Not if you outlaw the use of 8 foot+ leaders when fishing terminal gear. Correct me if I'm wrong, but doesn't the effectiveness of flossing go away when "standard" sized leaders are used? (ex: 15"-36")

a leader not exceeding 5' would fix the floss problem and not be much of a problem for the sidedrifters.

I agree with FF02.

There could well be an appropriate time and place for meat market flosseries.

There probably is a legitimate place for terminal snaggeries. Not a bad way to rid our rivers of hatchery surpluses before they go black and are no longer fit to eat.

But if they are to be implemented, such free-for-alls MUST occur in another place and time separate from where bonafide angling takes place.

Angling involves tempting the intended quarry into willful take of the fly/lure/bait.

Snagging is just meat-hook harvest with rod/reel, plain and simple. There is no angling involved.... the two activities are mutually exclusive and should be managed as such.

Designate well defined snaggeries, set appropriate limits, and charge an extra $50 or $100 endorsement to participate. Great source of fund-raising for the agency.... helps to insure that ALL hatchery fish MUST die.... puts a protein source on the dinner plates of those who sign up to participate.

WIN WIN WIN

snooooreeeeee.

seriously. who cares. inside the mouth. leave it at that. who gives flying ballsack if they floss it up in the mouth. write them a ticket for snagging if they snag.. otherwise go CLEAN UP TIDEWATERS< SEINING<COMMERCIAL NETTING. fix the hatcheries, and get some real work done for my 60$ f***** license.

i floss. im damn good at it. i know how to fish, i know how my gear works under water and exactly how my presentation looks under the water. Any good drift fisherman will accidentalyl FLOSS a fish eventually. its just good drift fishing. your getting your gear down to to where the fish are at. Leader length makes it easier for sure. but ive flossed fish on a 24" leader in faster water.

do i floss all the time? nope. its last resort. But im not wasting 40$-120$ in gas, shuttle, and a day off to come home MEATLESS. sorry. if i plan on relesing fish, no i dont floss. considering that our fishing opportunities are getting cut, limits going down, restircitons left and right. i want my moneys worth. so suck it.

make it illegal. i have great attorneys. ill still do it. Or pay the fine. but it wont come to that. ill get out of it. because its bogus, and very hard to prove.

i think instead of focusing on somethign that makes very little impact on overall ecosystem health, we should focus on the other things that DO...like the puyallup system, sol duc hatchery program, netting schedules and over harvesting in the lower rivers by ALL colored people.

Is white a color?

Wow. Yet another side of the Merg we haven't seen. Only white people can fish? Not sure that would solve the snagging and over harvest problem.

Fish and live in Oregon and personally have wtnessed little of the flossing side of fishing.

Simply because I avoid those fisheries.

I have seen it and just kept moving. The flossers that find there way in to the area's that I fish dont last long there.

All that bieng said.....Oregon has a minimum leader length law of 18".

Why not just make a maximum leader length?

Merg, alway's enjoyed your posts. Think maybe you just crossed a line?

hahahah stone sober. just saying extreme stuff to prove a point. Who cares if people floss....when i see gill netters being able to net TONS of fish while guys floss one or two. that ANNNNDDDDDDD they get to keep wild fish in the salt chuck of rivers i cant retain ANY fish in. when the river in particular im talking about has been scientifically PROVEN to have NO ACTUAL wild fish. pssshhhhh its a croc. lets worry about stuff that matters...

i have pictures of wild steelhead that arent ALL THE WAY in the water too. GASP!!! OMG!!! i bet im the ONLY ONE that takes the hook out of the fish, holds it two seconds out of the water for a snapshot, and then releases it. THE ONLY ONE IN THE WORLD. im singlehandedly desemnating ALL the wild steelhead in the world by holding it 2" above the water......while the indians BY CATCH in the lower quillayute of wild steelhead IS THROUGH THE ROOF. suck it.

Gotta admit Merg has a point...there are dozens of issues out there that are having a much greater impact on our fisheries than flossing does.

So does this mean no more Sockeye fishing in AK?

Flossing reds in Alaska is the same thing.

Whenever I go to the Kenai, it cracks me up to watch people tote around tackle boxes full of every yarn color imaginable, trying to find that hot color the sockeye are "biting" on.

We're not talking about Alaska, we're talking about actual fishing, in an actual fishing zone.

No, there is not an "appropriate" time or place for it around here...allow the douchebags to do it in "hatchery zones", then they'll be doing it everywhere, whenever they have the chance.

Want to be a fuckin snagger? Go to Alaska. Go to California.

Stay off or our rivers here in Oregon and Washington.

Fish on...

Todd

I disagree.
I would never vote to legitimize snagging, anywhere.
Sets the wrong precedent and just imagine a whole generation of snag-weaned young anglers never learning how to fish.
And then there's the sub-culture of flossers. Another group that never learned how to fish.

When it comes to kicking the snaggers off our rivers, yes, I am an elitist.

Fish on...

Todd

P.S. After getting rid of them, my next campaign is to ban flyfishing

I need help on this matter please. The one week a year I get the opportunity to fish salmon, I am bottom bouncing. Sorry, it is my only chance to catch these magnificent fish and unless I catch many, I am miserable for the next 51 weeks. I catch and release the fish and it is rare that I damage the fish (the odd pink belly hooked - hard not to belly hook the odd pink sometimes when they are real thick)
I want to improve though. I don't want to be a flosser. I want to catch these fish legitimately.
I bottom bounce with a probably 30" - 40" leader, spin-n-glo and a 6" hootchie. Am I flossing? when I first started this, I was taught the approach as a way to anger chum salmon into attacking the hootchie. Very effective my first year and I have been hooked ever since. I have caught all species of salmon and a few steelhead with this method. For the most part, these fish are hooked inside the mouth. Sometimes I do hook them foul. Not intentionally. I am just not as good differentiating between a bite and maybe that was just a fish brushing against my line. I am getting better, but still have a long way to go.
I have seen the high and mighty fly fishermen floss, even though they don't admit it. They get the fly at the right depth and 'swing' it into the open mouth of the fish. I have seen bottom bouncers adjust the corkie so that it floats at that same correct depth to swing the offering into the open mouth. I have seen bobber fishermen do the same; get that depth exactly right. I have had veterans criticize my technique, because my offering is too big; I need to downsize to get that exact depth. Then I see the guy with the 8' leader and a big a$$ hook with yarn. OK, he is obviously doing something wrong.
So what is right here? Maybe max leader length is something that could be specified. I have seen different opinions on this thread between 24" and 5'. What is too long. With what I do, is that flossing or is that a legitimate method of bottom bouncing. I am trying to learn here. Not trying to peek your wrath and encourage your vengeance. Please help

BTW... Great topic Todd. You continue to be a great source of inspiration for me.

Dana, sounds like you're fishing to me...the snaggers know who they are, and what they are trying to do, just as the real fishermen know who they are, and what they are trying to do.

Carry on

Fish on...

Todd

Oh, and when you're getting advice from the snaggers because you "aren't doing it right"...I'd say you're probably doing it right

Fish on...

Todd