Is there any spring Chinook in the Satsop river system and if there isn't why not start one. I know a lot of you don't like hatchery fish but if planting fish to get a run started why not. There is a lot of deep canyon holes in the upper Satsop river system for the fish to rest in and. For example, how about takeing 100 large prime female hatchery fish and then fertilizing there eggs with wild spring Chinook, at least you would be getting some of the wild genes into this run of fish. Do this for at least a couple of run cycles. Rasie the fry in a hatchery or use egg boxes to plant the fish way up river. I know there is a lot of prime spawning areas that are not getting fish back. I was up at upper hatchery ont the Stillwater and Bingham Creeks, the hatchery worker said they are stopping all marked fish at the hatchery and releaseing all unmarked fish to continue on up stream. When I was hunting inthe upper drainages of the Satsop I every little stream had either silvers or chum spawning in them. It looked like 30 years ago when I was working for Simpson Timber Co.

It is a nice idea.
I've never hooked one in the Satsop, fishing steelhead water. Used to fish the mainstem for chinook on the Chehalis back years ago.

The nets in the lower river really put a damper on the fish movement. Such a shame the State allowed the second largest drainage to get to no more chinook on my home waters.
I've moved down to fish the lower Columbia for whatever limited season.

Years ago (late Eighties or early Ninties) the Satsop hatchery killed off an entire age class of fall chinook. I believe funding was the issue.
Given today's State budget shortfall I don't see any funding for this type of project.

Bingham ( formerly Simpson ) never has done Chinook. They incubate and some rearing ( more now a days ) for the local communities volunteer brood program but it is ALEA / RFEG not WDF&W.

The year fish were destroyed was one in which by shear chance the volunteers exceeded the egg take Brood Doc numbers with permission. Montesano Fish Management intervened and directed the hatchery crew to dispose of the overage. They simply took the Heath trays to the river dumped the unbuttoned fry into it and called it planting early.

Spring Chinook ( a few ) used to spawn in the reach of the river bordering Dick Studers Dairy. They disappeared many years ago.

Wynoochee River did have a run of "springers"....but they were called "dip-ins".......Many of the old timers, before dam, would tell me about the springers fishing back in the 40's and 50's but WDFW bio, Dick Stone just didn't see how that was possible.

I do know for a fact that about 40 Wynoochee Springers, right from the trap, were moved over to the "Satsop Springs" ponds, must have been in the early 80's. The reason I know this, wife, 2 sons, and myself....took our travel trailer over there.....baby sat them so nobody would "come over and hook and line them".

We left them when school started but went back up there to "pull eggs" and sperm them. Eggs went to Lake Aberdeen hatchery, then when fry'ed out...they got moved to Myhr Brothers....they were placed in a "net pen". There lays the problem...net pen was "too big" and they all got out........end of Springers on the Wynoochee....something WDFW, wanted to eliminate because "they just did"........grrrrrrrrrrr

That's my take on the Springers for Wynoochee...........do know that the Chehalis has a small run.........but again WDFW has not choosen to enhance this run......then they shut the sportsmen off......but allow the QIN, co-manger, to gill net and also the Chehalis Tribe nets on them!!!!!

Chehalis is a big water shed but you'd never know it by the way it is managed...............and now they want to put 2 dams in the upper Chehalis.....for flood control......when building permits were issued to allow building in the "flood plain".......wow....seems that someone has thier heads, where the sun don't shine!!!!!!!

Rant over........for this time!!!!!!

The only thing that WDFW will do for the foreseeable future is cut programs. I like your idea but realistically there is no chance any new programs will be funded by Phil and the gang.

Seattle Times Article

i have been told that the Chehalis Tribe whats to put in a springer hatchery and have the money but the quinaults will not work with them

Larryb:

Really.....can't believe the QIN wouldn't want to "spend $$$$$" to enhance a fishery, that their "nets" would have 1st crack getting returning fish.

Maybe that is their vacation time???????? LOL

No, it's "bycatch" in the sturgeon nets.

Like it or not, if you ever wanted that springer hatchery run.... the tribes would have to fund and run it. State would never do it. So the question really is would you be happier not fishing for them or being able to fish for the very few that got by the nets?

