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#445630 - 07/27/08 09:34 PM Re: Wolves in Washington [Re: B-RUN STEELY]
hohbomb73 Offline
D.E.A

Registered: 04/02/06
Posts: 1728
Loc: in da hood
Originally Posted By: B-RUN STEELY
" There I was beating up a Mexican, and a car full of Niggers stopped and beat my ass !!! can you believe it !!"..


I forgot what the topic was



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_________________________
So save me your sorries, I'm raising an army...

Fortes Fortuna Adiuvat.





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#445918 - 07/29/08 12:42 PM Re: Wolves in Washington [Re: hohbomb73]
OceanSun Offline
Repeat Spawner

Registered: 07/01/04
Posts: 1159
Loc: North Creek
Was scouting this last weekend over in the Naches area and came across a pair of wolves. I knew they were coming back, just didn't know they were that far south yet. Makes sense they would find the elk herds but I sure was surprised to see them. They sure weren't afraid of anything. No experience around wolves but it looks like I'll get some this fall.

Can't wait till bow season!
_________________________
. . . and God said unto them, Be fruitful, and multiply, and have dominion over the fish of the sea . . .

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#445993 - 07/29/08 09:22 PM Re: Wolves in Washington [Re: OceanSun]
j 7 Offline
Repeat Spawner

Registered: 02/09/07
Posts: 1422
Loc: Your monitor
Stam and B-run have the true jist of what happens. The story of a coyote killing the neighbors cat gets turned into a pack of wolves ruined my deer spot and I am going to arm myself to the teeth next time I go drinking..............................................I mean hunting.

It would be nice to have a few wolves to kill the sick and the weak. Unfortunatley you cant just have a few these days. Its all or nothing kind of attitutde. People did not like wolves in the past and they sure arent going to like them now. I cant stand the political/management aspect of the situation. There is no agreement on what to do. If the past is an example it will only get worse when no consensus is reached. I cant stand the the sky is falling because there are wolves in the woods attitude either.
_________________________
For some of us, a bad day of fishing is a bad day at work.

j7 2012

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#446072 - 07/30/08 01:06 PM Re: Wolves in Washington [Re: j 7]
willametteriveroutlaw Offline
Spawner

Registered: 10/26/02
Posts: 864
Loc: Portland Or
Originally Posted By: j 7
Stam and B-run have the true jist of what happens. The story of a coyote killing the neighbors cat gets turned into a pack of wolves ruined my deer spot and I am going to arm myself to the teeth next time I go drinking..............................................I mean hunting.

It would be nice to have a few wolves to kill the sick and the weak. Unfortunatley you cant just have a few these days. Its all or nothing kind of attitutde. People did not like wolves in the past and they sure arent going to like them now. I cant stand the political/management aspect of the situation. There is no agreement on what to do. If the past is an example it will only get worse when no consensus is reached. I cant stand the the sky is falling because there are wolves in the woods attitude either.


Unfortunately studies have shown that wolves do not kill just the sick and the weak by any stretch, They kill bulls, breeding age cows, and calves more than anything else. (great news huh!)
_________________________
That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed, --That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government,

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#446091 - 07/30/08 03:22 PM Re: Wolves in Washington [Re: willametteriveroutlaw]
Dan S. Offline
It all boils down to this - I'm right, everyone else is wrong, and anyone who disputes this is clearly a dumbfuck.

Registered: 03/07/99
Posts: 15664
Loc: SE Olympia, WA
Yeah, well the funny thing is, once they eat the bulls and breeding age cows and calves, they'll either starve or have to learn to shop at Safeway.

You kill bulls, right? Are the elk there to feed you and you alone? Or is anything that inconveniences you and your hunt something we should get rid of?

Just playing some 'devil's advocate' here. I'll play the other side of the fence later today. grin
_________________________
She was standin' alone over by the juke box, like she'd something to sell.
I said "baby, what's the goin' price?" She told me to go to hell.

