#959446 - 06/21/16 02:36 PM
Re: Puget Sound Salmon & Steelhead Endorsement Idea?
[Re: Backtrollin]
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River Nutrients
Registered: 11/21/07
Posts: 7431
Loc: Olema,California,Planet Earth
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Hatchery fish don't need that culvert removed or replaced. Other than protecting the water supply integrity, quality, and quality you don't need much as the stream is just a pathway.
Hatcheries are real good at converting a minimal amount of water and land to fish.
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#959451 - 06/21/16 03:59 PM
Re: Puget Sound Salmon & Steelhead Endorsement Idea?
[Re: Carcassman]
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River Nutrients
Registered: 10/22/09
Posts: 3020
Loc: University Place and Whidbey I...
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That was exactly my point and why General Fund money should be fixing those infrastructure impediments to recovery of ESA listed stocks.
_________________________
Remember to immediately record your catch or you may become the catch!
It's the person who has done nothing who is sure nothing can be done. (Ewing)
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#959453 - 06/21/16 05:10 PM
Re: Puget Sound Salmon & Steelhead Endorsement Idea?
[Re: Backtrollin]
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River Nutrients
Registered: 11/21/07
Posts: 7431
Loc: Olema,California,Planet Earth
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But my point is that, like what you're saying, if the public won't step up for habitat and ESA species then the sporty's sure shouldn't have to foot the bill. And, given all that WA needs to spend money on there is nothing for ESA or habitat.
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#959457 - 06/21/16 07:58 PM
Re: Puget Sound Salmon & Steelhead Endorsement Idea?
[Re: Backtrollin]
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River Nutrients
Registered: 10/22/09
Posts: 3020
Loc: University Place and Whidbey I...
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I think we are in agreement as to the futility of the current situation.
I just looked at the proposed increases (as posted on another site and not yet verified) and noted that it includes jumping the adult, resident shellfish license from $17.40 to $26.20 and the P.S. crab endorsement from $8.75 to $18.50. So if all one wants to do is crab the cost jumps from $26.15 to $44.70; a 71% increase.
Maybe doubling the P.S. endorsement anticipates a loss of 50% participation.
_________________________
Remember to immediately record your catch or you may become the catch!
It's the person who has done nothing who is sure nothing can be done. (Ewing)
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#959458 - 06/21/16 08:48 PM
Re: Puget Sound Salmon & Steelhead Endorsement Idea?
[Re: Backtrollin]
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River Nutrients
Registered: 11/21/07
Posts: 7431
Loc: Olema,California,Planet Earth
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I bought an annual WY license to fish for about a week and a half. I think it was $70 some. Every day the fishing (stream) was better than I can find here and if WA makes the costs similar why would I ever consider fishing here?
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#959461 - 06/21/16 09:27 PM
Re: Puget Sound Salmon & Steelhead Endorsement Idea?
[Re: Backtrollin]
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River Nutrients
Registered: 10/22/09
Posts: 3020
Loc: University Place and Whidbey I...
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Last time I was in WY the antelope were everywhere but crabbing was a challenge. (yes, I know that will result in some unsavory comments; consider it a freebie)
_________________________
Remember to immediately record your catch or you may become the catch!
It's the person who has done nothing who is sure nothing can be done. (Ewing)
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#959462 - 06/21/16 09:32 PM
Re: Puget Sound Salmon & Steelhead Endorsement Idea?
[Re: Backtrollin]
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River Nutrients
Registered: 11/21/07
Posts: 7431
Loc: Olema,California,Planet Earth
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I think you coulda found some crabs if you'd have looked hard enough.
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#959464 - 06/21/16 10:18 PM
Re: Puget Sound Salmon & Steelhead Endorsement Idea?
[Re: Backtrollin]
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River Nutrients
Registered: 10/22/09
Posts: 3020
Loc: University Place and Whidbey I...
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Antelope I could explain......WY crabs not so much.
On a parallel path have I mentioned my wife is a retired trained killer?
_________________________
Remember to immediately record your catch or you may become the catch!
It's the person who has done nothing who is sure nothing can be done. (Ewing)
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#959477 - 06/22/16 09:34 AM
Re: Puget Sound Salmon & Steelhead Endorsement Idea?
