Are our game wardens getting the job done? Does anyone else think that enough is not being done to reduce poaching and other game violations? I have seen more and more people who belive the rules and regulations pamphlit is just list of suggestions. If you don't believe this just visit one of our many "meat" fisheries. (blue creek, Samish, snohomish, ect.) Allot of these people will argue that the regs are hard to understand, this is not true. In many areas the mere thought of a gamie near buy would make many of these people pack up and leave. I think we need game agents that are willing to get them off of our waters. I hear people who say they are already a bunch of hard a%@es and should be more lenient. If this is so why doesn't it stop? Has any one seen a fishcop actually hike into blue creek? Am I too serius about this? We constantly here about lost opourtunities and access. If we want this to stop we need accountability for every one. Ever tried to call in a report to the poaching hotline? I have several times and never seen any responce. is this just another failure to add to the already endless list fro the WDFW?

I have been seeing lots of enforcement on the salt water lately, especially, on the weekends.

I believe the issue has to do with WDFW's obsession with "wild" fish. The snagging in the hatchery zones is tolerated (to a degree) because these are hatchery fish earmarked for consumption. This can make hatchery areas uncomfortable to be in if you are trying to do the right thing.

On the other hand, you will probably face a firing squad for keeping or improperly treating an unmarked fish. Maybe this is the way it should be, but I saw alot of "wild" fish roughly handled and probaly killed by the charter boat fleet. A

Just about every trip I take out to Sekiu or Neah Bay I meet up with enforcement. Visit are usually pretty short and always cordial.

Two issues are at hand.

#1. So many areas to monitor.
#2. Reductions in staff at WDFW.

Many times there are one or two officers on duty in any given region. This means that they cover a number of counties. How many places are there to fish in Grays Harbor County? About 200. So one or two guys are supposed to check all of these places every day, and see every violation? They also have a myriad of other things they do other than look for fishing violations.

If you (not just you W. Coyote, I mean everybody) voted for Tim Eiman's initiative to lower vehicle license tabs, you contributed to lower enforcement levels.

You do see emphasis patrols from time to time in different areas, like Sekiu, the Skok, Cowlitz (They take a jet boat to Blue Creek, not walk in. This maximizes their effectiveness instead of wasting time to and from their vehicles to walk down the trail.)

One solution I might suggest would be that you join Eyes in the woods. It is a voluteer group of hunters and fishermen who are trained observers who look for violations and report them. Here is a link. Eyes in the woods
Sometimes the folks manning game check stations are WDFW employees, other times they are volunteers.

It is our job to help enforcement. Anybody can complain, but these folks are part of the solution. The volunteer hours also count towards your AHE Master Hunter project, if you should choose to do so.

You never know who is an observer, heck, I might even be one. Will you ever really know?

Give it a try, and lend a hand.

Can't police act as game wardens? I was fishing off of a lake washington dock a few years back and had my fishing license checked by a couple cops. If this is still true, has anyone else been checked by cops? I think it's a good idea and hope to see more of it in the future.

--Bank Angler

County Sheriff's deputies and State Patrol regularly respond to game violations and trespass calls related to fishing and hunting. Most of their emphasis, however, is geared towards Titles 9, 9A and 46 of the RCW's, (crimes against persons, property and traffic), but they also enforce Title 77 (fish & wildlife) of the RCW's on an occasional basis.

There are also some city police who are versed fairly well in title 77 of the RCW's, but again, they tend to concentrate on Title 9, 9A, and 46 crimes and infractions.

Generally, not always (note the broad disclaimer), deputies, troopers, and police will call in to WDFW to have them send a game officer more acquainted with fish & game violations because of their lack of familiarity with the hunting and fishing regs.

EXAMPLE: I had written permission to hunt on a piece of property posted "no hunting without written permission". I shot a cow elk with my muzzleloader on New Years Day. I had a modern firearms tag, a special permit good for all of January, and I was in a firearms restriction zone.

As I was driving out of the farmer's driveway a deputy pulls up, asks what I was doing, my ID, my hunting license and pulls out his ticket book.