Bon Scott - Shot Down in Flames

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#446157 - 07/30/08 11:34 PM Re: Wolves in Washington [Re: Dan S.]
dcrzfitter Offline
Spawner

Registered: 04/10/99
Posts: 913
Loc: Tenino, wa U.S.A.
OceanSun,

Did you get picks? I sure hope they wern't real wolves. maybe just some of those hybrid. I use to Archery hunt that same erea. Now that I think of it we did find a wolf track in the snow. it was going across the road a few times as it went into a deep rocky canyon near haystack rock. would that be near wherer you were? oh ya did you see any turkey? rumor has it they are getting good numbers going in that erea. I use to spend ALLOT of time in those hills. untill gas prices got so bad. now I play closer to home.

my uncle talked to a guy who I think was an owner or maybe a regular at wistling Jacks who showed him picks of a Grizzly between chinook and White pass. land marks and all in the pics. WDFW even looked at his pics. When showed a seperate pic without the bear in the same spot they said yes that is the right land marks of where you are telling us you took this pic. then he pulled out a pic of the bear and they said yes that is a grizz. when showed the pic of the bear with the land mark they told him he didn't take that pic in that erea and it must be a trick. the ydidn't want people to know they had Griz bears that far south.

Same uncle seen a wolverine up @ Ravens Roost one winter. it was in my dads tracks as he was after an elk.


Back in the late 80's my dad use to hunt the St. Hellens erea allot. they seen wolves now and then. He found out that weyhauser had planted some timber wolves to try and control the deer population.


we have had allot of criters that most people would never see and WDFW would not want people to know about. and NOW WE HAVE WOLVES!!! guess what they never left!!! we have allways had a few just like the wolverine and grizz.


Kris


Kris

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#446167 - 07/31/08 12:45 AM Re: Wolves in Washington [Re: Dan S.]
Salmonella Offline
Repeat Spawner

Registered: 11/29/04
Posts: 1369
[quote=Dan S.]Yeah, well the funny thing is, once they eat the bulls and breeding age cows and calves, they'll either starve or have to learn to shop at Safeway.

You kill bulls, right? Are the elk there to feed you and you alone? Or is anything that inconveniences you and your hunt something we should get rid of? [End Quote]

I would compare it to introducing northern pike into your favotite steelhead rivers.
Sportsmen funded conservation organizations have worked for decades to improve habitat and wildlife populations.
Elk, mule deer, bighorn sheep, moose have flourished as a result.
The wolfhuggers take great pride in the fact that hunters are upset with the exploding wolf population .

I in NO WAY want to exterminate any species of wildlife.
If you control the prey numbers you simply have to control the predator numbers as well or be content to live with crashes in the numbers of both predator and prey.

There IS a sustainable medium to be had.
_________________________


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#446171 - 07/31/08 01:26 AM Re: Wolves in Washington [Re: Salmonella]
Queets guy Offline
Juvenile at Sea

Registered: 10/21/06
Posts: 214
Loc: port orchard, WA
I saw a whitetail hualing ass from two wolves in heavy timber last year while hunting in Idaho.....I never thought such an animal could move so fast through that dense of forest. Like I've heard many times...."theres a reason our ancestors got rid of tthe damn things." lol Friends went to Idaho last yuear on an elk hunt and they never heard a bugle the seven days they were there, yet they hear an amazing amount of wolves everynight from camp. They came to conclusion a bull bugling would be same same as ringing the dinnerbell.....



Jake

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#446238 - 07/31/08 02:59 PM Re: Wolves in Washington [Re: Queets guy]
Dan S. Offline
It all boils down to this - I'm right, everyone else is wrong, and anyone who disputes this is clearly a dumbfuck.

Registered: 03/07/99
Posts: 15664
Loc: SE Olympia, WA
Quote:
I would compare it to introducing northern pike into your favotite steelhead rivers.


If there were ever any pike in the rivers I fish that might be a valid comparison, but that's not the case. They are REintroducing wolves, not introducing them.

Whether or not that's a good idea is certainly debatable, though.
_________________________
She was standin' alone over by the juke box, like she'd something to sell.
I said "baby, what's the goin' price?" She told me to go to hell.

