You guys keep using the term "Meat Fisherman" as if it is a bad word. What's wrong with wanting to put meat in the freezer? I love to eat Steelhead and Salmon, so when I want to "harvest" fish, I go wear the fish are. Also, you guys seem to imply that those of us who enjoy harvesting fish are somehow inferior when it comes to our fishing skills. How is it that you come to that assumption? Do you actually think when you step into a "Combat fishery" that you are the only "real" fisherman there? I love hiking small streams, and I love the "Chase", and "Communing" with nature and all of that touchy feely crap, but when I'm ready to pull out the stops and catch a whole bunch of fish, I head to wear the fish are stacked up..... Usually that means that there will be a lot of other people there too. Yes, I love to catch fish, and I like to take them home and eat them. Does that make me a "Meat fisherman" maybe it does. If that's the case, then here's one "meat Fisherman" who only has four punches left on his Steelhead card, (Yes, they are all Summer runs) and will bet his bottom dollar that he could, would, and will outfish all you snobby *******s any day of the week.... Oh, by the way, I fished right next to Bill Herzog a few years back..... At Blue Creek! It was shoulder to shoulder fishing, with guys standing on the bank waiting for a spot to open up so they could fish. Mr. Herzog hooked one fish after another, and by all appearences was having the time of his life. He also, took two fish home with him. Does that make Bill Herzog a "Meat Fisherman"? Perhaps some of you guys out there who have everything about the "right" way of fishing could be so kind as to take Bill aside and teach him how to fish.

When I plan a fishing trip its always set up around being pretty much by ourselves. I agree with the "I would rather fish all day for a couple fish by myself than fish in a crowd for 10" approch. However, seems like when I go along with other people on their trips I wind up fishing in a crowd. The times I have done that It was still pretty fun but different. Flew into Rivers Inlet thinking it was going to be great remote location. Wound up playing bumper boats for 5 days but still had a good time. One things for sure, you sure do see some characters in that type of situation. Funnyer still is the stuff you hear people saying.. you know, when the water is still and you can hear people talking from 300 yards away

Combat fishing, kind of like a free fire zone, What I usally do is lay down some smoke and see if I can find some place below the deadline where the fish have not been harrassed yet. Yes I said deadline because thats usaully where you find the combat zone.
one example is the toutle where the green dumps in. I went up there last september and there was just a ton of guys in there. I thought wow, I have been driving along this river for miles and not seen hardly a soul, so I turned around and found about 2 miles of water with no one on it, walked down there and made about a dozen cast and walked out of there with my 4 silvers, so solitude can be found in areas of large fish concentrations, you just have to put on your walking shoes.
peace Superfly

Depends on the Mentallity of the participants. I have only found one comabat zone thus far that I simply cannot fish, the Feather River Afterbay in CA. The upside down spinning reels, blatant snagging and dragging fish backwards through the water while hooting and hollaring is just too much, the ignorant conversations that you must endure . It has got to be the worst white trash mecca on this coast. If you want comedy this is the ultimate experience, as sad as it may be!

As long as I have a fish on the end of my line, I can just about put up with anything.
That is why I go, but I don't always choose the combat zones.

ZoZo,

Calm youself, man. Your punchcard speaks for itself, but you gotta admit that anybody with a pulse can fill a punchcard at Blue Creek. If THAT'S what you're looking for. Any goober using a spin reel upside down, using a surf rod, or using 30lb test on a trout rod is NOT what I'd consider a "polished angler", yet they still catch fish at places like Blue Creek. If you were to take *most* guys out of the combat zone and put them on a river with a dozen fish in several miles, and they wouldn't have a chance. That doesn't say you couldn't, but I doubt the surf-pole dude could.

If it floats your boat, go with it. You can't argue with the numbers of fish available, and I'm sure everbody that gets in on your fish BBQ's isn't bothered that they came from a combat zone!

Point taken Dan s. For the record, only six of those fish came from Blue Creek. What irkes me is how people are so damn condescending, like they are somehow better than everyone else on the river. They talk about places like Blue Creek, or Hoodsport, or any crowdwed place like no self respecting fisherman would be caught dead fishing it..... And that just isn't so. My comment about Bill Herzog (one of the leading authorities on Steelhead and Salmon fishing) being down at Blue Creek says it all. If you don't like to fish in a crowd, then fine, but don't sit there at your computers, typing away like your some sort of supreme beings who are "above" "meat fishing", saying that anyone who does fish at a place like Blue Creek, or wants fish for the BBQ is a "Goober" or a "Doughball". That's all I'm saying.

I have one nice king and a so-so silver in the freezer because I went to Sekiu and played bumperboats. Plus, my wife would kill me if I spent all that money to drive 350 miles and let all of that fish flesh go.
FISH OOOOOOOONNNNNNNNNNNNNN! is what we are all looking forward to, so get it where you can. (If you are looking for somethin' else, I'm happy for yah, as long as you're catchin' fish, too.)

Andy

there are other places to catch fish other than meatholes, everyone has spots that they will never say a word about on a board like this, if you think you have got to go to a so called meathole to catch fish you are wrong.

Right you are, dogsalmon. Like I said, only six of my summer runs came from a "meat hole" this year. I refuse to post on this board where I got the rest of them, and the reason for that is that I don't want this place to turn into another "meat hole". I only fish the "meat holes" when I have to. Let there be no misunderstanding about it, I'd much rather have a stretch of river all to myself, but if I do decide to fish in a "Combat" zone it doesn't necessarily make me a less competent fisherman..... That's all.

