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#1007073 - 04/14/19 12:03 PM Proposed Puget Sound Chinook Seasons
Luke R Offline
Alevin

Registered: 03/27/18
Posts: 10


Looks like a very cut back MA7 season. Will also be curious on MA9 and 10 quotas, especially with the later MA9 start.

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#1007087 - 04/14/19 08:10 PM Re: Proposed Puget Sound Chinook Seasons [Re: Luke R]
RUNnGUN Offline
Repeat Spawner

Registered: 12/06/07
Posts: 1382
I'll bite. Where did this come from ?
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#1007091 - 04/14/19 09:55 PM Re: Proposed Puget Sound Chinook Seasons [Re: Luke R]
fishbadger Offline
Repeat Spawner

Registered: 03/06/01
Posts: 1194
Loc: Gig Harbor, WA
11 closed in June kind of stings, but will certainly save a bunch of quota.

fb
_________________________
"Laugh if you want to, it really is kinda funny, cuz the world is a car and you're the crash test dummy"
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#1007094 - 04/14/19 11:34 PM Re: Proposed Puget Sound Chinook Seasons [Re: fishbadger]
Larry B Offline
River Nutrients

Registered: 10/22/09
Posts: 3020
Loc: University Place and Whidbey I...
Originally Posted By: fishbadger
11 closed in June kind of stings, but will certainly save a bunch of quota.

fb


And further keep recreational fishers away from any possibility of a White River springer.
_________________________
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#1007095 - 04/15/19 05:03 AM Re: Proposed Puget Sound Chinook Seasons [Re: Luke R]
Lifter99 Offline
Returning Adult

Registered: 12/01/18
Posts: 386
Fishbadger, But the chinook quota for Area 11 will be about half of last year so the season will be very short. Lucky to get all of July and August in Area 11.

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#1007098 - 04/15/19 07:53 AM Re: Proposed Puget Sound Chinook Seasons [Re: Larry B]
darth baiter Offline
Juvenile at Sea

Registered: 04/04/10
Posts: 199
Loc: United States
[quote
And further keep recreational fishers away from any possibility of a White River springer.[/quote]

Umm...White River springers haven't been adipose clipped since the late 1990's. They get coded wire tagged but not clipped so they won't be taken in mark selective fisheries and hence increase escapement for stock recovery.

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#1007099 - 04/15/19 08:04 AM Re: Proposed Puget Sound Chinook Seasons [Re: Luke R]
fishbadger Offline
Repeat Spawner

Registered: 03/06/01
Posts: 1194
Loc: Gig Harbor, WA
Thanks for rubbing it in Larry!!

Those springers were clipped for one or two years, returning a couple years back, and then they went to a no-clip program which is one of those incredible concessions the DFW has made on our behalf. I base this on conversations I had with the hatchery staff who were doing the clipping for that short duration, as well as on-water experience (the former possibly more reliable than the latter).

I didn't see how this year's quota compared to last year's. If it is that low, we seriously need to stop raiding the elementary school in the winter.

fb


Edited by fishbadger (04/15/19 08:08 AM)
_________________________
"Laugh if you want to, it really is kinda funny, cuz the world is a car and you're the crash test dummy"
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#1007102 - 04/15/19 08:32 AM Re: Proposed Puget Sound Chinook Seasons [Re: Luke R]
stonefish Offline
King of the Beach

Registered: 12/11/02
Posts: 5201
Loc: Carkeek Park
So what are the proposed chinook quotas for 9,10 and 11, if anyone knows.

Also, anyone have a graph photo they can post of the proposed coho seasons?