Bon Scott - Shot Down in Flames

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#446240 - 07/31/08 03:10 PM Re: Wolves in Washington [Re: willametteriveroutlaw]
j 7 Offline
Repeat Spawner

Registered: 02/09/07
Posts: 1422
Loc: Your monitor
Originally Posted By: willametteriveroutlaw


Unfortunately studies have shown that wolves do not kill just the sick and the weak by any stretch, They kill bulls, breeding age cows, and calves more than anything else. (great news huh!)



Yes that is true, but the studies are really showing this is true when there are too many wolves. You have to understand that wolves are predators and very buisness like. Every predator weighs it options before making a kill. They ponder four questions. How hungry am I/we? How much energy do I/we have to use to make a kill? How much energy will I/we gain from the kill? How much injury will I/we absorb by making a kill? When there are too many wolves and competittion for food is high; they are willing to expend more energy and take more injury to eat. When the population of wolves is low they will take the easy prey everytime i.e sick, weak, young. When population is high, they will take an antler poke or two, or get dropped kicked by a big cow. Yes, sometimes a big bull tired from walking in belly high snow, is weak, and alone. This fits into the wolves buisness plan. But usualy they will takes what is easy.


This is my reasoning for just having a few wolves i.e. proper management through hunting. Political crap, fear hype, and lack of education makes this difficult.
_________________________
For some of us, a bad day of fishing is a bad day at work.

j7 2012

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#446318 - 07/31/08 10:10 PM Re: Wolves in Washington [Re: j 7]
dcrzfitter Offline
Spawner

Registered: 04/10/99
Posts: 913
Loc: Tenino, wa U.S.A.
where we hunt in Idaho they have found several small herds of elk dead. they were killed by the wolves and left. they didn't make any attempt to eat them. They ran them into the low ereas where the snow was deeper and when the elk got bogged down they were ham strung and left. these wolves are not the native ones. they were imported and are sapose to be the only known strain to kill just for fun.

the idea they only eat the week or sick is just a bunch of BS the bunny huggers want to brain wash people with. yes, we should have wolves but only if we are allowed to control them from becomeing the problems they are in other states.

like I said before. bringing the wolves back is just part of the big plan to eliminate hunting. Same with doing away with hound hunting for other things like bear and cat.

Kris

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#446326 - 07/31/08 10:56 PM Re: Wolves in Washington [Re: dcrzfitter]
B-RUN STEELY Offline
River Nutrients

Registered: 02/08/00
Posts: 3322
Loc: IDAHO
Originally Posted By: dcrzfitter
where we hunt in Idaho they have found several small herds of elk dead. they were killed by the wolves and left.
Kris


Dude.... thats just plain B.S

" who are THEY ???"

I have lived and hunted in Idaho my entire life, and can tell you that what your saying is not a "documented" fact... You throw up where you found that little FYI or stop talking. The fish and game publishes - every - single - wolf related incident thats happened in the last 12 years.. and " several small herds of elk left and not eaten " by wolves is not in any of them. Sheep... yea, its happened a bunch, and I really don't have any sympathy for the ranching community ( sucking on the big government boob while trying to play the poor guy, and locking up more acres than you can dream of )

Am I a wolf lover.. not even. I do believe that its a vehicle to get hunters out of the woods. Do I know better than to blow redneck speculation as " my side" of the story.. hell yes.

Something needs done in Idaho. What Idaho really does not need is crap Myths floating around because the Peta types are smart... Wolves are old news here.. they get monitored beyond your wildest imagination. Unless you can trace a wolf incident to a factual source, leave it alone.

On that subject.. another pack of 6 Walker hounds out hunting Bears were lost to wolves last week in the Clearwater drainage near Smith ridge. This " fact " was just published today. If you need a link for that I got one
_________________________
Clearwater/Salmon Super Freak

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#446341 - 08/01/08 12:37 AM Re: Wolves in Washington [Re: B-RUN STEELY]
dcrzfitter Offline
Spawner

Registered: 04/10/99
Posts: 913
Loc: Tenino, wa U.S.A.
B-Run

whoa dude!!!

