Check

 

Defiance Boats!

LURECHARGE!

THE PP OUTDOOR FORUMS

Kast Gear!

Power Pro Shimano Reels G Loomis Rods

  Willie boats! Puffballs!

 

Three Rivers Marine

 

 
Page 1 of 3 1 2 3 >
Topic Options
Rate This Topic
#790477 - 10/05/12 10:34 PM Room temp pellicle formation?
buggy Offline
Smolt

Registered: 02/12/11
Posts: 94
Been smoking salmon for years but recently tried Tom Nelson's recipe and was blown away.... Perfect balance of sweet/salt... THat said, I've always refrigerated fish after taking from the brine to form the pellicle... Nelson states he leaves his at room temp for 18 to 24 hours before smoking??? Am I just paranoid or is this totally safe? Inquiring mind wants to know if the room temp air dry is dangerous?

Top
#790479 - 10/05/12 10:42 PM Re: Room temp pellicle formation? [Re: buggy]
redhook
Unregistered


i air dry mine at room temp for 1-2 hours then smoke...

squaw candy, the REAL squaw candy, takes 20+ days to do, and theres no issue with it, leaving it outside next to a fire to dry and smoke, the recipe you are talking about should be OK.. start at 10 or 12 hours and see what you come up with...

Top
#790480 - 10/05/12 10:46 PM Re: Room temp pellicle formation? [Re: buggy]
TJN Offline
Spawner

Registered: 01/19/00
Posts: 577
Loc: Tulalip, Wa
I've never made anybody sick.

Full? Yes... but sick... Nope.

If you've ever been to central Alaska and have seen how the native Alaskans do it... 18 to 24 hours at room temp ain't a big deal with salt & sugar cured fish.

Happy smokin' Buggy!
_________________________
Every Saturday 6-9am on 710 ESPN Seattle
Check out podcasts, videos and blogs @ http://www.theoutdoorline.com

Top
#790483 - 10/05/12 11:06 PM Re: Room temp pellicle formation? [Re: TJN]
buggy Offline
Smolt

Registered: 02/12/11
Posts: 94
Good news!

Top
#790492 - 10/05/12 11:40 PM Re: Room temp pellicle formation? [Re: buggy]
Terry Roth Offline
Returning Adult

Registered: 07/13/12
Posts: 254
Loc: Vashon
I find that a pellicle forms in the smoker, I just take mine from the brine, pat dry with paper towels, and stick it in the smoker for 18-24hrs, depending on the thickness of the chunks...

Best I ever had was from a native woman from Homer, she cold smoked it for a week, the brine included Jim Beam and pineapple juice as the "secret" ingrdients. It weas a deep mahogany all the way thru, and ambrosial!
_________________________
Build a man a fire and he's warm for a night. Set a man on fire and he's warm for the rest of his life.

Top
#907334 - 09/25/14 02:27 PM Re: Room temp pellicle formation? [Re: Terry Roth]
fever Offline
Returning Adult

Registered: 04/07/06
Posts: 285
Loc: Bellingham, WA
Recently did a batch of fish and am done with short-changing (skipping) the pellicle forming process.

I tried putting the fish racks in the kitchen with the box fan blowing on them. Ran out of time, but it was working. After an hour, the fish was getting tacky, but not quite right. Smoked it anyway. This batch turned out better than my average albumen-streaked but tasty fish. I'm going for appearance now.

Letting racks of fish sit on the kitchen counter for 3-4 hours or more is problematic.

The garage has lots of work bench space (Clean...it has a 10' kitchen counter/sink like a kitchen). The problem there is the air is potentially polluted with dog hair or sawdust.

Outside, well....it rains. The easy-up shade thing is an option.

Wife informed me that the wall oven has a dehydrator function. Going to give it a try.

Curious how the rest of you have conquered the challenge of open-air drying.

Thanks,

Mike




Edited by fever (09/25/14 02:28 PM)

Top
#907342 - 09/25/14 02:40 PM Re: Room temp pellicle formation? [Re: fever]
fish4brains Offline
Dah Rivah Stinkah Pink Mastah

Registered: 08/23/06
Posts: 6228
Loc: zipper
I put it in the garage or on the covered back porch for a few hours. Quit doing the kitchen thing due to the garlic I put in the brine.
_________________________
...
Propping up an obsolete fishing industry at the expense of sound fisheries management is irresponsible. -Sg





Top
#907343 - 09/25/14 02:44 PM Re: Room temp pellicle formation? [Re: fever]
bob r Offline
Returning Adult

Registered: 04/17/13
Posts: 289
I do mine inside on the counter, two big chief racks at a time, I give the pellicle forming time for 4 to 6 hours at room temp., never had any issues after 35+ years. I smoke at a low temp. by adjusting voltage so my fish is preserved and smoked, not cooked. The salt brine is doing your preserving, the smoker is for flavor addition and more importantly, moisture removal. I'll rotate racks every 6 or 7 hours letting the water that is being accumulating on top of fish pour off by tilting during rotation. Amazing amount of moisture is pulled out by doing this. Good luck and good eating! Bob R

Top
#907361 - 09/25/14 03:55 PM Re: Room temp pellicle formation? [Re: bob r]
Rocket Red Offline
River Nutrients

Registered: 02/14/06
Posts: 2540
Loc: Elma
I do it in my shop fridge for 18+ hours usually about 24.

