I don't know if I would say people who work in the field of fisheries or fisheries biology have much of a clue what's going on. I don't know if there is truely one example where our management styles of natural resources has been a success in the long term.
Look around the globe, where ever humans have sought to exploit a natural resource for comercial purposes bad things result. WDFW has done no better than the rest of the world. You would have thought that since we had a few hundred years to learn from EUrope and the East Coast Atlantic Salmon we might have figured it out, unfortunately this is not the case.
People that go along with the program which is an obvious pathway to extinction just to get a retirement, nice cars and a house is not a good excuse.
Steelheadman
River Nutrients
Registered: 03/15/99
Posts: 4214
Loc: Poulsbo, WA,USA
Originally Posted By: eugene1
I feel really bad for you guys, if I lived in WA I would be going through the same thought process and withdrawals.
Maybe plan some get get away fishing trips?
Originally Posted By: Chasin' Baitman
I am beyond upset about it. I am literally losing sleep. I keep telling my wife I need to find another hobby...but it's just a joke. I've been obsessed with fishing since I was a kid. There's nothing else in this world that's going to replace it.
I do fish for fish other than salmon. I do bottomfish. I also like fishing for bass and even trout. When I'm doing those I certainly enjoy them...but the truth is I am doing it because I can't go salmon fishing that day.
I've actually thought about moving, but I really love where I live. When I'm allowed to fish, there's actually no place in the world I'd rather be.
My wife said she would never marry a fisherman. Ha Ha I rediscovered fishing with her dad but I can't/don't fish 24/7. Three weeks I'll be on the river after she goes on vacation to Cali to her sisters new second home. Going to order my Oregon license today. Fishing in PS may be a thing of the past the way things are going.
_________________________
I'd Rather Be Fishing for Summer Steelhead!
Things are going to get nasty over this, as this truely most likely is the end of many Coho stocks and the ultimate end of Puget sound salmon fishing. There is no recovery from this.
We watched for years, many participated in conservation/enhancement measures, watching all along massive comercial harvest and the few fish aloud to spawn managed on a thin margin.
Now we have environmental factors so significant, there is literally no abundance left to mitigate it, as we managed for zero abundance.
Folks seem to confuse what an agency does (NOAA/WDFW) with what the technical staff believes should be done.
Anybody who thinks natural resources are managed by the Best Available Science (whatever the **ck that is) are close to clueless. Decisions are made based on politics, law, treaties, inertia, whoever makes the biggest campaign contributions, and so on. Science is trotted out when it serves the purpose of leadershit.
For example, there are lots of bios in WDFW who believe that the current level of wild fish escapement is criminally small. And they tell this to their boss. But, policy prevails.
I know of many in WDFW who put careers on the line in defense of the resources/ecosystem, many who did lots of stuff on their own time and dime (professional publication, attend and present at professional meetings) and so on.
Society has to want to make the necessary changes but berating the staff for decisions made way above their pay grade doesn't help.
OceanSun
Repeat Spawner
Registered: 07/01/04
Posts: 1303
Loc: North Creek
Right or wrong, BU, at least Rich tries to lay out a logical argument with reasoning, even if flawed, behind his statements.
You, on the other hand, spend 90% of your posts throwing out nothing of value. Your contributions to threads are mostly diarrhea of the mouth full of nasty insults rather than discussing the issues. Your bitching would be OK if there was at least something of value to balance it out. It's a free-speech site so do as you like but you come across as an immature schoolchild in a cuss-word fight. Grow up.
_________________________
. . . and God said unto them, Be fruitful, and multiply, and have dominion over the fish of the sea . . .
Right or wrong, BU, at least Rich tries to lay out a logical argument with reasoning, even if flawed, behind his statements.
You, on the other hand, spend 90% of your posts throwing out nothing of value. Your contributions to threads are mostly diarrhea of the mouth full of nasty insults rather than discussing the issues. Your bitching would be OK if there was at least something of value to balance it out. It's a free-speech site so do as you like but you come across as an immature schoolchild in a cuss-word fight. Grow up.
On the other hand Salmo G, Carcassman ,Smalma and maybe some others have been patiently trying educate the RichGs of this site for fifteen + years to no avail. Minimal research done by the "box of rock" types would confirm everything the above mentioned experts say. IMO the dumb furcks deserve the cussing that BU dishes out.
That what they knew, preached and practiced helped screw stuff up real good? The proof is in the pudding..
Like I said riding a sinking ship just because that's what everybody else is doing is not a good enough reason.
People want to trust in them and continue to have faith in failed policies because it's easier to hand that responsibility off to someone else. Just because an individual is trained in the most widely accepted theories, practices and science has zero relation to it actually being correct and a good idea.
That what they knew, preached and practiced helped screw stuff up real good? The proof is in the pudding..
Like I said riding a sinking ship just because that's what everybody else is doing is not a good enough reason.
People want to trust in them and continue to have faith in failed policies because it's easier to hand that responsibility off to someone else. Just because an individual is trained in the most widely accepted theories, practices and science has zero relation to it actually being correct and a good idea.
Maybe you could gain a tiny increment of credibility if you responded to carcassmans post,which clearly explained the situation, with a rebuttal that made just a grain of sense instead of flinging your usual delusional nonsense my way.
[Bleeeeep!], the cup of ignorance in this thread overfloweth . . .
Rich, your posts read like they were written by someone dumber than a box of rocks. WDFW manages salmon the way they do because that is the law, as in WACs, from the state legislature. You want salmon managed differently, then you need to change the laws governing the managing of salmon. Further, the abundance of salmon is less the product of state management and more the result of habitat conditions, habitat that WDFW has very, very little authority to regulate. If you were half as sharp as you think you are, you'd already know this stuff.
Evo, thanks for being your usual sh!t fer brains self. FYI (better write this down for future reference) steelhead are rainbow trout, rainbow trout that migrate to and from salt water. They are one and the same species. There, remember that. Skamania is one stock of steelhead, a hatchery stock originally derived of Washougal and Wind River summer steelhead. Skamania is one of several steelhead stocks that have been transplanted to the Great Lakes. Others include Chambers Creek and Alsea winter runs. There may have been stocks from California transplanted there, too, but I haven't verified that. Because steelhead stocks have been planted in the GL they call the fish steelhead, but since the GL are freshwater and not saltwater, they would technically be adfluvial (lake run) rainbow trout, but nobody calls them that because, well, the eggs for the transplant came from actual steelhead.
What is it they say, better to remain silent and thought ignorant instead of speaking up and proving ignorance beyond any doubt.
You have been saying this [Bleeeeep!] since the beginning of this board.I used to look up to you.But however many years later I realized that this is the excuse you use to justify getting a retirement from the so called ignorant.Well it worked enjoy your retirement.
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