He says that I can't hunt on property posted no hunting, that I am poaching a cow elk, hunting out of season, and that I am using the wrong weapon for my tag.

I politely corrected him letting him know that I can hunt on property marked "no hunting without written permission" when I have said written permision on my person, and I showed him my note.

I then showed him my special permit for a cow elk for the month of January in this particular unit.

I then showed him a map and legal description of the unit, and the description of the firearms restriction for the unit showing that it was okay for me to use my muzzleloader here. I invited him to call State Patrol dispatch and talk with a WDFW enforcement officer, which he did, verified what I was saying was true, then he apologized.

It was his lack of familiarity of the game laws and the area he was patroling that could have created a big hassle for me. Luckily I knew the rules and regs, had a basic understanding of the RCW's, and I was polite and respectful.

WDFW game officers are specialists. They need to enforce fish and game violations, and while it is nice for the other departments to help out from time to time, they will almost always defer to a game officer.

Yes, police can right you tickets for fishing violations. any commisioned officer in the state can right you tickets for any rule on the books.


One could say that the poachers are not the ones getting waters shut down but its the people calling all the time. For instance the barrier dam silver fishery. the sign was practically at the dam but because there was so many people whinining to the state about the snagging going on the sign got moved way the hell back down river. These fish were surplus silvers that were clogging the fish ladder.The people calling were people that could catch no fish! and were just jealous of the people who were catching fish.
I had a couple fish that were hooked just outside the mouth that I kept. some joe blow logger jerk called the warden and was all checking out my truck like he was the savior of the fish or something. He was standing on the bank waiting for a spot to fish. He started whining about how I had to let the fish go I told him to get a life and take up carp fishing, from there I had to say nothing else after that everybody started laying into him. he was to stupid to realize that the faster I limited the faster he had a spot to fish. The warden came and at first tried to right me a ticket just on heresay, After explaining what happened he did not right me up. We talked for awhile and he told me how he was sick and tired of getting called on snaggers and pulled away from the elk and dear poachers. They get called they have to respond legit or not thats the way it is, and thats why $hit gets closed.

I only call when I am sure the wardens will have a case and only on people that are poaching on naturally spawning fish runs.
The state said it themselves I a response to the letters written regarding netting in the columbia river "sportsfishermen could never catch all the surplus hatchery fish." That is why they let the nets in the columbia even risking the catch of native fish.
Hatchery fish are not important and the more fisheries that get closed the more pressure there is on wild fish!

By the way, on the cowlitz silver fishery the first year they opened the upper pool the wardens would stand up in the p-lot and watch people snag fish but write no tickets. The the unspoken word was that is was ok because of all the surplus fish.

Micro,

Those are truly words of a knoble sportsman.

"Any dumbass can snag, but a real sportsman makes them bite." no floosing allowed. Try a bobber & eggs. You might attually get to see a bite. Backbounce a bait and you'll fell what a mouth bites like. They are better than a tail rub.

You're no better than the guy convicted of rape. Does the word consentuall mean anything to you.

Micro,

Those are truly words of a knoble sportsman.

"Any dumbass can snag, but a real sportsman makes them bite." no floosing allowed. Try a bobber & eggs. You might attually get to see a bite. Backbounce a bait and you'll fell what a mouth bites like. They are better than a tail rub.

You're no better than the guy convicted of rape. Does the word consentuall mean anything to you.

OK here we go...

There is WAYYYYYY!!!!! to little enforcment!!!!

Hatchery fish or not poachers should be cited and fined.. Wild fish should be protected at all costs..

Neither of thoes is eber going to be a priority of WDFW. Here is the other options..

Anglers need to NOT TOLERATE POACHING!!

If you are up on the North Lewis and the a guy next to you is snagging tell him to stop or you WILL turn him in and testify against him in court.