Its a tough one but with all the cuts coming up I'm to the point where I'd rather let the tribes build a new hatchery, net the living bejesus out of it, then let us fish for what very few fish aren't netted. I mean its federal money from US taxpayers that is givin to the tribes regardless of what they do with it. We sporties might as well benefit a tiny bit from it.

The only tricky part about that is the bycatch. And bycatch is not something controlled by gil nets.

The QIN have targeted Sturgeon under the dog and pony show of Springers from the start. You don't sink nets to get Springers. The few Springs the Chehalis has and the locations the
QIN net, simply put no $$$$, now the Sturgeon different.

I have never understood why Dennis & Brian agreed to let that fishery get rolling. Oh well..........................we all ain't real smart like them.

I know the Chehalis people have been working on some sort of solution to this question. Thier take has been out of the public opportunity.

Heartstrings go out to this community. I'm much more favorable to a good steward.

Coondog,

There is no record, at least no official or unofficial record, of a spring chinook population in the Satsop River. Historically, there may and likely were some dip ins from the Chehalis River population, and less likely, from the few Wynoochee fish. (Officially there was no Wynoochee spring chinook population either, but there is enough unofficial evidence to suggest that a small population existed.)

It would make more sense to attempt enhancing the existing Chehalis springer population (which the Chehalis Tribe is planning to do) then to begin a program on the Satsop. The Satsop watershed is not typical spring chinook habitat, and is more likely than not unsuited to spring chinook. If it were suitable, there should be at least some historic record of a population occurring there. Westside spring chinook generally occur in snow melt and glacial watersheds, and the Satsop is primarily rain fed. It's headwaters have no summer snow melt and definately no glaciers, so it's not surprising that there is no record of native spring chinook occurring there.

Sg

Dad has told me stories of catching springers with some regularity up by the dam on the nooch in the 70's. Too bad they are gone.

i was told the by someone who should know that the reason the state lets the quinaults take Sturgeon is the the the state says the Sturgeon in the chehalis are all columbia river fish ,no natural spawm in the chehalis, and if they stop the quinaults from catching the on the chehalis the quinaults would try to net the columbia for them.

There is the problem to any enhancement project. The tribal harvest issues.

Now why the f*** would the Quins even think they are entitled to sturgeon in the columbia??!! And yes, 99% of all sturgeon that aren't in either the Fraser or Columbia are strays..... so...... if you net them all there is a possibility there won't be any that stray there anymore.

It was only a gew years ago that I could catch sturgeon in the winter during steelhead trips, now I would not waste my time.......There used to be sturgeon all over puget sound, not many now.......In a few more years, you will not be fishing for sturgeon, they will be ESA listed.......the columbia season was extended at least twice this year as we had large number left in our (Magic Paper Quota)

In my opinon the State couldn't manage a fish in a fish bowl. The small private fish projects seem to do a much better job with the fisheries as long as the State keeps there nose out of it. With the tribel netting would be hard to restablish any run of fish as Slab Hunter stated. Eventually all the fish in the little streams will be extinct. The three silvers I caught tonight all had net marks and all where unclipped and released won't happen with nets. Sorry about my ramblings sometimes I get carried away thinking about what should be done and could be done.

You know it is the system folks. We as a population and society drive the system, so don't slam the agency. Well yes do slam the agency but understand it is a product of all of us. That it could not manage a little girls T ball team and not screw it up is 100% absolutely true BUT it is a product of our society.

We love to blame, accuse, point at others, but it is us. If it is desired by the citizens of this state it can be changed but a few ranting here .............. not much hope. Keep yelling whatever your view but do not expect real changes in direction, that only happens at the last option. In time we will arrive at that point..............in time, which translated means when few remain of a species. Think I am wrong? Explain Columbia ( and Trib ) smelt.

Stlhdr42,

What month of the year did your dad catch spring chinook near Wynoochee Dam?

LarryB,

If you were told by someone who should know, shouldn't that someone also know that the QIN would need to have treaty fishing rights in the Columbia River in order to fish there? I think you should ask your source to provide more convincing evidence of what he knows.

Sg