You know as well as me allot happens in the back woods that don't get published. I don't know the exact erea as I didn't find them. The guy I know who is a local said one of his buddies found it and it was not the first time they had seen this happen. I belive they said it was 7 animals they had just found. I could care less if it was "reported" these guys have no intrest in making it up. They allso had told me about the dogs getting killed by the wolves. and as you know it is not the first time.

I don't know how me telling of wolves killing for fun is going to help PETA? people need to know these wolves are not the same wolves that were found in these parts. It would be like taking steelhead from chambers creek and puting them in the Clearwater. Steelhead yes but not the same.


oh ya did you hear the one about the pack of wolves that ran into a school yard and kiled all the kids!!! now that would be a red neck story.


Kris

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#446462 - 08/01/08 06:58 PM Re: Wolves in Washington [Re: dcrzfitter]
OceanSun Offline
Repeat Spawner

Registered: 07/01/04
Posts: 1159
Loc: North Creek
Originally Posted By: dcrzfitter
OceanSun,

Did you get picks? I sure hope they wern't real wolves. maybe just some of those hybrid. I use to Archery hunt that same erea. Now that I think of it we did find a wolf track in the snow. it was going across the road a few times as it went into a deep rocky canyon near haystack rock. would that be near wherer you were? oh ya did you see any turkey? rumor has it they are getting good numbers going in that erea. I use to spend ALLOT of time in those hills. untill gas prices got so bad. now I play closer to home.



Definately wolves but no pics. Didn't see or hear any turkey but wasn't listening/looking for them. and, oh yeah, no elk over there either so the rest of you guys should just stay home! zip
_________________________
. . . and God said unto them, Be fruitful, and multiply, and have dominion over the fish of the sea . . .

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#446483 - 08/01/08 09:05 PM Re: Wolves in Washington [Re: OceanSun]
ramprat Offline
Juvenile at Sea

Registered: 03/08/99
Posts: 178
Loc: Graham
Yes,
Wolves do have an impact on the deer and elk populations, They also have an impact on the mouse, squirrel, and rat populations, that is when there is enough of a population to warrant the energy they use to go after the prey.
Lets face it Wolves have been a part of the ecosystem long before we or our parents or grand parents or great grandparents were born.
When people started ranching and raising cattle, Horses, ect, This was like a free meal to the predators.
To this day it still is, and that is why the ranchers and the government, over time basically eradicated the wolf population.
Ever hear of anyone seeing a Cascade mountain wolf?
Used to be a local wolf that is now extinct in Washington.
Although an old hunter I know swears he saw one in the 1960's.
I do believe that wolves as well as coyotes are oppertunistic hunters and they will take down any animal they can if there is an opportunity to do so even if they are not hungry.
Think about your average well fed house cat who still chases mice and birds and drops them at your feet but does not eat them.
Personally I think it would add to my hunting and outdoor experience to hear the howl of wolves nearby once again in this state.
Ramprat
_________________________
Proud Life time N.R.A. member For over 25 years.

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#446510 - 08/02/08 12:14 AM Re: Wolves in Washington [Re: dcrzfitter]
B-RUN STEELY Offline
River Nutrients

Registered: 02/08/00
Posts: 3322
Loc: IDAHO
Originally Posted By: dcrzfitter
B-Run

whoa dude!!!

You know as well as me allot happens in the back woods that don't get published. I don't know the exact erea as I didn't find them. The guy I know who is a local said one of his buddies found it and it was not the first time they had seen this happen. I belive they said it was 7 animals they had just found. I could care less if it was "reported" these guys have no intrest in making it up.



So what would the point of not reporting that be ??

Well, something like that would be of great interest to a lot of people.. and if it was documented, would help with the cause. Instead, its just another story. The other side ?? they just deal with the facts, and are smart enough to use those facts to their advantage. What we get from the anti wolf crowd is a whole bunch of " how I feel " and very little " what we know".

