This is a follow-on from and earlier post regarding puch cards and their validity. The present system has many problems. How about replacing it with an online reporting system!!!??? This would be heaven compared to the present challenges of finding a pen, remembering the codes, writing with frozen fingers, and so on. Also, data summaries would be available almost instantly rather than two years down the road. They might need a way to enforce such a system, however, so maybe a basic punchcard (with just a punch required) plus an on-line follow-up might work.

I know that whenever I catch a reportable fish I am usually on-line that night telling everyone about it, so adding the WDFW to the address list would not be that hard.

Punchcards you actually punch would be great except in Florida. The system would crash with all the hanging chads and all.......

No, really, I would like something easier as well. It would be great if they had something that could be scanned and sent immediately at the ramp like UPS does with their little computerized signing tablets.

Scanners at the ramps would be great in a perfect world, but they would cost us all more for our license fees, not to mention loss of these same scanners due to vandals and thievery. Then figure repair and maintenance, malfunctions due to weather,etc. I agree that there has to be a better way to do the punch card thing, but what will realistically work?

I Dont really have a problem with the punchcards.

We need to look for ways to save money not creating more buracracy. Doing things on the internet cost time and money to set up and maintain the sites. Plus, they would probably need a new department of people to analyze all the data.

I think they should require punchcard to be turned in at the same time you get your licence... no punchcard no licence... and a Masive surcharge on the next licence if its not in by a certain date... Its all computerized now should be easy to do.... right?

now if they would sell a pen that writes on that damm plastic when wet

I Dont really have a problem with the punchcards.

We need to look for ways to save money not creating more buracracy. Doing things on the internet cost time and money to set up and maintain the sites. Plus, they would probably need a new department of people to analyze all the data.

I think they should require punchcard to be turned in at the same time you get your licence... no punchcard no licence... and a Masive surcharge on the next licence if its not in by a certain date... Its all computerized now should be easy to do.... right?

now if they would sell a pen that writes on that damm plastic when wet

I could be wrong but from what I was told a month or so ago is that if your punch cards are not turned in they will not issue you a new licence. We were told this as the game warden was writting out a ticket for no licence/punch card on person. This is the first time that I have heard of such a thing. Anyone know or hear anything to confirm this?

Fishslayer75

Never heard of that but say you loose it. How would you turn it in then?

Hey Pickled herring.

Try a sharpie extra-fine point permanent pen. They write on a punchcard great as long as it is somewhat dry.

Well...I think it's pretty well-accepted that punchcard data isn't exactly reliable. The question is how to make a more reliable system that:

1. Can be used to enforce a daily limit.
2. Can be used to enforce a yearly limit.
3. Can be used to generate reliable numbers of fish harvested, by river and by date, for the entire fishing season.

And, possibly,

4. Can be used to make in season assessments of fisherman effort and success.

To enforce a daily limit, you need to have something that must be physically marked on your person on the river. Same for a yearly limit.

For total season harvest numbers, you need something that must be marked in the field and returned at the end of the season, that has type of fish (hatchery or wild), river, and date on it.

For numbers 1 through 3, it sounds like the current punchcard system is ideal, with one exception.

That exception is that it is very difficult to enforce the proper use of the punchcard. Not only are many fishers very willing and able to not punch the card properly, or at all, but there are far too few enforcement officers, or officer hours, to check them to make sure they do.

My opinion, I guess, is that the penalty for being caught cheating must be so heavy that the knowledge that you are extremely likely to get caught is outweighed by the penalty.

What should the penalty be? Should it be financial? Should it be a reduction or elimination of fishing privileges? Should it be some combination of both?

What about not turning it in on time at the end of the year? Even if everyone could somehow be convinced (coerced?) to fill the cards out properly, it wouldn't do any good if they aren't all turned in.

Should the penalty for this be the same as for not filling it in properly while in the field? I guess the best way to get it done is to require that it be turned in at the time you purchase your next one...and if it's not, then I guess you're out of luck. Perhaps you could fill out and sign an affidavit that says you lost it and approximates the amount, time, and place for fish you did catch. Unfortunately, I'm afraid that the same people who are willing to cheat on their cards would also be willing to lie in a legal document.

In short, I think the punchcard system in place now is the best we have, if used properly. Enforcement needs to be vigilant, and heavy, for improperly using the cards, or they just won't be used properly.

Number 4 above, I think is something that a punchcard system wouldn't be able to help. In season assessments would be very helpful in opening/closing fisheries based on actual returns/succes rates, rather than on estimated returns and expected exploitations.

How can we get those? Sonar counts would be pretty accurate, but really expensive. However, it seems to be the only option that would be useful. Anything that involved voluntary reporting, i.e., online reporting or creel check surveys would not likely have many people reporting accurately. (See thread titled "Confused!!" for issues involving voluntary reporting of harvest success).

Fish on...

Todd.

Good question. I just placed a phone call the wdfw and asked them if this is in fact true. They did confirm this and said that it went in to affect last year. I also found out that you will need to go to the place of purchase to receive a duplicate copy and turn it in if the orignal is lost. The other thing I asked is if you may turn it in at the time of purchase of the new one. She said that it must be recorded in oly before a new one will be issued.Good to know.

Amen Todd! The punchcard system we have now may not be perfect, but you touched on all of the reasons why it is necessary, IMHO.

I take that to mean that in order to get a new licence on april 1, our punchcards need to be mailed and then recorded in olympia before a licence is issued.

About 6-8 weeks non-fishing time while the punch card is in transit and transfered from desk to desk in oly...

Goeduck,
That is the problem... when wet... I can use just about any pen when dry...

Thats the way I understood it? I started thinking about that myself after getting off the phone. There has to be a was around this or I didn't understand her correctly. Wouldn't be the first time but I'm pretty sure.

I hope that this is how it would work out...

1. I think the card is good until April 30, rather than April 1.

2. There isn't any steelhead fishing going on in May, anyway....so

3. Mail in on May 1, and hopefully it will be less than a month before it makes its way to Olympia and gets entered into their computer.
Since it's computer recorded now, it wouldn' t have to be mailed anywhere else...just entered.

You could have another punchcard for salmon, right? If not, you'd be screwed unless you bought your punchcard at the Natural Resources Building in Olympia and had your old one recorded right then and there.

Or if you don't salmon fish in May.

This also seems to fly in the face of WDFW's advice to buy your license early so as to avoid the rush when it expires...

Fish on...

Todd.

I have a couple points others missed. I remember the old true punch card that we used for salmon. It had a small "chad" that was pushed out. If that card got wet or folded too many times the chads fell off. Then you had to get another card which is a PIA. In May Sturgeon, Halibut, Salmon, and Steelhead are open along with crabs. I am not sure about this must turn in old before a new is done. On the WDFW they were advertising buying your 2003 licenses for Christmas. That is WAY before April. I guess the best thing to do is just go down now a get the 03 one to see. I do know that you must report your hunting tags before you get another one, so that maybe were the confusion is.

I know that I lost my liscense in oct and got a replacement somewhere other than the place I bought it.

Any place you buy a liscense is an authorized dealer and can sell you a replacement liscense.They are all hooked to the computer so anyplace can get your info for you.

I know that you cant get a 2003 hunting liscense until you turn in your harvest report.Dunno,might be the same for fishing,but dont really see how that would work.