I've traveled a little recently. I've been fortunate enough to only have to go through the old-school metal detectors. No backscanner X-Ray machine (which I wouldn't submit to anyway) or pat-downs for me. My assessement was that they were intentially NOT putting people through the backscanner machines due to the public backlash and recent media coverage. There were plenty machines around with NONE of them being used. I believe that IF you set off the old-school metal detector, you'd be "selected" for one of the other options.

The question I have relates to pat-downs. According to the TSA, you can opt out of the body scanner and, instead, submit to a pat-down by a TSA agent OF THE SAME SEX. I find this strange for a couple of reasons. WHY must the agent doing the pat-down be the same sex as the passenger? The answer is initially fairly obvious: most women would prefer not to be fully groped by an unknown man. So, you could say that the "same sex" agent is chosen in attempts to take the "sexuality" out of the situation. But who is to say what anyone's sexual preference is.

If the passenger is gay, should they say so in order to NOT have an agent of the same sex pat them down? Or, what if the TSA agent themselves is gay? Wouldn't a gay male patting down a passenger be the same as a hetero man patting down a female passenger?

Why shouldn't someone have the right to request whichever gendered agent they want?

While there are many opportunites for humorous responses to my question (let'em fly!), I'm also curious to hear serious responses too.

-AP

I'd offer to pat myself down...no one touches me like I touch me.



Fish on...

Todd

Same rules as local law enforcement or prison/jail.

I've heard that if you are butt ugly they just pass you through without the scan or pat down.

Well, they should have a gay representitive for both women and men..

If you're a gay man you get a pat down by a gay women and if you're a gay female, you get a pat down from a gay male...

and if you're KK, you get a pat down from a farm animal that isn't a goat

At least that explains my recent lack of screening.

I was anti-TSA long before this latest foolishness with X-rays and pat downs became part of their procedure. All this sh!t does is add further proof that the F'n terrorists won! Americans live and travel in fear and participate in "security theater" in the illusion that they are safer from a terror attack. HS and TSA appear to be strictly reactionary, trying to stop techniques that terrorists have already tried, while the terrorist with half a brain are busy thinking of new untried ways to commit terrorist attacks.

I hate traveling unarmed, forced to check (at $25 a pop) my luggage even for short trips, because I never go anywhere without a knife in my pocket. I'd rather every passenger on the aircraft be armed, all the better to make fast work of any attempt at attack. First thing I do when I get on board and get my plastic spoon is break it off at an angle, ready to stab some SOB in the neck who misbehaves. It's un-American to be unarmed and not ready to defend oneself, those around us, and certainly the damned airplane we're riding in.

Back on topic, pat downs should be voluntary only, and only if the TSA agent is a hot chick.

They need Pat from SNL. Pat Down Pat. Who could complain?

Awesome, I LOL'd.

"Now kids, the first thing we do when we get on the plane is be sure to make a plastic shiv. No, no, don't be scared you probably won't have to shank someone, but we always want to be ready."

I couldn't agree more with these sentiments. I don't think it's a stretch to say we would have a very nearly or completely balanced federal budget and a much healthier economy if not for all this fear mongering. Every part of the effort to increase homeland security has astronomical direct and indirect costs. The direct costs are mostly obvious, but a cost that I don't think gets enough appreciation is the cost of the time lost by masses of Americans at airport security checkpoints daily. As much as I hate the cliche, time is money, and too much is being spent at our airports every day.

As for the topic at hand, I don't care who does it, I don't want to be padded down or x-rayed without due cause. A cowardly act of terrorism committed 10 years ago by someone with whom I have never had contact (nor ever will) is not due cause, in my mind. That said, when it comes down to it and I have to make a choice, I suppose I'll take the frisking. Sadly, I don't have the talent for on-command ejaculation that the fellow from the other dark side thread has; that would make the ordeal a lot more worthwhile for me.

Seriously, for a moment, does anyone think it's even remotely possible that terrorists would, or even could, hijack an American airliner now?

The old paradigm was that hijackers simply wanted money, or some buddies let out of prison, or to go to Cuba or somewhere. So it made more sense to cooperate with the hijackers and endure the inconvenience and waste of time, but at least no one got hurt.

The new paradigm is that the crazy Islamic hijackers want to die and take you with them. Who in their right mind is going to cooperate with a hijacker ever again? The second something seems to be going sideways on the aircraft, shank 'em in the neck with the plastic shiv and lives are saved. No detectors, X-rays, or pat downs required. $Billions$ saved. To paraphrase old Churchill, "We have nothing to fear but the fear our government creates and whips to a hysteria so that we willingly sacrifice our freedom, time, and money."