[Re: Backtrollin]
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Three Time Spawner
Registered: 06/03/06
Posts: 1533
Loc: Tacoma
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Opportunity has fallen so much, it is becoming hard to justify the expense. I skipped hunting last year, as all my local areas are now pay to hunt, including the DNR land that now wants me to by the discover pass. Went from any weapon, any area for elk to choose your weapon and area. Several of the areas I used to hunt went from a open tag to a trophy tag, with no better opportunity. This year my local opportunity for salmon has just about disappeared. To add injury to insult, there are a couple of great clamming beaches near a rental I own. In the last past couple of years they have gone from being open all year to 1 month for one, and 2 months on the other. They stopped planting most of the local rivers, so if I want a realistic chance for steel head I have a minimum of an hour trip, more if I want to get into good fishing. The park I used to stop by at lunch and make a toss or two in, now wants a 3 dollar parking fee. It just never stops. I have probably went from being out doors around 80 to 100 days a year to around to 15, with only 3 or 4 of those being dedicated trips. I could go on, but it is actually quite depressing.
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#959480 - 06/22/16 10:05 AM
Re: Puget Sound Salmon & Steelhead Endorsement Idea?
[Re: Carcassman]
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River Nutrients
Registered: 10/22/09
Posts: 3020
Loc: University Place and Whidbey I...
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And yet, she lets you live. Nice lady. Very tolerant; plus after 40 years its not worth getting rid of me. And, Krijack, I wholeheartedly agree. It is extremely depressing. At the cost of hauling my boat to the ocean fishery for one fish I decided to pull the trigger and buy into a tuna trip instead.
_________________________
Remember to immediately record your catch or you may become the catch!
It's the person who has done nothing who is sure nothing can be done. (Ewing)
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#959483 - 06/22/16 11:22 AM
Re: Puget Sound Salmon & Steelhead Endorsement Idea?
[Re: Backtrollin]
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River Nutrients
Registered: 11/21/07
Posts: 7431
Loc: Olema,California,Planet Earth
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What the current/recent changes have made me do is carefully plan trips. No more hope in car on the spur of the moment stuff. And, I'll buy into guided trips/charters so as to maximize the chance to actually encounter something.
As an aside, our daughter is developing a model in her dissertation that trys to predict motivation for two different commercial tuna fleets fishing four different species. Is it maximize catch? Minimize expense? Consistent catch? It would behoove our "managers" to delve into the motivation of hunters and anglers. What actually gets them out there in terms of expectations, opportunity, time in the field. I am afraid that WDFW believes that "If we open it, they will come"
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#959487 - 06/22/16 11:51 AM
Re: Puget Sound Salmon & Steelhead Endorsement Idea?
[Re: Carcassman]
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River Nutrients
Registered: 01/17/04
Posts: 3742
Loc: Sheltona Beach
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I believe WDFW Commissioner Wecker was right on, questioning the increase. Rural folks do not see the benefit from their conservation efforts.
_________________________
When we are forgotten, we cease to exist . Share your outdoor skills.
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#959489 - 06/22/16 11:57 AM
Re: Puget Sound Salmon & Steelhead Endorsement Idea?
[Re: Backtrollin]
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River Nutrients
Registered: 11/21/07
Posts: 7431
Loc: Olema,California,Planet Earth
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I have seen more than one instance where rural folks are asked/forced to bear the brunt of conservation/habitat protection/etc. so that the fish can be harvested in B10 and the ocean. WDFW not only knows this, they support and encourage it.
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#959490 - 06/22/16 12:06 PM
Re: Puget Sound Salmon & Steelhead Endorsement Idea?
[Re: Carcassman]
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River Nutrients
Registered: 10/22/09
Posts: 3020
Loc: University Place and Whidbey I...
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What the current/recent changes have made me do is carefully plan trips. No more hope in car on the spur of the moment stuff. And, I'll buy into guided trips/charters so as to maximize the chance to actually encounter something.
As an aside, our daughter is developing a model in her dissertation that trys to predict motivation for two different commercial tuna fleets fishing four different species. Is it maximize catch? Minimize expense? Consistent catch? It would behoove our "managers" to delve into the motivation of hunters and anglers. What actually gets them out there in terms of expectations, opportunity, time in the field. I am afraid that WDFW believes that "If we open it, they will come" Along that line of thought I recently asked a WDFW employee tied to P.S. crabbing why it is that there is an annual 30% attrition rate; that is, roughly 30% each year are new crabbers yet no long term increase in sale of endorsements meaning roughly 30% leave the activity each year. In so many words he told me they haven't looked into that issue. I suggested that maybe they need to know why they are losing those customers - that is in the neighborhood of $600K just in the endorsement. Poof, gone, and they don't know why???
_________________________
Remember to immediately record your catch or you may become the catch!
It's the person who has done nothing who is sure nothing can be done. (Ewing)
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#959505 - 06/22/16 01:42 PM
Re: Puget Sound Salmon & Steelhead Endorsement Idea?