The whole derailment plan to remove wolves from the endangered species list is because the State of Wyoming decided to take the redneck approach and declare " open seasons shoot on sight " which everyone knew would not fly, and they did it anyway.. look what we got in response.

True story, a few months ago there was a concentrated push by several "groups" that wanted .. " fire free zones and established wolf viewing areas set up so they could go up into the hills during hunting season and view wolves without fear of bullets flying around "

Its was pretty funny. The responses that got through the local media. As if wolves were going to show up at any given place so yuppies could check them out at their convenience.. Wolves, being wolves.. would do what wolves do. Mostly lean against light posts smoking cigarettes and whistling at chicks " Hey.. butch chick in the Range Rover with the rainbow sticker !!! Show me your tits !! "
_________________________
Clearwater/Salmon Super Freak

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#446544 - 08/02/08 10:51 AM Re: Wolves in Washington [Re: B-RUN STEELY]
dcrzfitter Offline
Spawner

Registered: 04/10/99
Posts: 913
Loc: Tenino, wa U.S.A.
B-Run


I agree with you and would report soemthing like that if I found it myself. I'm not sure why they didn't say anything. Some of these backwoods people just don't like the gov poking around their parts asking questions. Maybe they just figured they would catch up with the wolves and take care of them. I will be calling them in the next few days to get some plans going for this years deer season. I will try and find out a little more info where they found them and if it was reported. maybe they did and it was just ignored.

The last part of yer post. Thats funny but in the eyes of so many yuppies. I think that is exactly how they think it works.

Kris


Kris

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#446557 - 08/02/08 12:22 PM Re: Wolves in Washington [Re: dcrzfitter]
seastrike Offline
Hey Man....It's cool...

Registered: 08/18/02
Posts: 4323
Loc: seattle
Two of my favorite sayings heard in Idaho:
Save 100 elk...shoot a wolf.
Three legged wolves don't kill no elk.

My personal observation is that the wolves have changed hunting. The elk in our area have changed their behavior. You rarely see lone elk and you don't hear elk very often. We have seen the bulls stick with their herds after the rut. We think it's a safety thing. The elk also move around a lot more than they used to.

I do think there are less elk and hunting them has become more difficult. When the pack comes into one of our drainages the elk immediately leave. They come back a day or two after we stop seeing or hearing wolves.

It doesn't help that a breeding pair of wolves was introduced near our area 10 or so years ago.

On the plus side everyone knows the wolves were introduced in this area and hunting pressure has plummeted.

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#446572 - 08/02/08 01:29 PM Re: Wolves in Washington [Re: RowVsWade]
cast this Offline
Parr

Registered: 10/03/00
Posts: 53
Loc: grays harbor, wa.

Having just hunted deer in Idaho for the first time last year, my personal opinion about them isn't fully formed yet. BUT, it was raised a few hackles when, after helping a local load a nice whitetail into his truck, the conversation turned to the wolves and grizzlies in the Panhandle. That local hunter said the grizzlies aren't a real problem unless you surprise one, otherwise just give it room. The wolves, on the other hand "them bastards will circle ya..be careful."
Living on the Wa. coast, I'm not crazy about an introduction here, either. Between the cougars, indians, and illegal alien poachers, the deer populations here are not what they were.

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#446582 - 08/02/08 02:00 PM Re: Wolves in Washington [Re: cast this]
Salmonella Offline
Repeat Spawner

Registered: 11/29/04
Posts: 1369
Being attacked by a wolf, mountain lion or bear is the least of the worries a hunter should face.
A competent hunter should really fear no beast if he uses his most deadly weapon, his brain.

It is the impact on prey species and the inability to keep the wolves in targeted areas that is the problem.
Wolves are an incredibly efficient predator, can you imagine if grizzlies or mountain lions hunted in packs?
They are the pirahnnas of the woods when it comes to their hunting tactics.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wi0J3CFqiXo&feature=related

They do sometimes hunt solo....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-Vkh64YT_wQ&feature=related
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