Awww c'mon, ZoZo, tell us where you got the rest of em'....

I hear you about the meat-fishin' thing. Not everyone at Blue Creek is a gomer, and not everybody fishing some remote canyon stretch is an accomplished fisher. Just folks looking for something different. I've spent many a morning at Blue Creek, ZoZo, and I've more than likely seen you there, so you know where I'm coming from. Sometimes I want solitude, sometimes I don't mind the crowds. I enjoy EVERY fish I catch, whether it's at Blue Creek or Schaeffer creek. I do enjoy the scenery better at Schaeffer creek VS. the endless mono, stryofoam, and plastic at BC, though.

Hey.........it's all good

Amen Brother Dan.... In the end it's all about the fish!

Based on responses to my earlier post it would appear there are as many jerks fishing off by themselves as there are in the meatholes. What a bunch of self-righteous arseholes. Come to think of it....when I drift a river rarely do I encounter another boater who isn't all puckered-up over who's going to get the next hole or hiding their secret lure or downright rude. On the other hand I've met some pretty decent human beings standing shoulder-to-shoulder at Blue Creek who would share anything they had to give.

The way I see it if the person is at the place where I am currently fishing I will tell them exactly how I'm doing and what I'm using. I've even given people lures that were working particularly well when the occasion arises.

Jerks are everywhere. Nice people are everywhere too.

Amen, Heywood. You'll find all kinds most everywheres.

Strange how this turned into a snipe fight about who's better than whom.

I'm usually intimidated by combat fishing zones because I'm most likely to be the doughball in the middle tossing a wrench into the gears unless I'm there with somebody who has got the routine down.

Bruce

[ 07-10-2001: Message edited by: B. Gray ]

I can't tolerate crowds as much as I used to. Back then, catching a fish was more important than dealing with the masses. But, as the fish came easier and my skills became refined, I found myself less and less tolerant. It's like I'm punishing myself for all my hard work to become a decent fisherman. Occassionally, I still break down and hit meatholes when my mood is right but I find that after an hour of chaos I need to get the hell out of there.....quick!

There is alot to be said for solitude and fewer fish. Anymore, I only ask for the chance at a fish in the course of a day's hike or float and if it's just me and the fish I know I have a good chance at a hook up or two....much more satisfying.

I guess as I get older and experience more of the world my view of the human population becomes more and more dim and it's meat hole fishing that brings out the pond scum of humanity. Don't want or need any part of it.

It's really strange how the older I get the less I want to be around people. I used to love the State Fair, but anymore it drives me up a wall. Guess I'm well on my way to curmudgeonhood.

Meatholes (as they are called) remind me of the trout pond at the Expo Center during the Sportsman Show. It certainly isn't for everyone, but those that do partake have to go in with a specific mindset and a sense of humor to be able to handle it.

People who fish meatholes are no better nor worse than the isolationists. And there are doughballs in both camps.

Doesn't change the fact that I think you folks that enjoy fishing in crowds are nucking futs, however.

Heywood, Been told I'm nucking futs before on other topics so why not carry it over to fishing.

Like anyone else, I prefer having the water to myself. Each year, however, for the past 8 years my boys and I have gone to the Hoodsport zoo to fight some chums. We will not be going back. Last year my youngest son (10) hooked several fish which eventually crossed lines with someone else. Instead of simply helping us get untangled, I watched guys take their cigarette out, cut the line, and then laugh about it! I didn't know what to say to my boy. If that wasn't enough, everytime we got into fish, boats would anchor anchor literally within feet of us. This must be a big-city thing, have never had that problem on this side of the state. We don't have the near the fish you coastal guys have, but fishing without crowds is a given.

RiverMan,

Since your experience seems to be kind of like mine, I wanted to see if you have observed what I have, or whether I'm just smoking crack.

I started going to Hoodsport about 8 years ago, also. There always were a lot of people there for chums, but it seems the boat traffic has steadily increased and most notably over the last 3 or 4 years. When I first started going, I thought a boat would be a great way to get out of the crowds. The boats seemed to stay more or less outside and I remember only the occasional conflict, but over the last 2 or 3 years, it's harder to deal with the boats than with the people on shore.

Also, the last two years the fish numbers seem to have been way down. For a couple of years before that there were huge numbers of fish and the boats could spread way out and always be on fish. Lately it has been more typical that there may be only one good concentration of fish, and first one boat, and then another and another and another will move right in on them, regardless of the school's proximity to the bank and the crowds on shore. It's one thing to be shoulder to shoulder with the bank fishermen when everybody's casting (more or less) in the same general direction. It's another thing having to deal with the boats opposite you all casting at you, plus anchor lines and all that. Then there's all the new talk about whether the boats are even supposed to be crossing the supposedly new lines that have been established out there the past two years or so. That's what chased me away from that place. In all the years I have gone, really only two or three what I would characterize as obnoxious bank fishermen stick out in my mind. The great majority of the time it was a circus atmosphere and everybody had a pretty good attitude about the whole thing. If you went there with the right attitude, it was just fun. When circumstance allowed, it was a great place to catch a big chum on a fly and catch fish after fish that way.

Maybe when the fish counts get up again, the bank/boat conflict will subside. I hope so.