Thanks,
SF
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Founding Member - 2023 Pink Plague Opposition Party
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#1007106 - 04/15/19 09:12 AM Re: Proposed Puget Sound Chinook Seasons [Re: darth baiter]
darth baiter Offline
Juvenile at Sea

Registered: 04/04/10
Posts: 199
Loc: United States
attached clumsy to read file has White R spring Chinook releases back to 1996 brood


Attachments
white r spring releases.pdf (49 downloads)


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#1007115 - 04/15/19 10:50 AM Re: Proposed Puget Sound Chinook Seasons [Re: Luke R]
Larry B Offline
River Nutrients

Registered: 10/22/09
Posts: 3020
Loc: University Place and Whidbey I...
Thanks Darth; that seems to reinforce my recollection about some White River stock releases having been clipped. I also recall that WDFW had been on the cusp of having a season but the tribes resisted at NOF and WDFW blinked. I also recall that part of the recovery goal had been to achieve a fishable return and when it became apparent that the tribes were going to continue to resist our having a season WDFW had to do an accounting shuffle to repay what I believe was the PSRFE fund - hard to justify using that fund to produce fish for which there will be no recreational fishery.

That leads to the question of what is the goal of WDFW's Clarks Creek (Puyallup) hatchery regarding Chinook? The WDFW spiel at the hatchery renovation ground breaking included statements that it's production would improve fisheries for all user groups in P.S. as well as the Coast. In reality it seems that Chinook will be White River stock so will they remain unclipped as part of the recovery program? And steelhead will be unclipped as also being part of a recovery effort. That leaves 300K coho; nice, but not close to fulfilling (in my opinion) the hype.

So, now that we have gone full circle I will ask why the June closure? Many ways to have a summer Chinook fishery and stay within quota - I just hope it isn't to protect an occasional stray Hood Canal fish or an acknowledgement (capitulation) that we will likely never see a recreational fishery on Puyallup River springers.
_________________________
Remember to immediately record your catch or you may become the catch!

It's the person who has done nothing who is sure nothing can be done. (Ewing)

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#1007119 - 04/15/19 11:28 AM Re: Proposed Puget Sound Chinook Seasons [Re: Luke R]
Lifter99 Offline
Returning Adult

Registered: 12/01/18
Posts: 386
Stonefish, The quota for Area 11 is 2800 chinook. Half of last year. I don't know the quota for Areas 9 and 10.

Larry, I heard (from reliable sources)the reason for the June closure and the short seaon in Area 11 is, like you said, a few Hood Canal stray chinook are/were caught in Area 11. With the proposed seasons, I guess no one thinks those Hood Canal strays swim past the Narrows Bridge into Area 13. Interesting.

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#1007121 - 04/15/19 11:52 AM Re: Proposed Puget Sound Chinook Seasons [Re: Luke R]
Lifter99 Offline
Returning Adult

Registered: 12/01/18
Posts: 386
Larry, I need to correct myself. The Hood canal stray chinook thing was one of the reasons for the lesser season in Area 11. There are other reasons also.

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#1007123 - 04/15/19 11:58 AM Re: Proposed Puget Sound Chinook Seasons [Re: Luke R]
stonefish Offline
King of the Beach

Registered: 12/11/02
Posts: 5201
Loc: Carkeek Park
Lifter,

Thanks for the info.
SF
_________________________
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Founding Member - 2023 Pink Plague Opposition Party
#coholivesmatter

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#1007128 - 04/15/19 01:12 PM Re: Proposed Puget Sound Chinook Seasons [Re: Lifter99]
Larry B Offline
River Nutrients

Registered: 10/22/09
Posts: 3020
Loc: University Place and Whidbey I...
Originally Posted By: Lifter99
Larry, I need to correct myself. The Hood canal stray chinook thing was one of the reasons for the lesser season in Area 11. There are other reasons also.


To pursue the Hood Canal strays as a factor.....what is the likelihood that any such strays into south Puget Sound will actually find their way back to the Canal to successfully spawn? Versus becoming a part of the percentage of strays into any given river every year?

Edit: I should have posed the "what if" question: If those strays were to be considered irrelevant to spawning potential in their Canal river(s) and deleted from the modeling what would have been the result in terms of MA 11 (and any others impacted) season(s)?



Edited by Larry B (04/16/19 07:53 AM)
_________________________
Remember to immediately record your catch or you may become the catch!

