that's a whole other can of worms, few people but almost all access to everything is private and posted, so unless you're in the good old boy club or own land, your opportunities are few these days.

WDFW sat on their hands.....years ago, could have/should have approached land owners on ALL the local rivers for 99 years leases for public access. It was easier to do nothing.........so we are where we are and its not getting any better. WDFW hides behind no $$$$$$$$ only their problem is only to get worse.....license purchasers can only be snookered so many times by the "paper fish" seasons. Salmon totals down, less fishing days, GH and Willapa Management Plans under fire, the list goes on.

Seahawks......mmmmm, about like my fishing during October, November, and December, shut down !!!!!!

WDG had a guy, from the Harbor, who funded his position to establish the Citizens Wildlife Heritage Program. He went around getting easements and access. That was in the late 70s and on into the 80s. The Steelhead Trout Club of Washington had a program before that to get access to rivers and if memory serves they not only got access but built stiles and such to safely get through fences.

Been done by people with vision and who actually hunted and fished in areas that needed access. Now?

Superfly's right to point out that Grays Harbor does have a track record of discouraging industry at the port, with the local good ol' boys leading the charge. Those guys are finally starting to die off, and their kids are selling their assets off and heading for what they think are greener pastures.... That said, oil trains are NOT the kind of business we need to support. Jobs are only a net benefit to an area when they go to local people and don't put the other, ESTABLISHED economies that depend on healthy, functional ecosystems at risk.

What is needed is a clear-eyed look at what the Harbor can do. What kind of runs, for example, are needed to make it an honest destination for fishing? Will those fisheries primarily benefit locals or will folks come from outside? If from outside, how much money will they spend?

Take razor clams. When there is an opening how much money do no locals bring in and drop? Or is it drive down, harvest, and drive home. If the latter, then the opening doesn't really benefit the community from an income basis.

Money has to come from outside the harbor to grow the economy. Otherwise, we're all just supporting each other. Not a bad thing, not a way to keep folks home.

As somebody who lives in Seattle, Portland, or even further afield, why would I come to the Harbor, stay, and drop some serious money? If that question can't be answered, then a big tourism economy is probably not in the cards. What next? What does the Harbor offer?

Right now, it probably offers bulk shipping on moderate-sized boats since it is closer to the open ocean than Seattle/Tacoma/Vancouver/Bellingham. If that is not acceptable, specifically what is?

I'm sure all kinds of information is available, just shaking the right tree to get it:

Clams----I don't dig, any more but maybe publish the zip codes of where people live. I do know when the tides are good.....lot's of car, motor home, camper traffic....many stop at the Monty Square, East Aberdeen, Safeway...that I see. How much do they spend ?????

Salmon fishing...coast, should be able to get this ????? BUT THAT SAID, not like the middle 70's when 1000's of people came from all over the world to fish Westport. I remember 275+ charter boats, so many fish that boats couldn't clear the bar, done....back in for 2nd group.

Steelhead...What it was, what it is.....lot's of people, lot's of boats....money being spent locally, yea for some motel rooms, gas, bait, food, guide fees, turn around $$$$, tackle but major purchases....not many boats, boating accessories, motors.

Guess my question is whether the currently available resources will bring in enough money to support the economy. This is kind of a different way of looking at it.

What sort of salmon season, not only days open but catch per angler, total catch, etc. are needed to attract (say) 10,000 anglers to the charters?

If folks are interested in the Harbor economy then we need to put some numbers on it.

And, the results won't be just up to the Harbor folks. How much has QIN and the Chehalis supported economic development of the NI community? How much have the folks from Seattle supported economic development in the Harbor? Those folks need to be on board.

Grays Harbor Management Plan if followed should be VERY helpful, can't have problems like this year, plan wasn't followed. Remember this was only the 2nd year BUT IT NEEDS TO BE FOLLOWED. WDFW Commission did a great job of writing GHMP.

Willapa Plan......1st year, gota let it run until people from outside the area develop a trust for this plan.

Stay the course.....takes time to change OLD WAYS, but change it must...for the resource and for the economy.

Even if the Plan is followed what does that do for the Harbor Economy? The genesis of my comments was the discussion about no coal, no oil, etc. Just what will meeting all aspects pf the plan do for the economy? Fishing will probably be better for the locals, a necessary thing. But what new money does it bring in?

As we keep adding people we either increase the demand on resources or ignore them to support the people.

Our view horizon is too close, to my mind. We have to expand our vision.

Oil by rail to GH has been dealt another painful blow... this time by the state.

Prove you've got the financial re$ource$ to clean up your mess, and then maybe we can talk.

http://www.bellinghamherald.com/news/local/article60156446.html

Oil train de-railment in CR Gorge near Mosier OR....

http://www.oregonlive.com/pacific-northw...ncart_big-photo

These things are just mile-long ticking time bombs. Not a matter of IF but rather WHEN.

No thanks!

The oil ran into and crippled the sewage treatment plant there. Imagine the impact on shellfish in the harbor and along the beaches.

"Those who fail to learn from history are doomed to repeat it."

going to be tough to fill my truck and boat when no oil cant get here....

Most all of that is shipped overseas. Much like the Alaska Pipeline promise.

Just to further underscore the risk to our area, a few days after the Mosier de-railment, we had another spontaneous de-railment of slow-moving grain cars in Central Park by the Chehalis River. That's the second time in less than 2 years. Another de-railment was caused by some kids playing "chicken" with the train back in December.

http://thedailyworld.com/news/local/rail-cars-derail-central-park

What if these had been oil-cars? This is no small matter. Recall that oil trains would be 100 cars long and MUCH heavier than grain cars... and consequently MUCH more likely to be destabilized by our rickety old tracks.

I believe that in order to haul heavier trains the Federal rules would require track upgrades.

Like the ones in Mosier?

Beefed up tracks? Such reassurances are a joke. Kind of like the industry reassurances of the newer "safer" oil train cars that don't explode and burn?

Just like the ones that leaked, exploded and burned in Mosier?

Nothing in life is 100% safe.

The question we have to answer is how we will provide energy to the world. Today, tomorrow, and in the future.

Folks with long term memories will recall what happened to the US the last time shut off every shipments to Asia.

We have to make the switch, soon, to energy sources other than petroleum but we have to explicitly plan how to get from here to there without crashing the global economy.

And, the options such as pipelines and tanker trucks also crash, burn, and leak.

The railroads COULD replace railbeds with concrete like most advanced (and safer!) rail systems in other industrialized countries. But that would eat into railroad's profits. Fu*k this attitude! Stop THIS method of moving this explosive crap NOW! Excuses like this eat [Bleeeeep!]. Bob R