These behaviors exsist because good honest fishermen tolerate it..
Another thing.. in the fall it's not just the usual poacher thats snagging it's my experience that MOST bank anglers are snagging many of these people spend all winter drift fishing for steelhead but when the salmon ar around they instantly become snaggers.. It's sick! i think a ban on drift bobbers fished alone would be a good start unfair but lets face it snaggers arenlt gonna try snagging with bait,,,

For your information I wasnt flossing I was tossing a jig and the majority of the fish I land are hooked INSIDE! the mouth. I dont intentionally snag fish though it does happen sometimes. Two of the fish I kept that the jerk was all hot and bothered about hit the jig on the drop and were hooked just outside the choppers. I have also had fish especially silvers hit the jig only to flip and roll and have the hook come out and hook the fish in the side. It is illegal to INTENTIONALLY snag or ATTEMPT to snag fish. It is not illegal to keep a legitimatly hooked fish. Bobber and eggs works alright if you like playing alot of jacks but I will out fish you 10 to 1 using jigs catching mostly adults. I have been fishing jigs for silvers for about ten years now in salt and fresh water. I am not one of your so called dumbasses that just started and dont have a clue so they yank away. I am the jig king though it looks like me and Cowlitz got to have a fish off some day he has some good info out on another board.

Micro is right on! - Rob Allen

If enforcement was truly "doing there job", they would be down at the Wallace Gravel Pit on the Cowlitz right now citing that stupid pit owner for closing off OUR perpetual fishing easement that we fishermen had paid $40,000 in 1971 to fish the banks of the Cowlitz River!

Micro tells it how it is again, and if you weren't such a newcomer to our board, you would know better! Try going back and reading this thread; "Learn my hottest method for jig fishing coho!" This will tell you the difference between snagging, and legally catching fish.

Micro, my last "duel" was supposed to be with 4Salt, but we settled before our aids could be chosen! If I recall, you were to me one of my choices! It never fails!! The young rooster is always egging on the old rooster!!

It would truly be fun to have a jigging duel with you this year if the silver run is as big as they have predicted it to be.

Cowlitzfisherman

I see the Jig flossing method that has been used on the samish has finnally made it's way to the Cowlitz. I guess that will be the "in" thing for steelhead this winter. This is a classic example of people causing loss of opourtunity again snaggers out of controll in one spot closes it down. I don't care if they are surplus fish, they are better off being used to seed a river system than to perpetuate a mentality that any snagging is ok. I want to see this state change the definition of a legally caught fish to in the mouth only!

W coyote. Im not sure if he if using the same jig method that we see on the samish. I dont have a problem throwing and swimming a jig in, or fishing it under a bobber. Its the guys who leave it sit on the bottem and wait for the fish to swim into the line then set that is wrong. they claim that the fish hit the lure because its hooked in the mouth but the lead jig head upens the mouth so the hook that follows gets inside the lips. you well always know the ones who practice this method because they defend it to the end....becareful on the samish, there is one big guy who isnt afraid to come to blows about it, I am fortunate to be big enough to make him think twice, but would hate to see this jerk get the advantage over a smaller guy. Hes a big mouth you cant miss him. DJ

You guys are just to much sometimes!

Why is it that some people only believe that the method, that they only know how to do, or the method that "they personally" prefer to use, is the only morally, ethical, and legal method, or way, to catch a fish?

Why do you guys cry so much? Is it that someone else has figured out a way to catch fish that you don't like to do? Is it that some guys can catch fish by making them angry and attack their jigs when your baits or fly's can't? Is it that someone is catching fish and making the "expert" fishermen that you consider yourself to be look bad? Can you explain to us why you guys keep whining and whining?

Last week it was the "line" flossing with corkies; the week before it was line flossing with bait; now its line flossing with jigs! What are you going to whine about next week? Is it going to be line flossing with spinners next? Maybe it will be line flossing with polarized glasses, bait and jigs?

Give it a brake, and if a guy wants to fish in a different method than you do, who really cares? The state hires guys (game wardens) to make calls on who is snagging and who is not. So why don't you let those guys do what we have paid them to do instead of trying to be your own self appointed judge and jury?

There really are no methods of fishing that I know of that can't be misused to snag a fish. Some methods may be a little harder than the others to use, but fisherman can make them all work if they really want to convert the method to snagging!

