Just catching up, I'll have to say that was the most civil, reasonable and thoughtful debate I think I've ever seen here, in my short tenure anyways. Hats off to two true gentlemen, pint o guiness on me simetime.

"I believe that the Islamic Fundamentalists hate us just 'cause we are not worshipping Allah in their prescribed manner"

Fundamentalist is the key word here, I think. It seems to me at times that we have the same fundamentalism here, it's what steers me against this particular admin. I see too many parallels between the tactics of the elite/fundamentalist Muslims and the elite/fundamentalist Chritians of our nation. We went into this war under the direction of a man who beleives that God personally speaks to him, and "works through him".
I may not have such issues with how this admin operates if they weren't doing what all politicians do while claiming that God is on their side, and noone elses. Extremism is the squeaky wheel, and we all have to suffer for it's whining. Moderation is the quiet child that goes without over and over again.

Terrorism will be here as long as anybody wants what somebady else already has. Isreal has Jerusalem, Iraqis have the oil and Afghanistan has Osama.

"Either the United States tosses aside any form of would be world leadership and crawls into the dungeon of isolationism or we get out in front and lead"

I can agree with that, I'm not sure I agree with how you interpret it. I think our leadership should lead by example, and up until a pre-emptive strike, we have done just that. I'm young but I can already say that I remember a time when the world held us in the highest regard. I can't say that since my last overseas venture. I know we weren't perfect, Nike's have been made in Malaysia by nimble 9 year old fingers for a long time, but as a progressive society, why aren't we looking to better ourselves first, before taking on Iraq, or even just staying focused on the matter at hand, Osama?

So, I guess somehow that gets me to unity. Brings to mind divide and conquer from Alexander's era. It worries me, (yes, Iknow that sounds paranoid) that anyone can recognize that a nation divided is closer to failure than success, and partisan divide seems to be at one of it's highest points. However, with Geo's latest polls as an indicator, it seems he has at least united most of us in disapproval of his work so far. Can I get a moderate here? Give me exactly half way between George Bush and Ted Kennedy.