It's the person who has done nothing who is sure nothing can be done. (Ewing)

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#1007131 - 04/15/19 01:48 PM Re: Proposed Puget Sound Chinook Seasons [Re: Luke R]
fishbadger Offline
Repeat Spawner

Registered: 03/06/01
Posts: 1194
Loc: Gig Harbor, WA
Thanks for providing the info Lifter99.

The Hood Canal stray issue is painful. But of course they wouldn't pass the narrows bridge. I mean, have you seen how tall that thing is?

Darth, any data for Minter?

fb
_________________________
"Laugh if you want to, it really is kinda funny, cuz the world is a car and you're the crash test dummy"
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#1007132 - 04/15/19 02:15 PM Re: Proposed Puget Sound Chinook Seasons [Re: Luke R]
stonefish Offline
King of the Beach

Registered: 12/11/02
Posts: 5201
Loc: Carkeek Park
I talked to a WDFW about the Mid Hood Canal strays at the Mill Creek meeting last month.
I was a bit surprised when I read the material they distributed and presented that those fish were present in MA 11.
I always figured they'd head north out into the straits or ocean if they strayed out of the canal.
My memory isn't quite what it used to be, but If I recall correctly, he said some mid canal chinook are caught as far south as the Oregon / California border.

He also mention something like 21 of 250 PIT tags from MA 11 being mid hood canal fish.

I have his business card if anyone would like to pick his brain a bit more on this and verify if I recall things correctly.
Drop me a PM and I'll get you his contact info.
SF
_________________________
Go Dawgs!
Founding Member - 2023 Pink Plague Opposition Party
#coholivesmatter

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#1007153 - 04/15/19 08:46 PM Re: Proposed Puget Sound Chinook Seasons [Re: Luke R]
eyeFISH Offline
Ornamental Rice Bowl

Registered: 11/24/03
Posts: 12766
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"If you don't kill them, they will spawn." (Carcassman)


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#1007160 - 04/15/19 09:17 PM Re: Proposed Puget Sound Chinook Seasons [Re: Luke R]
fishbadger Offline
Repeat Spawner

Registered: 03/06/01
Posts: 1194
Loc: Gig Harbor, WA
Wait a minute, area 11 isn't being restricted due to concerns for straying of Hood Canal HATCHERY fish are we? I mean, that would be ridiculous.

fb
_________________________
"Laugh if you want to, it really is kinda funny, cuz the world is a car and you're the crash test dummy"
All Hail, The Devil Makes Three

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#1007163 - 04/15/19 09:20 PM Re: Proposed Puget Sound Chinook Seasons [Re: Luke R]
NickD90 Offline
Shooting Instructor for hire

Registered: 10/26/10
Posts: 7260
Loc: Snohomish, WA
Thanks Doc. That doesn't mention Area 10 outside of Elliott. Area 9 opens 2 weeks later with a reduced quota. Sad.

Looks like I'll have some extra weekends for scouting the hills and yard work.
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#1007180 - 04/16/19 06:47 AM Re: Proposed Puget Sound Chinook Seasons [Re: Luke R]
Carcassman Online   content
River Nutrients

Registered: 11/21/07
Posts: 7411
Loc: Olema,California,Planet Earth
It's amazing what happens when you actually mark, and the recover, fish. There was a big tagging study done on chum, a while ago, when fish were tagged in area 10E. This is the East Kitsap inlets and it is considered the terminal area for chum that spawn in the local creeks. A bunch of the tagged fish (tagged as adults) were recovered at the Hoodsport Hatchery. They had come into 9, gone to 10, got tagged in 10E, went back to 10, then 9, down 12 and on to the hatchery.

As we put out more tags, especially the acoustic types that don't need a dead fish to check, we find that the fish are doing a whole lot of stuff that (according to the books the fish don't read but we do) that really messes up preconceived notions.

As to the White Rivers, you will remember that the Makah troll fishery took a lot of them in that "big" year.

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