Anyway, that's my opinion on this flossing crap!


Cowlitzfisherman

I cannot figure out how some guy sitting at the terminal end of hatchery fish can call and have a warden show up because there is snagging going on when in October 2002 while I was fishing clients for Coho in lower Cow, there was 6 Jr. High boys snagging and keeping everything they caught even the BLACK BOOTS and Wild Coho bound for the Toutle System, I yelled over and asked why they were snagging and keeping these fish, there response "MR. xxx at the C&C Market pays us a $1.00 a pound even for the dark ones head and all.
I called the WDFW Region 5 and immediately reported this, I was told they would get back with me to sign the complaint and would look into this. In December I went to WDFW Olympia office to pay for my 2003 Guide Licenses, while there I thought I would follow up, since they never returned my call. Guess what they could not find the report, so I filled out a report and signed it, at the North of Falcon meeting at SeaTac in April I talked to the head enforcement officer for Region 5 and he had NO Clue about this violation, and he took my phone number and said that he would follow up on this. To this day I have not yet heard a word on this. I don't think WDFW could have had an easier major violation to do a Sting on than this!

Flossing, snagging hatchery fish for personal consumption is one thing but I think snagging and selling is several steps above when you have a state licensed buyer (tax license, business license etc.) for the record straight I am against flossing snagging and any illegal way of catching fish!

Cowlitz I agree it's not about any specific method Hell the Kalama gets full of guys snagging coho with flies in the fall I think that is exceptionally lame.. I have never seen anyone snagging with a Jig and Bobber. Mostly what i see down here is guys slowly retrieving or plunking a corkie tied behind the hook so thats the method I harp on..

Cowlitz Wow, looking at the number of posts that you have made I would expect you would dislike unsportsmen like fishing as much as anyone. Im not whinning about anything, I have a passion for fishing and a respect for the fish that I catch, does that mean I must keep it to myself. I catch my share in fact I would put my best g-loomins rod up against yours anyday, but it has to be a 2 river contest one day on yours and the next on mine. I do believe the guys that are leaving there jig on the bottem are lining fish, thats my stand and I say so to the people who do it. I dont back down from anyone. So I replyed with this report in a nice way, I didnt throw stones, I didnt look up all the posts that you have made and pointed out all the times that you have stated your opinin. I dont call the gamecops on every thing I see due to the result usually is threats of whole water sections being shut down my the same gamecops for a few bad apples.....infact are you a person who leaves his jig on the bottom, you defend it like you are.....I well agree that every lure can be used to floss fish and sometime some of the fish I catch are probly flossed, but I try to be ethnical in all my fishing and I dont feel like Im a whining about anything.....DJ

DJFISHS2XS

Since you had joined Bob's board on 12-19-02 and I had written a pretty extensive article concerning "jigging", on 1-27-03, I find it very strange that you do not recall the article since it was very big and on the board for quite some time. Obviously you did not read the thread! Maybe you should now go back and read it and then make your apology. Try doing a search and look under; " Learn my hottest method for jig fishing coho!"

Maybe a little lip biting will do you some good! I try to do my homework before I make such statements about other members. Yes, it does take a little time and work sometimes to do it, but it usually will prevent that dreaded "foot in mouth disease"! Read it and then come back and ask me again how I do "my" jigging!

Oh, and by the way, you said;" I catch my share in fact I would put my best g-loomins rod up against yours anyday, but it has to be a 2 river contest one day on yours and the next on mine."

I hate to be the bearer of this news, but I will tell you anyways; it is not the "fishing rod" or the rods names that catches the fish or makes the difference, it's the person with the knowledge and experience who is using the rod that makes the real difference!

Remember that, and you will proper grasshopper.


Cowlitzfisherman

This on and on and on thread reminds me of a bunch of macho guys comparing penis size....Gimme a break guys....let's talk about who can spit the furthest....I bet I can fart louder than you CF! I will match one of my flutter blasts to your tight little squeakers any day...come on...chicken??? buck buck buck!!!