I wish I could use the kitchen counter, but my wife would freak, the shop counter is plenty big but the cats would attack it.

Pellicle is A1 important.

_________________________
WDFW - Turning outdoorsmen into golfers since 1994.

Top
#907364 - 09/25/14 04:50 PM Re: Room temp pellicle formation? [Re: Rocket Red]
eyeFISH Offline
Ornamental Rice Bowl

Registered: 11/24/03
Posts: 12440
Patience thru pellicle formation is KEY.

Not just for appearance, but for S-M-O-O-T-H internal texture in the final product.

If you like sawdust smoked fish, then it really doesn't matter.

It'll just look ugly AND taste bad.
_________________________
"Let every angler who loves to fish think what it would mean to him to find the fish were gone." (Zane Grey)

"If you don't kill them, they will spawn." (Carcassman)


The Keen Eye MD
Long Live the Kings!

Top
#907373 - 09/25/14 06:42 PM Re: Room temp pellicle formation? [Re: eyeFISH]
Castingpearls Offline
Repeat Spawner

Registered: 03/26/08
Posts: 1257
Loc: The Rock
I take it from brine and rinse then to the racks. I let sit overnight on the racks, in my smoker. Then smoke the next day.

Top
#907374 - 09/25/14 06:46 PM Re: Room temp pellicle formation? [Re: Castingpearls]
Sky-Guy Offline
The Tide is Changing

Registered: 08/31/00
Posts: 7134
Loc: Everett
I never do this and my smoked fish always turns out incredible. huh
_________________________
You know something bad is going to happen when you hear..."Hey, hold my beer and watch this"

Top
#907375 - 09/25/14 06:49 PM Re: Room temp pellicle formation? [Re: Castingpearls]
TJN Offline
Spawner

Registered: 01/19/00
Posts: 577
Loc: Tulalip, Wa
Originally Posted By: Castingpearls
I take it from brine and rinse then to the racks. I let sit overnight on the racks, in my smoker. Then smoke the next day.


Bingo!

Here is a link to the Recipe/process
_________________________
Every Saturday 6-9am on 710 ESPN Seattle
Check out podcasts, videos and blogs @ http://www.theoutdoorline.com

Top
#907376 - 09/25/14 06:50 PM Re: Room temp pellicle formation? [Re: Sky-Guy]
GutZ Offline
The Original Boat Ho

Registered: 02/08/00
Posts: 2948
Loc: Bellevue
I am 100% with Ryley. (6666 posts!) Never bothered with it. Seems unwise to leave food out like that. I will put my smoked fish up against any!
_________________________
It's good to have friends
It's better to have friends with boats
***GutZ***

Top
#907380 - 09/25/14 07:03 PM Re: Room temp pellicle formation? [Re: GutZ]
Us and Them Offline
Repeat Spawner

Registered: 10/20/10
Posts: 1279
Loc: Seattle
Too many variables too many different methods being used to say one person is right or wrong. A wet brine with a high heat smoke could start with a low moisture meat because the brine cured it. Someone else like less salt and the same process could yield a higher moisture content meat that needs to lose moisture before smoking. Every batch is different for me I use a dry brine and a low temp smoke . Some of the fish has to brine longer than other fish to yeilds the moisture content I like before I smoke. I like it real dry before it hits the smoker. So I brine for 4 to 5 days and dump moisture from the fish daily and rotate in the brine. Same for pepperoni , landjager and Salami and prosciutto's if I treated every batch the same I would get inconsistent results. I have to read the batch and make adjustments based on what I see. I do not cure any meat above 40 degrees that is universal.
_________________________
Once you go black you never go back

Top
#907385 - 09/25/14 07:39 PM Re: Room temp pellicle formation? [Re: Us and Them]
Myassisdragon Offline
Repeat Spawner

Registered: 07/07/14
Posts: 1143
Loc: The Wet Side
Well this thread has sure made the saliva percolate and with a few extra coho to cook up, to the smoker we'd like to go - One issue however

All of these fillets have been skinned*, and de-boned* before vacu-packing and freezing. Has anyone here tried smoking salmon with the skins removed first? I would imagine a few adjustments in brine as well as times for soaking and brining are needed?

thx
Md
_________________________
Hmmm

- "Wild steelhead were more numerous this year than they were in the 1970s" ( ITYOOL - 2015 )

- "It's past the time to "play nice", after all, they are pooching us royally."

D'uh!

