Hey guys and I'm sure gals too, need a hand here! I'm a Rockport local and fish the Sauk and Skagit all the time, Where clubbing Nates, unfortunately, is still allowed. As anyone who has ever fished up here knows most of the old-timers here are "Tar-heels". My neigbor, a 62 year old Tar-heel born and raised here in Rockport can't seem to get through his thick skull the importance of catch and release of natives. We go rounds all the time, especially when I released a big nate yesterday. (37 inches long with a 20 inch girth) What I need is some ammo, somthing I can print out and show him, studies,facts, anything to show the importance of catch and release of nates. We've already gone the round on the logging issue, still going on, but I'm winning so far. Yes, he's a logger too and so was his dad. HELP!!

I live near Darrington and know this attitude well. Just remember you are arguing with a rock.Debating over logging practices with a logger? Don't start that debate up in the local tavern!
I was reading some posts at nwfishing.com about SB 5104. You can see this mentality at its finest.These people will not be swayed.
Sorry I don't have any info to help with your arguement but you might want to visit nw.fishing.com's BB and read some of the posts. There are some good points being made in between all the rant and raving.

'Sup, Johnny. I'll give you a shout tonight at home and give you some numbers.

You are up agianst a tough one here. I live in Everson born and raised. I have been fighting this same battle for 15 years. If they are under 20 you have a 80% chance of influencing a paradym shift and they will probably practice C&R the rest of their lives, between 20 and 30 a 70% chance they will practice C&R if you work with them, 30 to 40 yrs old probably a 50-50 chance if your around when they beach it, 40-50 about 30% only if they think they will get caught or saw the Gamie today, 50 years and older born and raised in Whatcom or Skagit Counties, you might as well put a $1000 down on the New Orleans Saints to win the Super Bowl next year. If they haven't started C&R of wild fish by now they are in total denial and your statistics will have to be accompanied by a 2x4. The 2x4 won't keep them from killing wild fish but if you use it on their legs it may keep them from getting to the river. Thanks for maintaining some sanity on the Sauk

Hey, hey, hey, I'm 60, (damned neer 61), and I release the nates. I happen to not believe in catch and release seasons only, so I don't fish then. Please do not clump all us senior guys under the same roof, okay ??

Huh, so there is a chance that the Saints will win it all then?

Steelheader #1 I was wondering what your personal reservations are against C&R-only seasons. Also, does this apply to both salmon and steelhead, or one or the other?

Huh, so there is a chance that the Saints will win it all then?

Steelheader #1 I was wondering what your personal reservations are against C&R-only seasons. Also, does this apply to both salmon and steelhead, or one or the other?

What I need here is some written ammo here guys,...documented proof, studies, ect. I have taken his grand kids out many times and have them convinced. I can and will convince him! I want somthing to print out in writing!
I've pretty much won the logging practices battle, even though he does have some pretty
good points on some things. The Native battle can be won!!! Even if not during C&R seasons, I think nates should be released, always.

Hohwaiian. In answer to your question of me. It is my belief that the seasons are closed for the keeping of steelhead because the fish need protection. Therefore I don't support catch and release because in my mind that is against the intention of protection.
On the salmon, this is a tough one because of the overlap in runs. But generally speaking the same applies.
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Please, lets not turn this into a big issue like has happened on nwfishing.com. I have no further comments on my belief and believe me, I know I'm very much in the minority on this one.

Cool. Thanks for replying Steelheader #1. I think your reason to refrain from fishing during these times is excellent. In all honesty, it was one I expected coming from a senior member of this state's steelhed fraternity. I was just curious that's all.

Peace Out...

Sorry Stealheader #1 my response was tongue n cheek, my father is 72 yrs old and he is a C&R kind of guy. I was just trying to say the older most of us get the harder it is to get us to change our ways. And some of us are tougher than others. No malice intended

A personal observation on a tiny creek can be found at the back of Bill Herzog's Spoon Fishing for Steelhead. You can also go the reports from the Canadian Government ... they have done extensive studies (and showing the positive benefits of) catch and release fisheries. You can also find reports from the Alaska Department of Fish and Game on C&R as a valuable management tool on the Kenai. You can also look at spawning escapements here in WA over the last decade to see the increased spawning in many of our streams with the increased (and in some cases mandatory) C&R steelhead fisheries ... although we likely won't see a report from the state on that one until the fish are all gone ... standard operating procedure for the knuckleheads in Olympia.

If anecdotal information will help at all, about 6 years ago we did alot of fishing for winter stealhead on the Stamp and Somass rivers on Vancouver Island. The guides were particpating in a program of tagging fish with spaghetti tags for fisheries. We landed some wild fish that had as many as 5 tags in them (through the dorsal). So we could assume those fish were caught and released a minimum of 6 times because the non-guides didn't have tags. I guess you could say this bordered on fish abuse for those natives that couldn't leave a bait alone but it emphasizes what kind of fishery can exist if you keep the fish in the river. It made me think about how we even manage hatchery fish, and whether we should have a one fish limit for hatcheries especially on rivers with alot of pressure to spread the fish among more anglers. Would we rather catch 3 fish a day and keep 2 or catch 5 or 6 a day and keep 1. I am favor of the latter. Also on the Nooksack where we have had catch and release only for natives for at least 12 years we have a great native run in Feb. March and it has been steadily improving over the years. I can only imagine how much better it would be if we didn't have guys taking 40 to 100 wild fish illegally in the lower river each year.

being a biology major I find it hard to confront a big majority of people about fish conservation. You can give all the statistics you want, but its just like religion, they'll turn off their ears. You can't talk to someone that wont listen. Wait for them to start talking about how "it used to be", "how many there used to be", stuff like this. They have loaded your gun and cocked the hammer. They have admitted that their is a difference now ( less fish ). therefore admitting that you are right.
About the logging thing. Ever hear the comment " there's no difference in old growth and re growth. Show a logger a picture of two trees. One old growth, the other a spindly sapling. Then ask again if there is a difference between old growth and re growth.

Thanks David, Steelhead Addict and Bob! Bob, do you know the number to call to get the Canadian reports. I'd be really interested in reading them. Obviously this is a subject that fuels many heated debates, including the logging issue. Even the hand-full of us that believe in C&R, I believe, can at least make a difference with the younger future generations of fisherman. My grandfather was a guide here on the Skagit back in the late 50's and early 60's and was guilty of killing many fish back when they were plenty. Before he passed away 3 years ago he deeply regreted killing all the fish he did and wished he could turn back the clocks of time, not just for me, but for all of us to expierience how good it really was. Maybee one day,... for our kids.