Up the revolution!

Sg

Leave it to Government to take our money in order to provide a carreer path for sexual deviants!

And that paradigm took what, 20 minutes to change on the morning of 9/11! "Lets Roll!"

I totaly agree with everything you said on both posts.

See my sig line and think DHS!!! What an absalute waste. The only thing this is good for is to turn our children into little sheep.

Be nice to up the revolution but those of us who see and understand that the "King has no clothes" are all going to be dead soon enough. But at least we will miss the final death throes of the Good 'Ol USA.

My idea.....sleeping gas. From his locked cockpit the oxygen masked pilot turns on the sleeping gas through out the pressurized cabin. Then steps out and shanks them with the plastic shiv while the co-pilot gives Salmo a pat down.

Hey, why ya' pickin' on me? I'm one of the good guys! Sleeping gas unnecessary. I'll be finished shankin' the bad guys before the pilot and co-pilot even know what's going on. Then when the plane lands, HS and TSA agents will come aboard and arrest me for manufacturing a weapon (plastic shiv) of sufficient destruction and offing paying passengers that had already been TSA screened and passed with flying colors. That's a crazy TSA world.

Just for The Toddster:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wv-34w8kGPM

Hey!! that would be profiling which, as we all know, is just not done.

A serious answer to your serious question:

I am a former TSA officer, my wife and brother are currently serving as officers.

Same sex searches are required by federal law.

There are gay officers. The problem is that the public doesn't much care for a gay person touching them either. I have seen women ask for a supv. because there are some butch lesbians at the airport. might be PC, but judging by the public's response, not okee dokee.

The procedure used was scaled back to make the public happy. it worked, folks became more at ease with a less invasive pat down.
Then along came the underwear bomber. he watched how things were done and put his explosive where they don't search anymore. he used the wrong material, and when he he detonated his device, it caught fire and burnned his junk. Kinda poetic really.
Now they are back to the original search parameters.

the procedure involves sliding the palm of the hand on the thigh up towards the groin. the palm never leaves the thigh, therefore no grabbing, groping, or fondling of anything can happen. same with women's breasts. Slide the hand under the breast, palm toward the body. I was trained to do this in an extreme case where a female TSO was not available, all TSO's have the same training.
Try the method on yourself, ya cant grab anything.

There are a few cases ongoing rite now where it wasn't done according to Hoyle. Those TSO's will be fired and maybe prosecuted and sued civiy. The gov't offers no legal protection for not following the SOP.( standard operating procedure)

There was a cross dressing TSO that was caught searching a 12 yr old girl. He-it still had his man junk. Mom saw him and went ape chit. There is a lawsuit pending against the gov't and the airlines.

AP, I think there are only a few choices:
1) Don't fly. This is a very common response.
2) Fly, and trust you don't get asked for the pat down or the back scatter machine. Gotta have a plan 3 or 4.
3) Go htrough the machine. Asked to go through the backscatter :I don't think the machine is much harm.
4) Asked to go through the backscatter, decline, and then get the "pat dowm." Your mileage may vary. I have not encountered this yet. I will submit to the pat down and inform them that I find it very humiliating ! do) and they should find it very humiliating as well.
5) I think we should start profiling.
6) I don't think the TSA folks drive this, but they go along.
7) Everything else, just can't talk about this.

So the quandry is, stay home or take alternate methods of transportation or simply roll over on your civil rights.

Terrorists are all about shock & awe. The chances of a terrorist blowing up a plane are low. However, blowing up a train, subway, or bus loaded with passengers is the more likely senario. keep in mind, when they took out the wold trade centers, they didn't blow up the planes, they seized control and flew them dierctly into them. NO BOMBS!!!

And TSA has how many screeners at these locations??????

LOL that's what dudes fantasize will happen, but the reality is you will be groped by a volunteer congressman showing the rest of the gang how to 'Git 'Er Done!

Last year on a trip, the TSA agent let a middle eastern guy through security with a giant, OPENED bottle of "cologne" of at least 16 oz through. Brown liquid, in an open container, was allowed on board on aircraft because he said "it is cologne" and that was GOOD ENOUGH for TSA. THere is very little consistency between airports either, despite what the regs say. Of course, I had to be patted down for that dangerous house key in my pocket I forgot about.........lord help the poor Irish nun who went in after us and was yanked aside for a groping.......