[Re: Backtrollin]
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River Nutrients
Registered: 11/21/07
Posts: 7431
Loc: Olema,California,Planet Earth
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There was study that I have somewhere, passed to me by a WDFW fish bio, that for fishing licenses in general there is a significant non-buy between years. This was nationwide. You'd think this would be high on their list of things to know; why does somebody buy, why do they stop, and do they come back.
I think the regular buyers tend to be an older demographic, which means they aren't bringing in and retaining the younger folks. Should be a high priority in an agency based on licenses for revenues but I guess tee times are more important.
What should also be disturbing is not only do they not know why folks drop out but they don't care.
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#959530 - 06/22/16 05:43 PM
Re: Puget Sound Salmon & Steelhead Endorsement Idea?
[Re: Backtrollin]
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Juvenile at Sea
Registered: 01/30/13
Posts: 233
Loc: Skagit
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I was at the commissioners meeting in April and pointed out to them that everyone in the room was gray-haired. If you live in the Skagit basin, and just got your drivers license, odds are you've never seen a Skagit wild steelhead. They might as well be unicorns as far as young folks are concerned. Hell, when was the last time anyone on this forum saw one? Who is going to care about them when we are gone? Do we want to leave them in the hands of folks that have never seen one?
_________________________
Catch & Release Is Not A Crime
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#959541 - 06/22/16 06:56 PM
Re: Puget Sound Salmon & Steelhead Endorsement Idea?
[Re: _WW_]
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Repeat Spawner
Registered: 03/05/00
Posts: 1092
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I was at the commissioners meeting in April and pointed out to them that everyone in the room was gray-haired. If you live in the Skagit basin, and just got your drivers license, odds are you've never seen a Skagit wild steelhead. They might as well be unicorns as far as young folks are concerned. Hell, when was the last time anyone on this forum saw one? Who is going to care about them when we are gone? Do we want to leave them in the hands of folks that have never seen one?
"We" who have seen them really took good care of them. Such good care we don't see them anymore.
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#959543 - 06/22/16 07:21 PM
Re: Puget Sound Salmon & Steelhead Endorsement Idea?
[Re: Krijack]
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Juvenile at Sea
Registered: 09/05/14
Posts: 196
Loc: Stanwood WA
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Opportunity has fallen so much, it is becoming hard to justify the expense. I skipped hunting last year, as all my local areas are now pay to hunt, including the DNR land that now wants me to by the discover pass. Went from any weapon, any area for elk to choose your weapon and area. Several of the areas I used to hunt went from a open tag to a trophy tag, with no better opportunity. This year my local opportunity for salmon has just about disappeared. To add injury to insult, there are a couple of great clamming beaches near a rental I own. In the last past couple of years they have gone from being open all year to 1 month for one, and 2 months on the other. They stopped planting most of the local rivers, so if I want a realistic chance for steel head I have a minimum of an hour trip, more if I want to get into good fishing. The park I used to stop by at lunch and make a toss or two in, now wants a 3 dollar parking fee. It just never stops. I have probably went from being out doors around 80 to 100 days a year to around to 15, with only 3 or 4 of those being dedicated trips. I could go on, but it is actually quite depressing. Totally agree with this as that diminishing opportunity and days spent outside are dwindling for sure! Getting tired of Jerry Springer re-runs myself Lots of great points here regarding out of state fishing too. I also agree with statement about the Skagit voiced here too what happened there???? My first steelhead was a Skagit fish as I well to enjoyed those Sauk C&R days too. I'll not live long enough to see it again unfortunately but both of those North Sound rivers are in my "backyard" along with my home river the Stilly! No use crying over spilt milk as I'm burning daylight... Just returned from Alaska after a great 7 days (Chinook, Coho, Yelloweye, Halibut, Rockfish and Sable fish off the 800 foot line) and plan on returning for Coho in late August too. Planning another trip to my old stomping grounds on the Yellowstone with the captain who lives in Livingston MT. that I've fished Alaska with now for three years for large Brown Trout in late October. If Washington state is showing you no LOVE at the moment there are other places out there> Trust me!
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#959895 - 06/29/16 02:39 PM
Re: Puget Sound Salmon & Steelhead Endorsement Idea?
[Re: Backtrollin]
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River Nutrients
Registered: 11/21/07
Posts: 7431
Loc: Olema,California,Planet Earth
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My current interest is primarily C&R. Why not have a modestly-priced C&R license? No CRC needed, you just better not have a fish in possession.
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