank em out a couple days after that...

good luck, they can be a pain in the ass...

That's tough one to get rid of by mechanical means.
Straight, old fashioned vinegar will knock down weeds.
Works best on dry, hot days.

Don't know how it will work on bracken, but might be worth a test before bringing in the chemical warfare.

Long term, Agent orange might be more effective and botanically correct.

On a more serious note, bracken fern is associated with cancers and poisonings. Google "bracken ferns and cancer" for some detailed info. I'd get rid of the bracken fern and plant a more beneficial herb on the back-forty.

Plus it's exactly as smart and safe to use as Roundup or 2-4-D...both of which are about the worst things you could ever put on anything anywhere near where anyone lives, eats, or drinks.

Fish on...

Todd

Pull them. 15 minutes a day and you can keep up.

Reminds me I need to spray some chemicals for my weeds. 2,4 D seems to be working on the horsetail and should work on most broadleaf weeds like dandelions. Roundup should get the grass, then need to deal with the blackberries, and buttercup. Only a few ferns. Best to spray before the wind kicks up. Really wish I didn't need to use chemicals but I have alot that needs to be used. My hands get sore from pulling. Need to get this done this morning and pack for camping/fishing as I have the next 17 days off.

Are you joking? Glyphosate seems pretty harmless from my rather exhaustive research.





Salmo, go glyphosate, use a surfactant to thicken it up and make it penetrate, add some hi liter so you know which furns got the spray and they will be dead really quick and won't reseed the next generation. A couple of application and that firm colony should be in check.

We have some Bracken and pull the ones that grow in the "wrong" places. I guess if there aren't a lot it is more like weeding; regular but not overwhelming. Our big issue is horsetail. One part of the yard is just infested and we have been pulling it for 20 years. Not at bad as it was, but won't it ever go away?

Thanks for all the suggestions, useful and otherwise.

Sounds like pulling them ends up spreading more spores from the roots, and that's consistent with the location of all the regrowth. Chemical warfare it is, then.

If you read somewhere that Glyophosphate is safe then you were either reading Montsanto's sales pamphlets, or some FDA paperwork written by the Monsanto execs who now work there.

http://articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/archive/2013/07/30/glyphosate-toxicity.aspx

http://www.scientificamerican.com/article/weed-whacking-herbicide-p/

http://www.greenmedinfo.com/toxic-ingredient/glyphosate

http://www.beyondpesticides.org/gateway/?pesticideid=37

No one should ever...ever...put this crap anywhere near where they live, eat, or breathe.

Fish on...

Todd

Todd, nobody ever said that the stuff wasn't toxic. When I apply it I wear gloves, mask, eye protection. I wash hands thoroughly afterwards and take a shower.

In the end I think it is just like anything toxic, don't gets exposed to too much of it chronically.

We are surrounded by toxins just as bad as glyphosate, but since this one does such a good job at destroying plants it gets the "I'm scared" treatment from people who are wanting to be afraid of chemical and technology related to them. There is a growing group of folks who get hysterical about all this stuff which I can relate to but like anything else it is about ranking the weight of presence of these dangers in our lives.

So, In the end, I'm still a lot more afraid of Canadian truckers on I5 than I am glyphosate.

Knock yourself out. If calling someone "scared" or "hysterical" because they don't want to have that poison around their home, food, or lungs makes you feel better about...go.

Fish on...

Todd

Also, I am talking glyphosate, not Roundup. I don't know anyone that thinks Roundup is safe. It is a complex mix of tons of other crap so it can pretty much kill anything.

At work we use glyphosate mixed with a surfactant that is essentially like vegetable oil. It doesn't kill everything but it does a good job on the stuff we want to hit.

Again, just pull them.

+1

Fish on...

Todd

[Bleeeeep!] pulling. Weed whack, rake, burn if you want to avoid chemical warfare. Plus, than you get a nice exposure to the combustion exhaust of gasoline which is far more toxic than glyphosate, but is something we swim in every day nearly everywhere.

I did the reading of your links Todd. Apparently every human disease is linked to glyphosate. Strange though because I think people have been getting sick and dying since way before the chemical was invented.

I for one am not a proponent of glyphosate for many purposes in which it is used. However, I am just as skeptical of Monsanto as I am of people who think they can blame their health problems on external sources. They tend to choose external sources they cannot possibly understand, such as chemicals and how they effect the human body, because they are laymen.

Most doctors I have met, if you ask them what causes disease, will say "bad luck".

Also, if you want to know what will likely kill you, don't look to Monsanto, look to you family and their health history. Genes and health history tell you what to fear, not the internet and associated information overload.

I wonder if Sg imagined his question about controlling ferns would open such a can of worms.... Ah, the Dark Side.

My inexhaustive research (limited to the articles Todd referenced and the comments that follow) suggests that the delivery method Beezy described should be considerably safer (if somewhat less effective) than Roundup. Apparently, what makes Roundup more effective than other glyphosate treatments (and also more dangerous) is the surfactant they use to achieve deep penetration of the toxins into the plant's cells.

Apparently, most surfactants are detergents. We all know that detergents are very useful for controlling contaminants. What I had never learned before, but made a lot of sense to me, was that what makes detergents so effective at controlling germs is their ability to break down cell membranes and more directly deliver the substance that kills (often suffocates) the organism. By using a vegetable oil instead of a detergent, Beezy's crew should be getting the viscosity needed to keep the poison where it needs to be for an extended period, while avoiding a lot of the risk associated with using glyphosate. It seems likely, assuming their surfactant might not be as effective at penetrating the plant cells, that such a treatment might be somewhat less effective, but it should be a lot safer, which would be a good thing.

I personally avoid using herbicides/pesticides as much as possible. My lawn's probably 50% weeds, but if we mow once a week, it looks pretty good. When I have unwanted plants, I use elbow grease and time to control them. In some cases, I give up and use the excuse that I'm maintaining a "green" yard, which ironically ends up needing less maintenance....

Good luck with the fornicatin' ferns, Sg.

DDT, PCBs, and Agent Orange were all find and dandy, too...until they weren't.

It doesn't take much of an understanding of the chemical industry or the FDA to know that taking their word for it that the chemicals they make zillions off of or their handpicked rubber stampers in the Gubmint (who likely worked at Montsanto a few weeks earlier) approve as "healthy" is a bad gamble, at best.

Pull your damn weeds...it's not like the Bataan Death March or anything.

Fish on...

Todd

Rarely use split shots...but I put them on with pliers when I do

FF, my lawn is like yours...about half weeds, but it looks pretty good when I cut it

My lawn loses about 10 or 20 square feet every time I work in the yard...by this time next summer it will be down to one small 6x10 patch in the front, and the rest will be fully converted into garden boxes.

If I am going to waste time ( ) working in my yard I will waste it growing organic food, not wasting water or putting herbicides and pesticides on a patch of useless grass...lawn is a waste of time, space, and resources

Fish on...

Todd