Top
#907386 - 09/25/14 07:51 PM Re: Room temp pellicle formation? [Re: Myassisdragon]
Direct-Drive Offline
ExtenZe Field Tester

Registered: 11/10/09
Posts: 7867
Loc: Vancouver, WA
My smoker has plated, carbon steel racks.
If no skin present,and where the plating has worn, I will get carbon staining on the product.
Not the end of the world, but ugly.

I've never tried stainless steel racks...maybe that would help avoid the stain.

There are also smoking mats...like a synthetic mesh that might be the answer.

The best solution of course is to leave the skin on next time and smoke skin side down.
If your brine has a salty tendency, cut back on the salt or shorten the soak time.

Better yet, start using the "dry" brine method.
Here's one...
http://www.ifish.net/board/showthread.php?t=64066


The importance of establishing pellicle explained herein...
http://honest-food.net/2012/08/12/how-to-smoke-salmon-recipe/

Failing pellicle and temp control will yield cooked (not smoked) product, garnished with that fugly white curd (albumin).
Not fatal, but upper tier fugly.
_________________________
NO STEP ON SNEK

Top
#907387 - 09/25/14 08:00 PM Re: Room temp pellicle formation? [Re: Direct-Drive]
eyeFISH Offline
Ornamental Rice Bowl

Registered: 11/24/03
Posts: 12440
http://www.foodsafety.wisc.edu/assets/pdf_Files/smokingyourcatch.pdf

J F C, Ryley post up ASAP before something really bad happens.

In medicine, a bunch of bureaucratic pinheads got together and assigned a 5 digit code to every known human affliction (International Classification of Disease) For zhits and giggles, early in my medical school days I looked up the code for 666.66. It wasn't good.

Something along the lines of menometrorrhagia.... uncontrolled raging female bleeding from psycho-bitchiness or some such thing.

I'd post up quick, dude.
_________________________
"Let every angler who loves to fish think what it would mean to him to find the fish were gone." (Zane Grey)

"If you don't kill them, they will spawn." (Carcassman)


The Keen Eye MD
Long Live the Kings!

Top
#907388 - 09/25/14 08:02 PM Re: Room temp pellicle formation? [Re: eyeFISH]
eyeFISH Offline
Ornamental Rice Bowl

Registered: 11/24/03
Posts: 12440
And right next to it in the big book.... "Chimney Syndrome"

_________________________
"Let every angler who loves to fish think what it would mean to him to find the fish were gone." (Zane Grey)

"If you don't kill them, they will spawn." (Carcassman)


The Keen Eye MD
Long Live the Kings!

Top
#907392 - 09/25/14 08:04 PM Re: Room temp pellicle formation? [Re: Direct-Drive]
eyeFISH Offline
Ornamental Rice Bowl

Registered: 11/24/03
Posts: 12440
Originally Posted By: Direct-Drive



The importance of establishing pellicle explained herein...
http://honest-food.net/2012/08/12/how-to-smoke-salmon-recipe/

Failing pellicle and temp control will yield cooked (not smoked) product, garnished with that fugly white curd (albumin).
Not fatal, but upper tier fugly.


Yeah... what he said.

BUTT f'ugly and dry as saw dust.

Nuthin' a blindfold and a little K-Y or AstroGlide can't fix.
_________________________
"Let every angler who loves to fish think what it would mean to him to find the fish were gone." (Zane Grey)

"If you don't kill them, they will spawn." (Carcassman)


The Keen Eye MD
Long Live the Kings!

Top
Page 1 of 3 1 2 3 >

Search

Site Links
Home
Our Washington Fishing
Our Alaska Fishing
Reports
Rates
Contact Us
About Us
Recipes
Photos / Videos
Visit us on Facebook
Today's Birthdays
No Birthdays
Recent Gallery Pix
Gibbs Delta Time Capsule
Driftin'
Who's Online
1 registered (stonefish), 278 Guests and 3 Spiders online.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Newest Members
Sawcraft70, G rod, billfish3r, desert3, Crkr
11443 Registered Users
Top Posters
Todd 25100
Sol Duc 15648
Dan S. 15405
elparquito 13588
stam 12889
Salmo g. 12566
eyeFISH 12440
STRIKE ZONE 12107
Dogfish 10979
ParaLeaks 10513
Forum Stats
11443 Members
18 Forums
76889 Topics
897764 Posts

Max Online: 654 @ 11/04/19 10:57 AM

Join the PP forums.

It's quick, easy, and always free!

Working for the fish and our future fishing opportunities:

The Wild Steelhead Coalition

The Photo & Video Gallery. Nearly 1200 images from our fishing trips! Tips, techniques, live weight calculator & more in the Fishing Resource Center. The time is now to get prime dates for 2018 Olympic Peninsula Winter Steelhead , don't miss out!.

| HOME | ALASKA FISHING | WASHINGTON FISHING | RIVER REPORTS | FORUMS | FISHING RESOURCE CENTER | CHARTER RATES | CONTACT US | WHAT ABOUT BOB? | PHOTO & VIDEO GALLERY | LEARN ABOUT THE FISH | RECIPES | SITE HELP & FAQ |